Metal, Standard tuning and Torpedo

Deltones

New member
I've had my VB-101 for a couple of years, mostly using it with my Redwirez IRs. One thing I noticed when watching metal demos of the Torpedo on youtube is that the vast majority of users are always downtuned. I think I have yet to see a video where the guy is using standard tuning.

The reason I mention this is because standard tuning with heavier sound on the Torpedo does not sound particularly good, no matter the native cab selected. Hence the use of the Redwirez IRs. To me, the Torpedo cabs sound overly fizzy, and extremely boxy. I thought the native cabs would be improved with V3, but no.

To get a remotely useable heavy sound in standard tuning, I have to remove at least 12db at 6k and take a chunk out of 360hz in the eq section.

If you tried to play heavy with your Torpedo in standard tuning, what's your opinion of the native cabs? If you haven't tried, have a go at it. I'm interested in your take on the subject.
 
It's always easier when there is an example.

Here's a short clip I just made. First pass is with a Redwirez IR loaded into my user space in the Torpedo. Second pass is the native cab. The Redwirez cab is a Hiwatt cab, Beyerdynamic 160, 4 inches, Cone. The Torpedo cab is the 2x12 Watt FanC, Rbn 160, 5%, 5% (Distance, Center).

No additionnal EQ in both cases.
 

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guillaume_pille":uvfo38rl said:
If you prefer V scooped sound and darker tones, maybe try more than 5% off center, R121 and 4x12 cabinets. ;)

Guillaume, run an instance of Voxengo SPAN on any of your cabs in standard tuning with a heavy sound and check out the results. The amount of stuff you get over 5k is enormous. As for moving more than 5% away from center, it's going to add to the boxiness. As I said, I've had my VB-101 for a while, I ran quite a few tests with it.

I'm sure you listened to the samples I posted. Hiwatt cab VS Hiwatt cab and yet, the difference is massive in harshness and boxiness between the two.

Make no mistake though. The Torpedo is one of the best piece of gear I've bought. It's great to be back with my amp. I just would like to use the native cabs more :D
 
Try something: switch off the Loadbox Compensation (in the Setup menu) and see what happens.

Too bad nobody comments here, I guess this is a matter of choice/taste. In a mix, I couldn't work with the first part of the sample (hard to make in work next to a bass and drum track).

Hiwatt cab VS Hiwatt cab and yet, the difference is massive in harshness and boxiness between the two.

Actually, you are not comparing two Hiwatt cabinets: you're comparing two totally different recording environment, not just the cabinets which are obviously different as well.

That is why I suggested to work with a different configuration to achieve the sound you like. ;)

On a side note, when using huge gain level on the amp, whatever the tuning of the guitar, you will get a TON of high order harmonics. If the speaker let them pass, in standard or low tuning, you will hear them.

Maybe you should try the new Capture Masters cabinet, you can listen to them directly from the Remote in La Boutique Interface. Different mikes, different measurement method, maybe you'll prefer these ones!
 
I think you need to start with all 12 o'clock settings and standard Torpedo cab and mike.
I recommend you to start with Angl VintC and Ribbon 160 mike. That will rid off some his from your sound.
You don't really need to use EQ section. In 99% on cases just the right settings on your amp will work well.
I use Torpedo Live from the first run released till now and never need to use side IRs!
I'm doing a lot of mix/master jobs and a LOT of reamping!
There was no such situation than I can't do a descent sound with my Torpedo Live. And there are lot of standard tunings I've done with it.
Just start from new blank settings :)
 
That's really weird that it is so bright for you...I had to ADD some 2k and 6k to a recent demo I did using the WoS III. I used the Cali Std 412 with the 160 for the rhythm tones and I was really pleased with the results. Presumably software is software (Guillaume?) so the sound should be pretty close as if I used a VB-101 or a Live...of course depending on the amplifier or preamp used.
 
I had to ADD some 2k and 6k to a recent demo I did using the WoS III. I used the Cali Std 412 with the 160 for the rhythm tones and I was really pleased with the results.

Adding some 2K and 6K to a ribbon microphone makes absolute sense to me.

And the soft in VB-101, Studio and WoS III are 99% identical. Of course, depending on the source (an amp + loadbox, a preamp, an amp modeling solution) the sound can vary, a lot. Not the sound of the Torpedo process which is identical whatever the source, but the final sound.
 
guillaume_pille":3miwppub said:
Try something: switch off the Loadbox Compensation (in the Setup menu) and see what happens.

Sure, I'll try this and report back later on the result.
 
killertone":1ubsmd5l said:
That's really weird that it is so bright for you...I had to ADD some 2k and 6k to a recent demo I did using the WoS III. I used the Cali Std 412 with the 160 for the rhythm tones and I was really pleased with the results. Presumably software is software (Guillaume?) so the sound should be pretty close as if I used a VB-101 or a Live...of course depending on the amplifier or preamp used.

Ok, now I have to say I'm really surprised about that one. Add a little 2k for a little more presence? Sure, why not. But add more 6k? I'd really like to hear your before and after sound on that one, if you can.
 
The Ribbon mics we use tend to sound a little dark (with the preamps we are using to capture cabinets, it's possible with a preamp with variable input impedance to correct that).

So adding 2k for presence and 6k to add some air doesn't shock me. I would rather use another mic or cabinet and keep the ribbon as a side microphone to add a little something, with a dynamic or static to do the main sound.
 
Personally I using several 4x12 cabs (Kerozen, AnglC, etc.) with U87 mice and it works perfect for any amp I record or reamp!
May need to use high-pass and low-pass filters to remove some hiss and muds depending the Amp.
But the main thing is to deal your amp correctly!
Just do it with your ears not with your eyes and forget about your usual settings with your cab that you use on rehearsals!
that will helps for sure :)
 
Alright then Guillaume. I tested the Load Compensation at "Off" like you suggested. It fixed the harshness problem. Jeebus, I've had this box for 2 years and never thought of checking this option. I'll have to look at the documentation again to see what this option does. The solution probably stared at me all this time and I never saw it. I should have joined this forum 2 years ago!

In any case, thanks to all who replied with suggestions. Looks like I have a brand new piece of gear now.
 
Well, that's good news.

The VB-101 features a resistive loadbox, and that kind of loadbox tends to lower the high frequencies.

The load compensation is a kind of filter that will compensate for that loss.

By switching it OFF, you get the true sound of the loadbox, that most people find too dark. But if that works for you like that, go for it!! :rock:
 
guillaume_pille":1pg5hrq5 said:
Well, that's good news.

The VB-101 features a resistive loadbox, and that kind of loadbox tends to lower the high frequencies.

The load compensation is a kind of filter that will compensate for that loss.

By switching it OFF, you get the true sound of the loadbox, that most people find too dark. But if that works for you like that, go for it!! :rock:

Interesting. You say that most people find the sound too dark without the load compensation option. To me, with the option at OFF, the result I get is a lot closer to the sound I hear on a record. Well, at least, records made before 2000. I'm not a fan of the overly bright productions of today, but at this point, it's really a question of personal preferences.

And as you say, good news indeed.
 
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