W/D/W questions

SpiderWars

Well-known member
I'm slowly building a rack and unsure about power amp distribution and speakers. I could run the wet cabs wet/dry or just wet. Is your center dry signal your best cab and amp? Any tips on how to best setup amps and speakers is what I'm looking for. This is only for fun in Madison Square Living Room so I'm not moving it.
 
Well, for me, the cab I choose is based on which amp I'm using. But yeah, it's the best combination. For the wet sides, I usually use cabs that match each other. I always run dry through all three cabs, although I have the option of turning the dry off in at least the wet cabs, the dry cab, too, if I'm using an amp with an effects loop. I use one of the loops in the switcher to control whether or not the dry gets mixed in with the wet. If I'm sending the dry back to the return on the dry amp, I just split the dry signal that goes to the mixer after the loop. That way, I can turn it on or off.

Hope that helps somewhat. :) Just LMK if you'd like more specifics about any of the possibilities.
 
Cool, thanks! I was thinking having dry through all the cabs might sound more full and natural. I'm just getting started, I only have an MP1 and just got a Rivera Hammer 120 stereo tube amp, plus an old rackmount Chandler Tube Driver I've had since forever (not sure I'll even use that). Budget rack lol. Long way to go, but at least I've got plenty of cabs.
 
Dave L":23n5erp7 said:
That Rivera is one of the five best power amps ever made, congrats!
Sweet!

I had a heck of a time assessing the value of it. It is in exc cond and I traded my exc cond Mark IV combo (that I was into for about $550 and I robbed it of the Sylvanias). And there's been a Mk IV combo on local CL for a while asking $800...so I don't think I could get much more than that best case. What is an approx value of these?

EDIT: And there's a 'like new' PCM91 (blue) for $600 local. Reverb is so useless for assessing value anymore it seems.
 
I don´t really know about the value, all the old Riveras are largely forgotten by now and aren't worth a fraction of what they should be. 500-700 seems about right, I suppose, but it´s easily up there in quality with any VHT, Boogie or similar you could care to mention.
 
I agree, that Rivera is one heck of an amp!!

Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the PCM91 is mostly reverbs, at least judging from the preset lists. It's still a classic Lexicon and it's going to sound great. I've got a PCM81 and it's got everything that I could've hoped for. Sounds amazing!! I'm considering adding a Lexicon 300, which is another incredible unit. I also have a PCM92 and an MPX1. They both have their strengths and are good sounding units, but it's not the Lexicon sound that I'd been hearing for 30 years.

If you haven't yet, check out Italo's site for great demos of what some of this stuff can do.
http://www.italodeangelis.com/it/eventide_and_other_stuff/
 
SpiderWars":23m6mzd3 said:
I'm slowly building a rack and unsure about power amp distribution and speakers. I could run the wet cabs wet/dry or just wet. Is your center dry signal your best cab and amp? Any tips on how to best setup amps and speakers is what I'm looking for. This is only for fun in Madison Square Living Room so I'm not moving it.

Typically, I use 3 identical cabs Marshall 4x12's all w/ the same speakers G12-H30. The selected head (Up to 4, 1 at a time) feeds the middle dry cab, and I use a Mesa/Boogie Simul 395 Stereo Power Amp to power the wet cabs. The switching system configuration allows routing the Dry signal to the wet cabs.

 
Zachman":28waqmon said:
SpiderWars":28waqmon said:
I'm slowly building a rack and unsure about power amp distribution and speakers. I could run the wet cabs wet/dry or just wet. Is your center dry signal your best cab and amp? Any tips on how to best setup amps and speakers is what I'm looking for. This is only for fun in Madison Square Living Room so I'm not moving it.

Typically, I use 3 identical cabs Marshall 4x12's all w/ the same speakers G12-H30. The selected head (Up to 4, 1 at a time) feeds the middle dry cab, and I use a Mesa/Boogie Simul 395 Stereo Power Amp to power the wet cabs. The switching system configuration allows routing the Dry signal to the wet cabs.


Using the same speakers (speaker combo) in all 3 cabs is what I'm struggling with. When I had 3 412s side-by-side, one wet and one dry cab had the same speaker combo (Alnico Cream/CBH75) and the other wet cab had Scumback M75/H75. I sold that cab but kept the scumbacks. Now I plan to buy a 3rd wizard cab and I'm debating what to load it with. I like the idea of having the cabs loaded differently so when I play them on their own I have different options. One has all Alnico Cream, the other has all Fane F70. Was thinking CBH75 for the new cab, but maybe I get another quad of Fanes and make those the we cabs. I read somewhere the speakers in the wet cabs weren't really that important. it does sound good with the Fane/Alnico in a W/D set up.
 
mhenson42":3vudz3xg said:
Zachman":3vudz3xg said:
SpiderWars":3vudz3xg said:
I'm slowly building a rack and unsure about power amp distribution and speakers. I could run the wet cabs wet/dry or just wet. Is your center dry signal your best cab and amp? Any tips on how to best setup amps and speakers is what I'm looking for. This is only for fun in Madison Square Living Room so I'm not moving it.

