KRUSE AMP / CAB SELECTOR

I

idnotbe

New member
from his facebook page,

" In regards to questions/comparison to the Ampete 88s Switcher :
My unit is not midi but half the price and it lets you select up to 4 cabs at a time (Ampete only 2), plus my unit allows to blend 2 amps at a time (Ampete only 1 amp)
Also I can customize the unit to your needs with more or fewer number of amps/cabs , plus an option to hook up an attenuator for all connected amps. "

http://www.krusekontrol.com/kruse_ampcabinet_switcher


uhm.... makes sense...

does anyone tried it?
especially, i wonder how to make no tone loss...?? and how does Ampete make no tone loss??
 
after quick search, i also found Kahayan AMP/SPEAKER Selector.

Kahayan 8x4 Amp/Speaker Selector $799
Kahayan 8x4 MIDI Amp/Speaker Selector $999

MIDI Amp/Speaker Selector looks almost identical to Ampete.
but cheaper ^^

according to Kahayan's manual, the core signal path is 100% passive (no buffer or sth like that) .

now i am suspicious... if Ampete uses sth magical to make the signal zero loss.
 
I assume all of these sound more or less equally clean, especially since this kind of 1-to-1 switching is pretty easy to get to sound good since there is no splitting going on. Otherwise you'd need some high quality buffering.
 
idnotbe":752mn5ft said:
after quick search, i also found Kahayan AMP/SPEAKER Selector.

Kahayan 8x4 Amp/Speaker Selector $799
Kahayan 8x4 MIDI Amp/Speaker Selector $999

MIDI Amp/Speaker Selector looks almost identical to Ampete.
but cheaper ^^

according to Kahayan's manual, the core signal path is 100% passive (no buffer or sth like that) .

now i am suspicious... if Ampete uses sth magical to make the signal zero loss.
Click to expand...
Ampette has a master loop and will incorporate the loop of any of the heads in addition to the master loop, all being midi switched or manually
Kahayan has no loops period.
Likely a big part of the cost difference. If you need the loop, there is no contest ;)
 
idnotbe":2sxldhy8 said:
after quick search, i also found Kahayan AMP/SPEAKER Selector.

Kahayan 8x4 Amp/Speaker Selector $799
Kahayan 8x4 MIDI Amp/Speaker Selector $999

MIDI Amp/Speaker Selector looks almost identical to Ampete.
but cheaper ^^

according to Kahayan's manual, the core signal path is 100% passive (no buffer or sth like that) .

now i am suspicious... if Ampete uses sth magical to make the signal zero loss.
Click to expand...
I've had an Ampete 444 here for about a month now, and it's one of the best purchases I've made in a long time. It works exactly as advertised and is completely transparent. It has a buffered and an un-buffered input, and plugging the guitar straight in, you need to use the buffered input to get the best signal.
Given how much circuitry is in these things, I'm not surprised a buffer is needed to maintain signal integrity. Depending on the complexity of the signal path in your rig, in many cases a passive solution is not the best choice. Don't get hung up on "buzzwords". Use what works.

There was a thread on here a while back about the Ampete stuff, and it got the thumbs up from Dave Friedman. That's all I needed to hear. I've never tried any of the other units you mention, but the impression I got from the other thread is that the Ampete is much higher quality than the Kahayan unit. And it has the loop that moves with the amp you select - total game changer right there.
The Kruze unit I'd never heard of until this thread.
 
fusedbrain":1l7rjx3j said:
I've had an Ampete 444 here for about a month now, and it's one of the best purchases I've made in a long time. It works exactly as advertised and is completely transparent. It has a buffered and an un-buffered input, and plugging the guitar straight in, you need to use the buffered input to get the best signal.
Given how much circuitry is in these things, I'm not surprised a buffer is needed to maintain signal integrity. Depending on the complexity of the signal path in your rig, in many cases a passive solution is not the best choice. Don't get hung up on "buzzwords". Use what works.

There was a thread on here a while back about the Ampete stuff, and it got the thumbs up from Dave Friedman. That's all I needed to hear. I've never tried any of the other units you mention, but the impression I got from the other thread is that the Ampete is much higher quality than the Kahayan unit. And it has the loop that moves with the amp you select - total game changer right there.
The Kruze unit I'd never heard of until this thread.
Click to expand...

just read Ampete 444 manual.
the buffer is for "the guitar input to amps" .
and no buffer for "amps to cabs" or "amps to the master fx loop" .

i think Kruse definitely has advantages... (no affiliation at all and never used his products)

1. the buffer for less tone loss is essentially a buffer pedal between the guitar and the switcher.
and the simple buffer pedal solution gives me the options among many buffer pedals.

2. MIDI and fancy LED are cool.
but the cons are... i need to connect another power cord for an essentially passive device.

3. i use Fryette Power Station II extensively.
i asked Ampete to modify the switcher to accommodate an attenuator.
Ampete said no.

KRUSE seems more flexible for the custom work.
Kahayan... i have no idea about their custom work.

4. if i can connect a PS2 with the switcher, i can simply have the master fx loop solution.
PS2 has the loop.
 
idnotbe":3tkcn4cr said:
fusedbrain":3tkcn4cr said:
I've had an Ampete 444 here for about a month now, and it's one of the best purchases I've made in a long time. It works exactly as advertised and is completely transparent. It has a buffered and an un-buffered input, and plugging the guitar straight in, you need to use the buffered input to get the best signal.
Given how much circuitry is in these things, I'm not surprised a buffer is needed to maintain signal integrity. Depending on the complexity of the signal path in your rig, in many cases a passive solution is not the best choice. Don't get hung up on "buzzwords". Use what works.

