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 Post subject: 2018 - Hagen or Herbert?
PostPosted: Wed, Mar 14, 2018 6:36am 
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I saw some older posts related to this but I wanted to get a pulse for how users feel about the Herbert vs. the Hagen in 2018.

I’ve been researching these 2 and watching clips. While I don’t have a chance to try them in person, I feel pretty confident either one of these would be a great amp for me.

I’m not strictly a metal player, more of a rock and hard rock guy. I play a Les Paul with passive hot PAF style pickups and a PRS CU24 with 85/15s. I want that gut punching power like a dual Rec or uber but a little tighter and also great clean and crunch. But heavy for me is probably like Alter Bridge on “Isolation” or Linkin Park’s early stuff. Maybe Godsmack. I don’t need to play Lamb of God, etc.

I know the Herbert is the heavier sounding amp and the choice for true metal players, but is at least one of the Hagen’s channels close?

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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 14, 2018 8:39am 
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I sort of have the same profile in genres/tastes and was considering either the VH4 or Herbert. I'd determined earlier that the Hagen wasn't for me because I felt it was too modern/metal focused/brittle when I played it.

In the end I decided on the Herbert and couldn't be more confident with my choice. Channel 1 cleans are comparable to a JC-120, never heard such a "clean" clean channel before. Channel 2 is where I spend most of my days. - for all classic rock sounds, + side for all FAT (hard)rock riffs, channel 3 is for the most creamy solo's I've ever produced. Midcut isn't a feature I use at all.

If anything the Herbert has too many features for me to all use, BUT the ones I do use I don't have to make ANY compromises on. NONE.

Personally I think the clips of the Herbert that are online don't represent this amp well at all. Almost all of them have bad sound production value and all of them are too metal focused while this amp has such insane rock tunes. The channel 2 crunch sound is actually "chewy" as if you can bite in it. It's a weird metaphor but it's the only one I found that works for me to convey the fatness of the tone. It's thát good.


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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 14, 2018 12:58pm 
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Thanks, Skrin. I think the Herbert is probably a fantastic amp. But as silly as it probably sounds to the Diezel faithful, the idea of 180 watts and the 2 extra power tubes makes me hesitate. Extra expense when it’s time to retube, 2 more potential failure points, and I wouldn’t be able to use my 2x12 cab anymore without replacing the speakers (currently 120 watt capacity).

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PostPosted: Thu, Mar 15, 2018 4:05am 
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Phil M wrote:
Thanks, Skrin. I think the Herbert is probably a fantastic amp. But as silly as it probably sounds to the Diezel faithful, the idea of 180 watts and the 2 extra power tubes makes me hesitate. Extra expense when it’s time to retube, 2 more potential failure points, and I wouldn’t be able to use my 2x12 cab anymore without replacing the speakers (currently 120 watt capacity).
Just because it's 180w doesn't mean you have to or need to crank it. The extra wattage gives the amp more headroom...and as Peter himself stated in an earlier post: The Herbert doesn't need the power amp to work that hard for it to sound great. I've been using the Herbert in my home studio at almost whisper low volume with my daughter sleeping in the next room...and it still got fat tones. This is the only amp I've been using that can retain punchy tones at that low volume...and I've played a lot of different amps during my +25 years as a session guitarist.

Also check out the suggested settings in the Herbert manual, and you'll see the volume ain't that high set.


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PostPosted: Thu, Mar 15, 2018 4:53am 
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I’m not worried about it being too loudbecause it’s 180 watts.

