Torpedo Reload connectivity/DI Level

slash57

Member
Hi,

Question as I'm still deciding if I need the Reload or the Live -
Does the Loadbox output of the Reload go into the mic input or the line input?
As I only have two good preamps on my RME UCX it'd be awesome if
it was line level, but the 600 Ohm suggest to me it's intended to be connected to the mic pre.

In the manual it also says if the DI signal from the guitar is too loud, it should simply be connected to the line in.
How loud do the pickups have to be to overload a mic in? I use a ToneZone and a SH-6 Distortion in my guitars.

Lastly, has anyone compared the Rivera Rockcrusher as a Loadbox to the Torpedo units and has some soundfiles maybe?
I feel I'm loosing a lot of highs with the Rockcrusher and I'm scared it will be the same for the Reload.
I A/B'd the sound with my cab attached compared to the sound with only the Rockcrusher attached.
Should I just fix this with EQs or are the Two Notes Loadboxes that much better?

Does anyone have a comparison of soundfiles with the Torpedo Live, once with a cab attached to the thru on the Live and once with the integrated Loadbox? I'd very much appreciate it! :)

Sorry for the many questions, still very unsure what to do. And I can't simply order the units and send it back if it doesn't sound better.

Thank you!
Cheers,
Tony.
 
I have the Reload and the DI signal from the Reload to my interface is hotter thank if I were just to plug my guitar straight into the interface. I use active pickups and on the interface I had it is set to line level and a pad. The signal clipped only when I struck the strings real aggressively, but for the most part the level stayed in the safe zone.
 
Does the Loadbox output of the Reload go into the mic input or the line input?
=> It could go either way. The level at this output is totally dependand on the output power of your amp, which can vary by huge amounts, so it's hard to say the exact level there. But it's usually on the hot side, so it usually works perfectly on a line input.

In the manual it also says if the DI signal from the guitar is too loud, it should simply be connected to the line in.
How loud do the pickups have to be to overload a mic in? I use a ToneZone and a SH-6 Distortion in my guitars.
=> Hard to give a precise answer here, it depends on the guitar and the mic preamp... If your mic preamp has a pad, you probably will be able to use it without overload.

Lastly, has anyone compared the Rivera Rockcrusher as a Loadbox to the Torpedo units and has some soundfiles maybe?
I feel I'm loosing a lot of highs with the Rockcrusher and I'm scared it will be the same for the Reload.
I A/B'd the sound with my cab attached compared to the sound with only the Rockcrusher attached.
Should I just fix this with EQs or are the Two Notes Loadboxes that much better?
=> The Reload is a Reactive-Active Attenuator, which is a totally different approach, and yes, we believe it's that much better ! The amplifier sees just a loadbox, which is an impedance very close to a real loudspeaker. So it reacts the same as usual. The loudspeaker is driven by a very low impedance, totally transparent amplifier, which means a total respect of your sound. All this plays a role in a fully transparent attenuation without treble loss.

Does anyone have a comparison of soundfiles with the Torpedo Live, once with a cab attached to the thru on the Live and once with the integrated Loadbox? I'd very much appreciate it! :)
=> We do this on a regular basis here at the office to test the quality of our loadbox. Unfortunately I don't have a set of soundclips at hand right now. It's worth noting that the result heavily depends on the type of amplifier, and the actual speaker used. Basically, single ended amps with a high output impedance will be sensitive to the load : changing the loudspeaker, or replacing it with a loadbox, will easily change the sound. Push-pull amplifiers usually have a much lower output impedance and will react less to this change, if at all. So be aware that this test, on only one amp and one loudspeaker, can tell you only a part of the story ;)
 
Thanks guys.
Basstyra":1l6qn7iq said:
=> The Reload is a Reactive-Active Attenuator, which is a totally different approach, and yes, we believe it's that much better ! The amplifier sees just a loadbox, which is an impedance very close to a real loudspeaker. So it reacts the same as usual. The loudspeaker is driven by a very low impedance, totally transparent amplifier, which means a total respect of your sound. All this plays a role in a fully transparent attenuation without treble loss.

