Educate me on wet/dry setup and what it will do to my tone

Marshallman

Active member
Hey guys -

been looking to get a bigger sound on stage. I've heard about wet/dry rigs but have no clue how to set that up. Anyone of you have experience with this? This would be for my Egnater Renegade head. :confused:
 
If you're looking for a big sound and stereo effects, a wet/dry/wet rig is the way to go.

Basically, you'll need a separate power amp, 2 or 3 cabs (wet/dry, or wet/dry/wet), and a ISO box (unless your amp has a slave out, ala Mesa). Running a rack mounted effects unit is also preferred, but pedals can be incorporated. Either a tube or solid state power amp can be used. Solid State power amps are good in this situation if you want to preserve your current tone without any more coloration. The tube option is great as well, but it will color your tone, which can be good or bad.

This type of set-up is preferred in a one guitar band. Gives you that "big" sound that can be lost when only having one player on stage. It gets a bit busy with multiple guitar players on stage IMO.
 
The basic signal chain would be..

Guitar->Pedals out front->Amp->Amp out to dry cab
Amp ->Line Out->Effects in loop->External Power Amp->Wet Cab(s)

Using the Line Out of your amp will work, but it only sends the pre-amplified signal. Using an ISO box like the Suhr ISO Box will allow you to send your complete tone to the wet side of the rig. There are cheaper alternatives to the Suhr box, but it's the standard for this kind of set-up as far as I know.

Also, if you run an effects processor, make sure to set it to KillDry.

As far as cabs goes, using 2 2x12's or 1x12's for the wet side along with a 4x12 for the dry will work well. You can also wire your cabs in stereo and use each side like a separate cab. Also, some people like to have a bit of the wet signal mixed in with the dry side. Can do that with a mixer of some sort, such as the Suhr Mini-Mix.
 
Lord Toneking":1m4sbbr9 said:
I am doing this within the next week. Just waiting on my other cab to arrive
Oh yeah, I just remembered that thread you posted where Zack and I answered a few questions for you. Very cool man, I can't wait to hear the results. I hope you dig it :rock: Let me know how it sounds! If you've got any questions, send me a PM. I can't say I know nearly as much as Zack, but I'll try to help :thumbsup:
 
CaseyCor":20gcjkyt said:
Lord Toneking":20gcjkyt said:
I am doing this within the next week. Just waiting on my other cab to arrive
Oh yeah, I just remembered that thread you posted where Zack and I answered a few questions for you. Very cool man, I can't wait to hear the results. I hope you dig it :rock: Let me know how it sounds! If you've got any questions, send me a PM. I can't say I know nearly as much as Zack, but I'll try to help :thumbsup:
Yes Im almost there. Sold my 4 space rack for a 6 space to accomodate the power amp, got my Suhr ISO box on its way from sah5150, and now my cab should be coming this week...but now I have issues with the speakers

also, Im gonna try to leave my delay setting alone and not switch to Killdry. Hopefully they will sound good because I really dont want to have to dig in the G Major and re-vamp my delay settings

Im sure you'll be getting pm's from me :D ;)

Thanks!
 
This is the way to go. Sound you will get is amazing! I just bought a RJM line mixer to mix in some dry and it sounds huge. For home use this is GREAT, but I would not want to cart all this shit to a gig. As for your wet cabs check out the Bogner cubes they sound and work great. Its really hard to get away from this once your used to the tone your getting.
 
I have been running wet dry lately though differently than most while waiting to buy a third cabinet.

I am using an rjm y not to split the guitar and send it to two different amps. One with effects and one dry. This way I also double up on the harmonics created by using two amp and have a more complex tone. Less to mic also in a live setting, many local venues would laugh at three channels for a single guitar.

Most people try to use a post power amp signal from an iso box to maintain the tone being created by the amp. As most tube power amps color the sound id say only a full frequency solid state power amp or a full range atomic power block amp are the only power amps that truly fit the bill. I think they actually fall short of the final intended result.