Typically, I use 3 identical cabs Marshall 4x12's all w/ the same speakers G12-H30. The selected head (Up to 4, 1 at a time) feeds the middle dry cab, and I use a Mesa/Boogie Simul 395 Stereo Power Amp to power the wet cabs. The switching system configuration allows routing the Dry signal to the wet cabs.


Using the same speakers (speaker combo) in all 3 cabs is what I'm struggling with. When I had 3 412s side-by-side, one wet and one dry cab had the same speaker combo (Alnico Cream/CBH75) and the other wet cab had Scumback M75/H75. I sold that cab but kept the scumbacks. Now I plan to buy a 3rd wizard cab and I'm debating what to load it with. I like the idea of having the cabs loaded differently so when I play them on their own I have different options. One has all Alnico Cream, the other has all Fane F70. Was thinking CBH75 for the new cab, but maybe I get another quad of Fanes and make those the we cabs. I read somewhere the speakers in the wet cabs weren't really that important. it does sound good with the Fane/Alnico in a W/D set up.


I start w/ what amp/cab/speaker combination I prefer for the DRY sound, and then color to taste for the wet side. Some guys like something really transparent, while others prefer to blend something w/ a particular color or texture as a "Core" tone.
 
Good info, thanks! My 4x12 cabs are all different; 70s Marshall w/ 70s Greenbacks, mid-80s Marshall w/ vented G12T75s, and a 90s Mesa w/ V30s . I choose the cab based on the amp, I like Marshalls with the GB cab and Mesa Marks with the Mesa, etc. So I'll prob start with that and the remaining cabs will be the W/D.
 
Ive struggled with this myself - and where i have landed is if you are going to do full-on w/d/w, you should do at least the wet cabs identically...ideally all 3 identical but mostly the two wet cabs.

If youre going to do full-on stereo with fx, two matching cabs.

Everything will still work, of course, mixing different cabs/speakers...but as soon as you start thinking ‘oh since im gonna have multiple cabs, it would be cool to have different speaker options’ you are taking at least a little away from a ‘pure’ stereo image that is identical on both sides.

What i did was two matching cabs (for either the two wets or when running in stereo) - and im ok mixing in a different dry cab (same dimension cab but different speakers)....this gives me ‘true’, identical wet or stereo cabs if i want, while also mix and match options if i feel like texturing, layering, etc by mixing one dry and wet cab in stereo.

Just my .02 of whats worked for me
 
journeyman73":361u6gbc said:
Ive struggled with this myself - and where i have landed is if you are going to do full-on w/d/w, you should do at least the wet cabs identically...ideally all 3 identical but mostly the two wet cabs.

If youre going to do full-on stereo with fx, two matching cabs.

Everything will still work, of course, mixing different cabs/speakers...but as soon as you start thinking ‘oh since im gonna have multiple cabs, it would be cool to have different speaker options’ you are taking at least a little away from a ‘pure’ stereo image that is identical on both sides.

What i did was two matching cabs (for either the two wets or when running in stereo) - and im ok mixing in a different dry cab (same dimension cab but different speakers)....this gives me ‘true’, identical wet or stereo cabs if i want, while also mix and match options if i feel like texturing, layering, etc by mixing one dry and wet cab in stereo.

Just my .02 of whats worked for me
Cool, I don't need a reason to buy more cabs but it always helps! :thumbsup:
 
SpiderWars":2sxfbuz4 said:
Good info, thanks! My 4x12 cabs are all different; 70s Marshall w/ 70s Greenbacks, mid-80s Marshall w/ vented G12T75s, and a 90s Mesa w/ V30s . I choose the cab based on the amp, I like Marshalls with the GB cab and Mesa Marks with the Mesa, etc. So I'll prob start with that and the remaining cabs will be the W/D.

I typically have been using a Mesa/Boogie MKIII Coliseum Simul-Class head, a Cameron Atomica, a Fender Super Reverb (Head conversion), and a Marshall, VOX, or a Fuchs head in a multi-amp, w/d/w rig, w/ a Boogie Simul 395 powering the wet, and am now happy w/ the G12H-30's in the cabs for the Big Rig. They seem to play well w/ everything... At least imo. It does what I want. Funny, I have been playing mono w/ a single 4x12 Marshall cab w/ the Cameron Atomica and 3 Boss pedals recently, and it sounds great...--BUT, the Big Rig sounds better. LOL Having proven options is Best.