There was a thread on here a while back about the Ampete stuff, and it got the thumbs up from Dave Friedman. That's all I needed to hear. I've never tried any of the other units you mention, but the impression I got from the other thread is that the Ampete is much higher quality than the Kahayan unit. And it has the loop that moves with the amp you select - total game changer right there.
The Kruze unit I'd never heard of until this thread.
Click to expand...

just read Ampete 444 manual.
the buffer is for "the guitar input to amps" .
and no buffer for "amps to cabs" or "amps to the master fx loop" .

i think Kruse definitely has advantages... (no affiliation at all and never used his products)

1. the buffer for less tone loss is essentially a buffer pedal between the guitar and the switcher.
and the simple buffer pedal solution gives me the options among many buffer pedals.

2. MIDI and fancy LED are cool.
but the cons are... i need to connect another power cord for an essentially passive device.

3. i use Fryette Power Station II extensively.
i asked Ampete to modify the switcher to accommodate an attenuator.
Ampete said no.

KRUSE seems more flexible for the custom work.
Kahayan... i have no idea about their custom work.

4. if i can connect a PS2 with the switcher, i can simply have the master fx loop solution.
PS2 has the loop.
Click to expand...
1. Yes this is correct. With the amount of circuitry between the guitar, through the switcher, to the amp inputs, a buffer is required to maintain signal integrity. Ampete also has an un-buffered input if you choose to use other buffered pedal such as Klon type.

2. True, but midi functionality to switch amps and cabs with a button press may be an important feature for some people. Ampete will save presets of amp/cab combo's with FX loop state on or off, and responds to program change msgs. Agreed that if not required, then no need to pay for this feature.

3. If the Kruze unit can be modified to use an attenuator, then this is a significant plus for those that use Power Station etc..

4. Yes, but Ampete feature to turn loop on/off per preset via midi is cool. If you never intend to use midi to control the switcher, then again, no need to pay for this .

I have no affiliation with Ampete, and only replied to clarify how Ampete works for me.
I'm sure the Kruze switcher is a quality unit as Kruze has a very good reputation as an amp builder / modder. It appears that Kruze and Ampete are similar but have significantly different feature set. Which one to choose comes down to what features do you NEED to have.
 
That was me that started that Ampete thread awhile back, and like you, hearing Dave Friedman saying Ampete is the best was all I needed to hear also hehe... I too have the 444 and it is awesome, and the transparency is real. Having a shared loop between 4 heads and having the ability to turn that loop off with a push of a button is fricken cool. Couldn't be happier.
 
can i ask sth to the knowledgeable ppl?
i'd like to understand more about the selector before i made the purchasing decision.

1. splitting the guitar level signal (between guitar ~ amp input) into 2 amps

assuming the original guitar signal is 100, the split signals into 2 amps can be 50.
i also wonder how it can be 50 & 50, and not 70 & 30.

and are there possibility to degrade the signal quality just because of the signal splitting?

with these kind of concerns, does splitting the guitar signal need a special techknowledge?


2. splitting the speaker level signal (between amp output ~ cab) into 2 cabs

like the guitar signal, it seems divide the amp siginal level into the half.

and if one connect 2 cabs into 1 amp in parallel, the impedence selection of the amp should be considered.

the other related question is... some amps have 2 speaker outputs.
if i set the impedence selector of the amp at 16 ohms, is it ok to connect two 16 ohms cabs into the 2 speaker output holes?
 
idnotbe":1voos33k said:
can i ask sth to the knowledgeable ppl?
i'd like to understand more about the selector before i made the purchasing decision.

1. splitting the guitar level signal (between guitar ~ amp input) into 2 amps

assuming the original guitar signal is 100, the split signals into 2 amps can be 50.
i also wonder how it can be 50 & 50, and not 70 & 30.

and are there possibility to degrade the signal quality just because of the signal splitting?

with these kind of concerns, does splitting the guitar signal need a special techknowledge?


2. splitting the speaker level signal (between amp output ~ cab) into 2 cabs

like the guitar signal, it seems divide the amp siginal level into the half.

and if one connect 2 cabs into 1 amp in parallel, the impedence selection of the amp should be considered.

the other related question is... some amps have 2 speaker outputs.
if i set the impedence selector of the amp at 16 ohms, is it ok to connect two 16 ohms cabs into the 2 speaker output holes?
Click to expand...
1. Yes, splitting a guitar level signal needs "a special techknowledge". Low level/high impedance signals such as a guitar signal are difficult to deal with without signal loss. Hopefully, a designer can get the signal to be 100% to each amp. This is not easy to do, and can cost $$ for good design. This is the part of an amp spliter that will require the most technical considerations. It is also the reason why a buffer is used to reduce signal loss.

2. Splitting amp level signal is much easier, with far less worry about signal loss. Setting the amp to 16 ohms, and using the switcher to connect 2 x 16ohm cabs ( as I am doing with Ampete ) is not "technically" ideal, but an impedance mismatch of one "step" is not a huge concern, and going one step down ( amp set to 16ohms - 2 16ohm cabs = 8ohm load ) as in the case here, is much preferred to a mismatch one step up ( where amp is set to 8ohms with 16ohm connected load ). There is a technical note about this in the Ampete manual on the last pages.

In my case, all my cabs are 16ohm, and I set all amps to 16ohms, so i have no concerns about impedance issues. Problems could arise if your cabs are not all the same impedance.

Also, as I mentioned in the other thread, the amps that are not in use need to be protected with a load in order to avoid damage. I believe that an amp switcher should be selected for - 1. safety of connected amps, and - 2. integrity of guitar signal to connected amps. I do not believe this is an application where you would look to save $$. Quality of design and construction are of utmost importance.
 
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