Rig-Talk

Guitars, Gear, Tone!
It is currently Sat, Dec 16, 2017 7:54am

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 6:51am 
Offline
Hack

Joined: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 6:24am
Posts: 17
Hi everyone! :) I'm wondering, is it possible to implement a bit more real presence control in Torpedo C.A.B.? I mean the hi-mid and high-frequency shelving boost, just like in common tube poweramps. It seems that existing presence knob "warms" and "rounds" the tone, it's really cool and in-life-like, but it really lacks the feedback and searing high-freguency component, that can't be reproduced with available post-fx eq in C.A.B. I realize that maybe it's a non-linear process that can be heavy on Torpedo's processor, but maybe 2-band pre-poweramp parametric eq (one bell section and second shelf) will do the trick? Or there're other tips and solutions? :confused:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 1:57pm 
Offline
Plank Cranker Trainee

Joined: Sun, Feb 15, 2009 1:29pm
Posts: 339
The TN presence control work's backwards compared to most, so it's brightest at 0, and darkest at 100.

Typically in the real world a filtered NFB (Negative Feedback) presence control feeds back out of phase low freqs, which cuts the lows which then by default boosts the highs.

For TN's usage, I recommend starting with most tube types at 100% and going from there, though the PP 6L6's are more bass heavy, so perhaps 50% is a better starting point. I've found success with this method, plus there's the mic choice, positioning, and EQ available as well.

DrV wrote:
Hi everyone! :) I'm wondering, is it possible to implement a bit more real presence control in Torpedo C.A.B.? I mean the hi-mid and high-frequency shelving boost, just like in common tube poweramps. It seems that existing presence knob "warms" and "rounds" the tone, it's really cool and in-life-like, but it really lacks the feedback and searing high-freguency component, that can't be reproduced with available post-fx eq in C.A.B. I realize that maybe it's a non-linear process that can be heavy on Torpedo's processor, but maybe 2-band pre-poweramp parametric eq (one bell section and second shelf) will do the trick? Or there're other tips and solutions? :confused:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 5:24pm 
Offline
Hack

Joined: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 6:24am
Posts: 17
Thanks, djd100. I've noted it works just the opposite way than regular presence control. But when I lower the presence knob value on C.A.B., the tone loses some "fatness". When I try to compensate it by boosting the Volume control, high frequencies are masked again, so it's not a proper solution. I try not to go wild on the Depth control, it's really simple to overdo it or add too little on other hand. Depth on 50% and Presence around 75-100% are good, other nuances are dealt with mic settings. I've got a rather successful experience with an EQ plugin placed between my preamp and Torpedo, but this solution isn't 100% perfect, another response, I quess. Especially for heavy distorted tones (6505-ish for example, where presence control is critically vital for the final tone).


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 05, 2017 8:03pm 
Offline
Plank Cranker Trainee

Joined: Sun, Feb 15, 2009 1:29pm
Posts: 339
If you increase a tube power amp sim's gain/volume, the top-end will roll-of just as it does in the real deal to some degree (though at some point fizz and odd-harmonic harshness will replace it in push-pull designs).

6505 tones are typically mostly preamp, so consider running your tube power amp sim around 8 - 10 max (assuming at minimum -6/-3 peaks etc), depth and presence to suit with regards to the pp tube choice, and using the Two Note's EQ to finish (after mic choice and positioning etc).

I'll typically lose a db or two at 800Hz, maybe 1 db at 2K, and then use the low, low-mid, and high bands to compensate if need be (the 6K band can bring back the presence as well, be mindful of the fizz quotient LOL!).

It's a juggling act, but I've always been able to find what I need (though I don't do ultra high-gain so I'm not really experienced with that genre). I stick mostly to edge of breakup through what I consider pushed mid-gain (modded Marshall/Cornford, Bogner etc).

Have fun, and it's sure nice having all these options without owning and transporting all these cabs and power amps etc!



DrV wrote:
Thanks, djd100. I've noted it works just the opposite way than regular presence control. But when I lower the presence knob value on C.A.B., the tone loses some "fatness". When I try to compensate it by boosting the Volume control, high frequencies are masked again, so it's not a proper solution. I try not to go wild on the Depth control, it's really simple to overdo it or add too little on other hand. Depth on 50% and Presence around 75-100% are good, other nuances are dealt with mic settings. I've got a rather successful experience with an EQ plugin placed between my preamp and Torpedo, but this solution isn't 100% perfect, another response, I quess. Especially for heavy distorted tones (6505-ish for example, where presence control is critically vital for the final tone).


Last edited by djd100 on Tue, Sep 12, 2017 10:20am, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon, Sep 11, 2017 9:05am 
Offline
Hack

Joined: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 6:24am
Posts: 17
Indeed :yes: Torpedo series is outstanding product for sure, nothing can even come close to it. :thumbsup: But since nothing is ideal in our world, there's always a broad field of improvement, right? Maybe monsieur Guillaume has some words about the topic? :)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 12, 2017 2:43am 
Offline
Plank Cranker Wanker
User avatar

Joined: Tue, Feb 22, 2011 3:43am
Posts: 1672
Location: France
Quote:
Maybe monsieur Guillaume has some words about the topic? :)


i'm totally down to rework that part of the process and I agree it can use some improvement, the only issue with that is we'll destroy all the current presets that all our customers carefully crafted, and i'm not a big fan of that. :/

_________________
Affiliation: President @ OROSYS SAS, owner of Two Notes Audio Engineering

Creating pro audio product for the guitar and bass players:
Website : Two Notes Audio Engineering
Follow us on Youtube and Facebook
Two Notes samples on Soundcloud

For the best support, please check the FAQ and create a ticket on the Two Notes Help Desk


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 12, 2017 3:12am 
Offline
Hack

Joined: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 6:24am
Posts: 17
Thank you, monsieur, for a quick answer. :thumbsup: Maybe it'll be convenient for those users who've already created good presets to have an option to keep an old version of firmware just to keep their setup (whether or not existing poweramp simulation is ok as it is). And other people will have the option to use a new feature that is vital for high gain, as I mentioned. Anyway, just ordered your Le Lead to continue experiments :rock: Gotta be a perfect neighbour for my Le Crunch and C.A.B. It seems to me you've got a new TN fan here. :lol: :LOL:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 12, 2017 3:32am 
Offline
Plank Cranker Wanker
User avatar

Joined: Tue, Feb 22, 2011 3:43am
Posts: 1672
Location: France
As a matter of fact people update the product not because they want/need new function, but just because... it's an update. It's afterwards that they complain. ^^

Quote:
And other people will have the option to use a new feature that is vital for high gain, as I mentioned. Anyway, just ordered your Le Lead to continue experiments :rock: Gotta be a perfect neighbour for my Le Crunch and C.A.B. It seems to me you've got a new TN fan here. :lol: :LOL:


Well thank you Sir! :rock:

_________________
Affiliation: President @ OROSYS SAS, owner of Two Notes Audio Engineering

Creating pro audio product for the guitar and bass players:
Website : Two Notes Audio Engineering
Follow us on Youtube and Facebook
Two Notes samples on Soundcloud

For the best support, please check the FAQ and create a ticket on the Two Notes Help Desk


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue, Sep 12, 2017 5:23am 
Offline
Hack

Joined: Sun, Sep 03, 2017 6:24am
Posts: 17
Hehe :D That's just the way it is. Maybe 2 different updates then to choose from. First adds new features, second leaves everything as it is and "fixes minor bugs" as usual ;)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group