Does anyone have a comparison of soundfiles with the Torpedo Live, once with a cab attached to the thru on the Live and once with the integrated Loadbox? I'd very much appreciate it! :)
=> We do this on a regular basis here at the office to test the quality of our loadbox. Unfortunately I don't have a set of soundclips at hand right now. It's worth noting that the result heavily depends on the type of amplifier, and the actual speaker used. Basically, single ended amps with a high output impedance will be sensitive to the load : changing the loudspeaker, or replacing it with a loadbox, will easily change the sound. Push-pull amplifiers usually have a much lower output impedance and will react less to this change, if at all. So be aware that this test, on only one amp and one loudspeaker, can tell you only a part of the story ;)
I'm a bit confused. The Rockcrusher is a reactive load as well, so it's the same approach if I use them both without a cab?
I only have PP 6L6 amps. I play mostly highgain Rock/Metal. Which speakers/cab is the Reload Loadbox modeled after? V30s?

I mean a lot of it is about EQ. I managed to get the amp sound using the Rivera close to the one without a loadbox with the integrated EQ in Wall of Sound. Still the caracter is different and there's just to much guesswork if the tone doesn't sound right. Too many variables.
The Rivera makes it darker/more spongy feeling. I was actually surprised how much better I like the impulses with the Mark IV without the RockCrusher, even at bedroom levels!

That's something I like about the Reload, the amp always sees the same load.
On the other hand, it would be nice to have the Live and have a "finished" sound arriving in the DAW. It would just need a Highcut and EQ to adjust it to the track and that's it. Decisions, Decisions.

Would the DI be much better and have less noise than the instrument input on the Fireface?
This works already pretty well for me, using a Palmer Daccapo as a reampbox. So I'm not sure if I need the Reload. The Reload would be nicer when practicing (without recording/having the pc on). :confused:

The problem with demos, e.g. on youtube is that a lot of these guys are crazy good producers, always hard to judge what kind of tones I could get myself. If there only was a way to try this stuff out in Switzerland :/

p.s. There seem to be some glitches with the UI with Reaper 5, where can I submit that?
 
"I'm a bit confused. The Rockcrusher is a reactive load as well, so it's the same approach if I use them both without a cab?"
=> If not used as an attenuator, but as a loadbox (without a cabinet), then yes, the difference may be less obvious. But it still could be big: "reactive" does not mean much after all. It's like saying "it's a loadbox": ok, sure, but it could be either a bad circuit, a good one, or anything in between, and still be, technically, "a loadbox". The same goes for "reactive". That says nothing about the quality of the circuit. To be honest, I don't know how the Rockcrusher performs in this exact situation. What I know is, we developed our loadbox to be as close as a real loudspeaker as possible, and our tests are conclusive on the matter.

The tricky part is, each speaker, and even more, each speaker cabinet, has its own impedance. So indeed, we had to make choices about the model used. We chose to make something like an average of several cabinets, so it could be applicable in most situations. So it's not really modeled on one particular model.

But do consider we are kind of splitting hair, here. The impedance of the load on a tube amplifier does have a measurable effet, but as long as the impedance is around what is expected from a loudpseaker, the differences are small. Usually, nothing that couldn't be rectified by a small amount of EQ.

If you notice real differences in the tone, but also in the grain and behavior, then maybe indeed the loadbox is not ideal. But it's hard to be 100% sure.

I didn't test the Fireface so I couldn't compare it to our DI. RME usually does great products, so I wouldn't bet on a huge improvement. Escpecially considering that, after all, the Fireface will do the analog to digital converting anyway. The DI of the Reloead however is very useful in conjonction with the Replay and Match function, seen as a whole reamplification tool.

We have a distributor in Switzerland, you should probably contact him if you want to find a dealer where you could test the Reload. See there: http://www.two-notes.com/en/distributors-europe

For bug reports, go there: http://support.two-notes.com/index.php?a=add
 
Thank you very much for your response. I guess, seeing how many pros use your products, if they're good enough for them, they must be good enough for a noob like me :D

I was just always wondering why your IRs tended to get dark as soon as you got over ~7% on the center parameter. Same for Ownhammer IRs, always found them dull. That's when I noticed my loadbox was damping the highs. Welp, time to sell my RC ^^
 
@Basstyra You didn't promise too much. I just got the Reload today, and my first impression is very good. As an attenuator as well as a loadbox into the DAW.
It seems very tight to me and has the response I expect from the amp. Awesome product guys!
 