In the end ill take it even further though in not sure how yet. I'll either add a third amp and cabinet having two wet amp and one dry. I might get two of the atomic power blocks and iso boxes and run two more cabs for dry /wet /dry/ wet as left and right pairs. Maybe go to full excess and use four amp heads that way with two 4x12's top two speakers in each the dry from two of the amps and the bottoms the two wet amps left and right.

The possibilities are endless. :rock:
 
moltenmetalburn":199lz1ww said:
I have been running wet dry lately though differently than most while waiting to buy a third cabinet.

I am using an rjm y not to split the guitar and send it to two different amps. One with effects and one dry. This way I also double up on the harmonics created by using two amp and have a more complex tone. Less to mic also in a live setting, many local venues would laugh at three channels for a single guitar.

Most people try to use a post power amp signal from an iso box to maintain the tone being created by the amp. As most tube power amps color the sound id say only a full frequency solid state power amp or a full range atomic power block amp are the only power amps that truly fit the bill. I think they actually fall short of the final intended result.

In the end ill take it even further though in not sure how yet. I'll either add a third amp and cabinet having two wet amp and one dry. I might get two of the atomic power blocks and iso boxes and run two more cabs for dry /wet /dry/ wet as left and right pairs. Maybe go to full excess and use four amp heads that way with two 4x12's top two speakers in each the dry from two of the amps and the bottoms the two wet amps left and right.

The possibilities are endless. :rock:

LOL-- there's no turning back now.

Next thing you know, you'll be using one of these:

caeampselector2.jpg


caeswitcher001.jpg


Picture040-1.jpg


caeampselector4rear.jpg


caeampselector3.jpg


"Version 1" style, which allows selection of up to 4 Tube amplifiers, and connects the amps to a common load speaker cabinet. Unused amps are protected, and of course, only one amp is allowed active at a time. Line Level output (rear panel) is also available (with Level Control) to allow for a "wet/dry" effects setup. A rear panel tuner output is also provided, and is active even when no amps are selected. All amp sends are transformer isolated to prevent ground loop hum. This unit is midi controlled (via Program Change Commands) and comes with a dedicated 4 switch Midi Foot Controller, and 20ft 4 pin xlr connection cable! As a bonus, the amp selector (via the footswitch) outputs the same program change commands to control effects processors, if necessary. This is unit is part of the Custom Series, and is hand built to order by Bob Bradshaw, and is available direct from CAE only!

Features Include

* Safely and silently switch up to 4 amplifiers into the same cabinet or load device!
* Unique priority circuit only allows 1 amp on at a time!
* Protection circuitry safely guards unselected amps.
* Front panel LED's indicate status of each amp.
* Super low noise buffer circuit provides impedance matching and drives isolation transformers used to eliminate ground loop hum.
* Remote controlled via midi program changes from the included footswitch.
* Remote power supply for lowest noise.
* 2 auxiliary line outputs. Useful for driving effects and external power amps with the selected amp.
* Sonically transparent passive switching elements provide unsurpassed clarity while uniquely switching up to four amplifiers (one at a time) into a common speaker system or load device.
* Easily allows for the popular system configuration of a center dry cabinet with stereo effects cabinets (a stereo power amp and effects would be required). See diagram.
* Provides a line out signal for the selected amp regardless type. No need to modify amps for line outs and effects loops. Even non-master volume amps work fine!!
* Eliminates the need for multiple speaker cabinets and/or load devices when using multiple amps.
 
I did a fairly simple one where I ran the effects loop send of my amp into a delay, then fed the delay into the effects loop return of a 1x12 combo amp... effectively making a wet/dry rig with the combo being wet.

It works really well. I got the added 'space' of a delay whilst maintaining the immediacy of an unaffected dry tone, and using a combo amp meant I didn't require a whole lot of extra outboard gear beyond using a combo. I preferred the results when using the delay in killdry mode, so all the combo was doing was amplifying repeats.
 
some dude":vyjnr7i8 said:
I did a fairly simple one where I ran the effects loop send of my amp into a delay, then fed the delay into the effects loop return of a 1x12 combo amp... effectively making a wet/dry rig with the combo being wet.

