Bogner 4x12 vs Friendman 4x12

Moshaholic

Moshaholic

New member
I recently played a Friedman 4x12 with the two green backs on top and two V30's on the bottom with a Marshall JVM at GC

I was A/B'ing with a Bogner all V30 cab...

The Friedman cab was really smooth sounding compared to the Bogner with all V-30's...

I'm thinking it was not all just related to the speaker difference in the cabs.

I felt there was something else going on with the Friedman cab too that made it smooth, like design or maybe something else?

Anybody else compare or own both these cabs and have any thoughts or first hand experiences?
 
I know Friedman doesn't put the insulation in his cabs...pretty sure Bogner has it on the back panel.
 
I took the batting off of the rear panel of my Bogner Custom Shop 412ST cabinet which is loaded with 65w M75s and couldn't tell a difference.

I have had GB-RIs/V30s in both cabs and have had M75s in both cabs, driven by a BE-100.

To my ears, the Friedman cab (MDF back) sounds smoother and a tad quieter with M75s versus the Bogner 412ST.

The Bogner cab sounds a bit harsh with the GB/V30 mix, to me. The Bogner cab came with V30s in it. I hate V30 by themselves.

The Friedman cab sounds best to me with GB-RIs on top and V30s on the bottom, and the Bogner 412ST sounds best with the M75s in it driven by a BE-100. Both cabs with the aforementioned speakers sounded of equal volume to me.
 
I've compared thre Friedman cab and Bogner Unerkab (with V30s and 75s) back to back driven by a BE100 and the Feiedman did sound smoother with less fizz.
 
I've even noticed tonal differences when comparing two Bogner cabs side by side with the same speakers... only difference was one had salt and pepper grill cloth while the other was wheat grill. So that might be a factor to consider as well.
 
I think the real difference you're hearing is the Greenbacks. I've currently got two Greenbacks on top and 2 V30's on bottom in my Bogner cab. In the past I've had all Greenbacks, all Warehouse Veteran 30's, and a mix of Warehouse Veterans and V30's in an X pattern. Having the Greenbacks on top definitely smooths things out a lot.
 
Anyone compare these recently? I head a Bogner 4x12ST this weekend my with my Splawn and Slax with UK V30s on bottom and GBs on top and it was killer!
 
The last I heard the Friedman cabs are made in house, Bogner still has his old cab maker in Adelanto, CA (Victor) building his cabs for him. So unless something changed recently, they are not made by the same cab builders.
 
EVHpickdust":24vvobqj said:
I took the batting off of the rear panel of my Bogner Custom Shop 412ST cabinet which is loaded with 65w M75s and couldn't tell a difference.

I have had GB-RIs/V30s in both cabs and have had M75s in both cabs, driven by a BE-100.

To my ears, the Friedman cab (MDF back) sounds smoother and a tad quieter with M75s versus the Bogner 412ST.

The Bogner cab sounds a bit harsh with the GB/V30 mix, to me. The Bogner cab came with V30s in it. I hate V30 by themselves.

The Friedman cab sounds best to me with GB-RIs on top and V30s on the bottom, and the Bogner 412ST sounds best with the M75s in it driven by a BE-100. Both cabs with the aforementioned speakers sounded of equal volume to me.
Click to expand...

I thought I read Dave say his backs were not MDF... I could be wrong.
 
The Friedman has no mountings for casters
That may not make a difference to the sound of the cab, but it made me shout when moving it, and then caused my credit card to beep when I bought external wheels and mounting plates from Boogie
It's a cheap-ass move, not including casters, but then I was a cheap-ass in buying used, so we're even

The cab sounds great btw
 
It’s impossible to do a proper comparison with different speakers in each cabinet…
The only proper comparison would be to take the same speakers out of one cabinet and put them in the other cabinet and record both cabinets, obviously with the exact same mic placement.
 
Sick Squid":1xk1p9ya said:
The Friedman has no mountings for casters
That may not make a difference to the sound of the cab, but it made me shout when moving it, and then caused my credit card to beep when I bought external wheels and mounting plates from Boogie
It's a cheap-ass move, not including casters, but then I was a cheap-ass in buying used, so we're even

The cab sounds great btw
Click to expand...