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 16, 2018 3:01am 
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Phil, I have both and they each excel at their respective tones.
I agree with Skrin, Herbert’s channel 2 has LOTS to offer, and channel 3 is pretty amazing as well.
The great thing about Hagen is the openness and 4 channels. Like a VH4 yet with a different voice. I prefer the Hagen to the VH4 myself, however that’s purely personal taste...I’ve owned both and prefer the Hagen as a counterpart to Herbert.
You can’t go wrong with either choice, yet be careful or you’ll end up like me, with both :D

Best of luck

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 16, 2018 6:55am 
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GtarLover wrote:
Phil, I have both and they each excel at their respective tones.
I agree with Skrin, Herbert’s channel 2 has LOTS to offer, and channel 3 is pretty amazing as well.
The great thing about Hagen is the openness and 4 channels. Like a VH4 yet with a different voice. I prefer the Hagen to the VH4 myself, however that’s purely personal taste...I’ve owned both and prefer the Hagen as a counterpart to Herbert.
You can’t go wrong with either choice, yet be careful or you’ll end up like me, with both :D

Best of luck


Cool, thanks. I will make sure I only get one or the other! Ha

Do you feel like the Hagen’s channels 3 or 4 can cop the huge fat heavy tones of the Herbert, or are those unique to the Herbert?

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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 25, 2018 2:38pm 
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Phil M wrote:
Cool, thanks. I will make sure I only get one or the other! Ha

Do you feel like the Hagen’s channels 3 or 4 can cop the huge fat heavy tones of the Herbert, or are those unique to the Herbert?



Just playing around with Hagen today...JESUS, what an amp :rock:

As far as a comparison, that's difficult. Herbert's mid-cut feature is the unique thing here. A great feature and the adjustable intensity and level make it very useful. Thing about this is it's switchable, brilliant!! So you have 2 tones, on e with and one without.

Hagen can ABSOLUTELY cop the "fat tones" IMO. You just don't have the switchable mid-cut like Herbert has...you'd have to adjust the Mid's by hand.
Personally I really only use channel 4 as a lead channel, it's got GOBS of gain (my gain is set at about 10 O'clock on channel 4 for leads), where channel 3 also has a great gain range and that's where I go for "heavy" rhythm.
It is worth mentioning that the EQ controls on ALL Diezel's are seriously good, plus with the deep and presence controls on both of these amps, you have some WIDE tonal variety at your fingertips.

One difference between the 2 amps, Herbert does not have a gain control on channel 1. You weren't asking about that specifically, yet it is a significant difference on the Hagen, because it gives MORE tonal variance again. Ultra clean to more of the crunchy clean...nice.
Hope that's helpful.

Anyway, if you're going to get one, you will be stunned and completely happy with either amp.

Just an afterthought...speakers matter as well. You may want to look into Diezel cabs :thumbsup:

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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 28, 2018 6:26am 
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Thanks for the detailed response! You may have swung me back towards the Hagen.

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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 28, 2018 6:26am 
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Oops, double post :lol: :LOL:

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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 28, 2018 8:00am 
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I love my Herbert. It's dark and I love that Hifi tone that comes out of. It sounds very refined, and does great modern metal/metal core tones. I would love to try a Hagen, but that would lead me to impulsively buying it..which is something I need to avoid right now. haha.

I never played the Hagen, but if you want something raw and open sounding, I wouldn't get the Herbert. Maybe a VH4. Then again, I hear the Hagen is more raw, so it could be your best option.

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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 28, 2018 8:36am 
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Honestly, not trying to cause confusion, more giving some thoughts regarding the benefits of each amplifier. Herbert is just amazing, so if you’ve been leaning that way, no words can express how happy I have been with my Herbert. Just wanted to also offer you some insight regarding the Hagen as well.

Whichever way you go, you’ll have a Diezel, enough said...
Now start saving for your 2nd :lol: :LOL:

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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 28, 2018 10:33am 
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Where are the orders ? :lol: :LOL: :lol: :LOL: :lol: :LOL:


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PostPosted: Thu, Mar 29, 2018 7:28am 
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Peter Diezel wrote:
Where are the orders ? :lol: :LOL: :lol: :LOL: :lol: :LOL:


It’ll happen eventually. I think I’ve gone too far down this path to turn back. :rock:

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 30, 2018 6:03pm 
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I've got a D-Moll and a VH4. My bandmate has a Hagen. We tested them all side-by-side.

They're all amazing amps. The Hagen has a bit more of a aggressive sound in the high-mid's, the VH4 sounds smoother. The D-Moll is quite close to the Herbert as I remember it.

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