It works really well. I got the added 'space' of a delay whilst maintaining the immediacy of an unaffected dry tone, and using a combo amp meant I didn't require a whole lot of extra outboard gear beyond using a combo. I preferred the results when using the delay in killdry mode, so all the combo was doing was amplifying repeats.

Good for you, that you are adventurous. THAT is how you uncover hidden secrets, and gain experience and a deeper understanding of not only how-- but WHY..... That can't be gained from reading articles and reviews. :yes: :thumbsup: :rock:
 
Zachman":2ea1bjmu said:
Good for you, that you are adventurous. THAT is how you uncover hidden secrets, and gain experience and a deeper understanding of not only how-- but WHY..... That can't be gained from reading articles and reviews. :yes: :thumbsup: :rock:

Yeah... I normally try to limit myself, which is pretty easy as I prefer a dry signal.... but, my current band (in the rehearsal stage) is looking more and more like it's going to be a 3 piece instead of a 4 piece, so I'm considering options that I normally wouldn't consider if there were a second guitarist. Wet/dry kind of kills two birds with one stone as it lets me keep my signal dry, like I prefer, but fills out more space.

I like the combo option as it's easily scalable... it's literally just unplugging a cable from the effects loop return of my main amp and plugging it into the effects loop return of the combo, so it's dead simple to pull off.
 
some dude":1d2b81ex said:
Zachman":1d2b81ex said:
Good for you, that you are adventurous. THAT is how you uncover hidden secrets, and gain experience and a deeper understanding of not only how-- but WHY..... That can't be gained from reading articles and reviews. :yes: :thumbsup: :rock:

Yeah... I normally try to limit myself, which is pretty easy as I prefer a dry signal.... but, my current band (in the rehearsal stage) is looking more and more like it's going to be a 3 piece instead of a 4 piece, so I'm considering options that I normally wouldn't consider if there were a second guitarist. Wet/dry kind of kills two birds with one stone as it lets me keep my signal dry, like I prefer, but fills out more space.

I like the combo option as it's easily scalable... it's literally just unplugging a cable from the effects loop return of my main amp and plugging it into the effects loop return of the combo, so it's dead simple to pull off.

The trick is using the gear appropriately... I had a guy ask me once, out of sarcasm, If I needed all my stuff just to sound like I wasn't using so much stuff-- and the truth is YES.... He understood when I turned off all the stuff I had running-- leaving only the dry tone, and he looked at me and said, "Wow... I get it now".

Production and Engineering are separate arts than performing, writing, or playing well.
 
Just put all mine together at my buddy's house! What a HUGE difference!! It's like playing guitar in high definition! :rock:

All I need to make a few custom length cables and I'll be all set. I cant wait to hear it through my Splawn cabs :yes:

here's a crappy cell phone pic...
5konwh.jpg


thanks Zach and friends for your help :thumbsup:
 
Lord Toneking":2vy0t5hc said:
Just put all mine together at my buddy's house! What a HUGE difference!! It's like playing guitar in high definition! :rock:

All I need to make a few custom length cables and I'll be all set. I cant wait to hear it through my Splawn cabs :yes:

here's a crappy cell phone pic...
5konwh.jpg


thanks Zach and friends for your help :thumbsup:

Heehehehe .... TOLD YA you'd dig it.... New perspective on BIG tone huh.....:rawk: Welcome to the outer limits... :LOL: :LOL:

Anytime LTK-- Enjoy the ride, it is a total BLAST
 
Lord Toneking":3v0pk396 said:
CaseyCor":3v0pk396 said:
Awesome LTK, I knew you'd dig it. What are you using for the wet side power amp?
Thanks man! Its gonna be hard to go back :yes:

Im using an Alesis RA-100

It'll get to a point that you'll get really good at discerning exactly what you need/want for the job at hand, and the gear selections (because they'll be the right ones) will end up not leaving you wanting... too much ;)
 
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