I was just always wondering why your IRs tended to get dark as soon as you got over ~7% on the center parameter. Same for Ownhammer IRs, always found them dull. That's when I noticed my loadbox was damping the highs. Welp, time to sell my RC ^^

Actually, if you get to do the experience in real life, you will find that the high frequencies decrease really fast as you move the microphone away from the center of the speaker cone. Of course it depends on the speaker response and technology, but the highs are really directive and the closer the microphone is to the speaker, the more you will be affected.

On a side note, Basstyra aka Bruno is our lead engineer and he is being very modest: the DI on the Reload is very fast, with a huge bandwidth to ensure the cleanest possible signal, in order to do be able to do a proper reamping without killing the guitar tone. Or putting makeup on it if you see what I mean.
 
Yes, as I said the problem was mainly that the initial tone that arrived at the DAW was already too dark.

I just tried the reamping, it sounds awesome, however it definitely does add some noise. Especially if I'm on a highgain tone and dial back the volume on the guitar to clean the amp up it's a bit much :/
I'm running the Output of the Fireface UCX at +4dBu and I have to crank the Replay knob to 10 to get it to match! The input I'm using is a Line input set to Lo, as it clips otherwise.. also I'm using (new) balanced cables, and engaged the ground lifts, as they all reduced noise. I was honestly expecting a little less noise :/ The Fireface is usually considered a good interface, maybe I'm missing something, or is it just in the nature of reamping?

For me it's hard to use with guitar volumes down, because if I use a noise gate, it chops the notes off with the volume down, and without the noise is a bit much.
Usually when I go down with the volume(to 2-3, to make it clean) plugging directly into the amp it's dead quiet.



Thank you for any tipps.
 
This is normal assuming you mean you set your recording levels with your guitar's volume max'd, and then turn it way down to 2 or 3 while recording, and then send that signal out of your DAW to Reamp with a high-gain amp.

The noise you're hearing is due to the bad S/N Ratio you're creating when recording your guitar so low, and sending that high-noise signal back to a amp set for high gain.

If you put your ear against your amp's speaker WITHOUT making loud noise (to save your hearing), you'll hear more noise in the signal when the guitar's volume is way down as well unless it has a gate.

Your best bet is to use a different track or amp setting for the cleans, one where the guitar's volume can be recorded higher and the amp setting can be cleaner. Try setting the guitar to 7 or so and using a cleaner amp setting for thsoe parts, as that'll get your pups out of their resonant peak but still have a decent level (assuming passive pups).

The goal is to ALWAYS record with the best S/N ratio you can, especially when reamping with noisy high-gain guitar amps.

slash57":hf9ckhus said:
Yes, as I said the problem was mainly that the initial tone that arrived at the DAW was already too dark.

I just tried the reamping, it sounds awesome, however it definitely does add some noise. Especially if I'm on a highgain tone and dial back the volume on the guitar to clean the amp up it's a bit much :/
I'm running the Output of the Fireface UCX at +4dBu and I have to crank the Replay knob to 10 to get it to match! The input I'm using is a Line input set to Lo, as it clips otherwise.. also I'm using (new) balanced cables, and engaged the ground lifts, as they all reduced noise. I was honestly expecting a little less noise :/ The Fireface is usually considered a good interface, maybe I'm missing something, or is it just in the nature of reamping?

For me it's hard to use with guitar volumes down, because if I use a noise gate, it chops the notes off with the volume down, and without the noise is a bit much.
Usually when I go down with the volume(to 2-3, to make it clean) plugging directly into the amp it's dead quiet.



Thank you for any tipps.
 
Thank you for the tip. I think I'll have to do it like this, just dial back the gain on the amp instead of the guitar. Your explanation with the S/N ratio makes sense. Well, it's not a big issue so I'll just go guitar -> amp if I really need to play with the volume knob on a solo. no biggie.

I noticed I get less noise with the onboard DI on the Fireface, so I'll just be using that (also when using full volume on the guitar
).
Very happy with the tones so far! It's great fun using the Reload.
 
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