Best wishes on your tone journey. Enjoy the wild ride. :thumbsup:
 

Attachments

  • 318047_4847384938015_768264028_n.jpg
    318047_4847384938015_768264028_n.jpg
    58.7 KB · Views: 838
  • spamjam2010pics007.jpg
    spamjam2010pics007.jpg
    178.4 KB · Views: 832
  • zachschofield5-1.jpg~original.jpg
    zachschofield5-1.jpg~original.jpg
    37.9 KB · Views: 843
Zachman":khxyd42o said:
[…] a multi-amp, w/d/w rig, w/ a Boogie Simul 395 powering the wet [...]
Those Boogie 395s are BEASTS! I've got mine paired with a Studio Pre for stereo use, just a monstrous sound, and use just the 395 for W/D/W. :rock:
 
Gonna try and delve into this as well. Been messing with a simple stereo rig for awhile now and recently setup a super simple inexpensive w/d/w rig and it’s killer.
I have a small (12u) rolling rack with my Evh 50 watt set in it, and an old marshall 9040, 200 watt per side, stereo poweramp, split with a cheapo boss stereo chorus, so the Marshall is running the wet cabs, and the Evh is dry through a single cab. Sounds huge, very simple, and I have f$&k all in it money-wise.
I’ll try to take a short phone vid the next time I set it up. It’s rediculous, and half the shit was given to me or just picked up cheap as hell.
I’m actually trying to arrange an even smaller version using two pedal power amps, or a 1u isp poweramp to keep it light.
 
Just yesterday I finally got around to hooking up the C+ W/D/W with a super simple setup like yours mchn13. IIC+ into a Source Audio Nemesis pedal to split. IIC+ powers center and Hammer powers wet cabs. It does sound huge. I orig wanted bigger power amps like a 395 but I think 60W per channel (my IIC+ is 60W too) will be plenty for me.

But how do you guys arrange it such that you can use just one knob to adjust the overall volume of the whole rig? I don't really mind having to adjust several volumes and re-balance the whole rig everytime the volume needs adjustment but at gigs/rehearsals that seems like it might get old fast.
 
ChurchHill":1n2mft5v said:
Zachman":1n2mft5v said:
[…] a multi-amp, w/d/w rig, w/ a Boogie Simul 395 powering the wet [...]
Those Boogie 395s are BEASTS! I've got mine paired with a Studio Pre for stereo use, just a monstrous sound, and use just the 395 for W/D/W. :rock:

I LOVE this thing. They are nearly impossible to find anymore. :thumbsup:
 
SpiderWars":rmy39ush said:
Just yesterday I finally got around to hooking up the C+ W/D/W with a super simple setup like yours mchn13. IIC+ into a Source Audio Nemesis pedal to split. IIC+ powers center and Hammer powers wet cabs. It does sound huge. I orig wanted bigger power amps like a 395 but I think 60W per channel (my IIC+ is 60W too) will be plenty for me.

But how do you guys arrange it such that you can use just one knob to adjust the overall volume of the whole rig? I don't really mind having to adjust several volumes and re-balance the whole rig everytime the volume needs adjustment but at gigs/rehearsals that seems like it might get old fast.

In my case, I 1st adjust the volume of the Dry amp/cab to where I want it, then I blend in the Wet to taste using the volume of the Power Amp, and/or the main level knob feeding the input of the Power amp--on my line mixer. The signal feeding the Wet, is an adjustable Line OUT for each of the 4 amps via the amp selector, and I monitor the input level of the fx by monitoring the input LED's on my TC 1210.
 

Attachments

  • Picture041.jpg
    Picture041.jpg
    67.7 KB · Views: 735
  • IMAG0452.jpg
    IMAG0452.jpg
    150.8 KB · Views: 743
SpiderWars":et6nooec said:
Just yesterday I finally got around to hooking up the C+ W/D/W with a super simple setup like yours mchn13. IIC+ into a Source Audio Nemesis pedal to split. IIC+ powers center and Hammer powers wet cabs. It does sound huge. I orig wanted bigger power amps like a 395 but I think 60W per channel (my IIC+ is 60W too) will be plenty for me.

But how do you guys arrange it such that you can use just one knob to adjust the overall volume of the whole rig? I don't really mind having to adjust several volumes and re-balance the whole rig everytime the volume needs adjustment but at gigs/rehearsals that seems like it might get old fast.

In my case the Evh has a preamp out, as well as an effects loop, so my amps master volume controls the overall volume. My marshall poweramp is an old ass 200w x 200w solid state, that doesn’t even have a volume knob (but has stereo ins, and can run up to four cabs!)
 
Back
Top