I just went to Harbor Freight and got wheels for my Friedman 412 for like $10 total (The bigger blue ones). I know people will poo poo on that (bruh... you need Mesa or blah blah), but I have been using HF's wheels on my cabs for a couple decades (All my Marshall cabs have had them) and they last forever and are really smooth when rolling

FWIW, I noticed no sound difference with or without the wheels. Granted, our practice spot has concrete floors. Regardless, low end is not an issue with these cabs anyway.
 
atrox":2ipff1ug said:
Sick Squid":2ipff1ug said:
The Friedman has no mountings for casters
That may not make a difference to the sound of the cab, but it made me shout when moving it, and then caused my credit card to beep when I bought external wheels and mounting plates from Boogie
It's a cheap-ass move, not including casters, but then I was a cheap-ass in buying used, so we're even

The cab sounds great btw
Click to expand...


I just went to Harbor Freight and got wheels for my Friedman 412 for like $10 total (The bigger blue ones). I know people will poo poo on that (bruh... you need Mesa or blah blah), but I have been using HF's wheels on my cabs for a couple decades (All my Marshall cabs have had them) and they last forever and are really smooth when rolling

FWIW, I noticed no sound difference with or without the wheels. Granted, our practice spot has concrete floors. Regardless, low end is not an issue with these cabs anyway.
Click to expand...

1) Does the Friedman have a big, tight, punchy low end?

2) Are you saying there is no loss of that big, tight, punchy low end when it has casters?
 
Junk Yard Dog":1vuiu6l9 said:
atrox":1vuiu6l9 said:
Sick Squid":1vuiu6l9 said:
The Friedman has no mountings for casters
That may not make a difference to the sound of the cab, but it made me shout when moving it, and then caused my credit card to beep when I bought external wheels and mounting plates from Boogie
It's a cheap-ass move, not including casters, but then I was a cheap-ass in buying used, so we're even

The cab sounds great btw
Click to expand...


I just went to Harbor Freight and got wheels for my Friedman 412 for like $10 total (The bigger blue ones). I know people will poo poo on that (bruh... you need Mesa or blah blah), but I have been using HF's wheels on my cabs for a couple decades (All my Marshall cabs have had them) and they last forever and are really smooth when rolling

FWIW, I noticed no sound difference with or without the wheels. Granted, our practice spot has concrete floors. Regardless, low end is not an issue with these cabs anyway.
Click to expand...

1) Does the Friedman have a big, tight, punchy low end?

2) Are you saying there is no loss of that big, tight, punchy low end when it has casters?
Click to expand...

1) At least with my BE-100 and loaded with Creamback H75's it does

2) Again, we have concrete floors at my spot, so any extra low end from having the cab on the ground was negligible anyway
 
I have a Mesa Rectifier Traditional 4x12 as well as an Engl 412XXL, both with V30s. While they have similar characteristics, there are distinct differences between the two. I can't really put into words how they sound different besides I prefer the sound of the Engl. The wood type, density, thickness, the grill, etc. all have an impact on the sound for sure.
 
thrashinbatman":2bpswj3v said:
I have a Mesa Rectifier Traditional 4x12 as well as an Engl 412XXL, both with V30s. While they have similar characteristics, there are distinct differences between the two. I can't really put into words how they sound different besides I prefer the sound of the Engl. The wood type, density, thickness, the grill, etc. all have an impact on the sound for sure.
Click to expand...
Mesa V30s are made in England and a slightly different voice.
Both top marques, Mesa & Engl.
 
atrox":1unn05hp said:
I just went to Harbor Freight and got wheels for my Friedman 412 for like $10 total (The bigger blue ones). I know people will poo poo on that (bruh... you need Mesa or blah blah), but I have been using HF's wheels on my cabs for a couple decades (All my Marshall cabs have had them) and they last forever and are really smooth when rolling

FWIW, I noticed no sound difference with or without the wheels. Granted, our practice spot has concrete floors. Regardless, low end is not an issue with these cabs anyway.
Click to expand...
I am talking about removable wheels. I find a big difference in low end around a cab when on the floor compared to casters.
The Harbor Freight wheels are screwed into the cab, I think?
For big loads the cost of x4 Harbor Freight wheels that compare to the Mesa bigger set would be much greater, so the Mesa cost is pretty reasonable. Esp. for a cab costing so much, which is why they should include the usual push-in wheels and mounts.
Mesa do 2 sets, and the bigger wheels will take a whole heap of weight. I could have done without needing them.
 
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