I finally figured out why I can't get along with a Mesa Recto

[TheGreatGreen]

It's been interesting reading all the comments. I've noticed a number of people have mentioned putting a tight boost in front or setting EQ to extremes like turning the bass all the way down to get the right sound. It makes me wonder if you have to go to such extremes is it really the right amp for what you're playing.
The way I approach an amp is if I have to set EQ too far off neutral it probably doesn't have the right core voicing to start with. I think of adjusting the EQ as finding the sweet spot on the sweep range and compensating for room acoustics, not to try to overhaul the voicing. For me that's usually between 10 & 2 if neutral is at noon. Same thing with adding a boost or something in front. I look at a boost as goosing the front end a bit to push the amp a little harder to stand out for a solo or something. Not to try to make a loose amp tighter. Basically, if I'm at the point where I'm trying to forcibly compensate for something that's part of the amps core character then it's not the right one for me. Not to say it's bad, just not what fits me personally.
I play a good bit of thrash metal or faster paced melodic rhythm which is why a recto doesn't fit for me. I like something more focused and it just didn't agree with my playing. If I'm fighting the amp's core character then I know it's not voiced the way I want and I'm not going to be able to bring out its full potential. With a Recto I wasn't able to define what I was fighting until I watched that comparison video. Like I said it's a great amp with an iconic sound and is perfect for a lot of players. For me, not so much. It's time to move on and now I can define what I doesn't fit.

The issue with this mentality to me is that... what if you want the sound of a boosted Recto? A properly boosted Recto is an awesome thing, and nothing else does that sound. No other amp will give you that sound, boosted or not. If you want the very specific "boosted Recto" tone, then you're just going to have to use a Recto and a boost going into it. It's just the required parts of the equation.

The goal is not to buy gear and hold it up as the end-all-be-all source of Tone like it's the holy grail, and then letting it control what you sound like. The goal is for you to dictate what you want to sound like by using whatever combination of gear is required to create that sound, dialed in however the dials need to be set to get the sound you want. The goal is to get the sound in your head. If "[specific amp]+boost" is what it takes to get there, then that's just what it takes.

edit: I read further into the thread and VESMedic is saying basically the same thing, but with more detail.

 

[mnemonic]

I do keep my recto’s eq not too far off noon, with a boost it sounds best there to me. Currently I have B/M/T set at about 12:30 (o’clock) and gain at like 1:00, boosted in modern mode.

Also minor point but the recto’s eq is passive and not much different from the typical FMV tonestack. However what it is, is very INTERactive, and very touchy.

 

[VESmedic]

I do keep my recto’s eq not too far off noon, with a boost it sounds best there to me. Currently I have B/M/T set at about 12:30 (o’clock) and gain at like 1:00, boosted in modern mode.

Also minor point but the recto’s eq is passive and not much different from the typical FMV tonestack. However what it is, is very INTERactive, and very touchy.

Ah, I could’ve sworn it was active. I know amps like the XXX and JSX Etx are active I believe, and they have similar tone stacks ( relatively).

 

[DeathbyButterslax]

Another point, IME, and I've seen others feel the same way. Rectifiers need to be on for a little bit before they sound their best, like 30-40 minutes.

 

[bubucci]

Is there any special daytime when rectos sound best ? lol
Guy in the video before learns How proper dial recto and still sound like shit good job

 

[JackBootedThug]

Ah, I could’ve sworn it was active. I know amps like the XXX and JSX Etx are active I believe, and they have similar tone stacks ( relatively).

me too...

 

[Nigel]

What exactly is the Recto tonestack? Modified 59 Bassman Fender TMB? We need a clearer technical frame of reference, gents.

 

[Greazygeo]

Isn’t the tone stack in Rectos an active circuit?

No I don’t think they are.

 

[MadAsAHatter]

Gross accusations? WTF are you talking about? Not like I'm "accusing" you of some crime. Smoke some weed and chill out.

If you set this amp up that way it sounds like a hot mess of flub. I'm guessing that's why a lot of people sell them. They're either too brainwashed to think any other settings would sound better or they're just lazy.

Came straight from your mouth/typing.... assuming those who didn't care for a Recto's sound set everything to noon and accusing them of being brainwashed or lazy to use a different setting.

Try setting a vintage plexi with everything at noon vs everything on 10 and tell me what sounds better.

And lets not forget this assumption that everything sounds better at 10 on a plex. At least that is what you are implying. You may like it, others may not. It's subjective and collective opinion doesn't make something a fact

Smoke some weed and chill out.

Now you seem to be assuming I'm high strung and need to smoke weed to chill out. I'm just participating in the discussion.

Also, please don't "try" to educate me on Marshall vs. Mesa circuits. Just stop while you're behind.

I wasn't trying to educate anyone about this, at least I don't remember dropping a 500 slide powerpoint presentation on the subject here. At best I just said Marshall & Mesa circuits were different. I would hardly call that trying to educate someone.

You quoted and replied to one of my post with assumptions, accusations, and what came across as attitude. I called you out on that part and replied to your other points rationally. You in turn responded with more of the same. If discussing a topic with someone who's viewpoint may differ from yours upsets you then that's your problem to deal with however you see fit.

 

[mnemonic]

What exactly is the Recto tonestack? Modified 59 Bassman Fender TMB? We need a clearer technical frame of reference, gents.

Quite similar to the SLO but things get complicated in modern mode as the presence control moves to after the eq in the preamp.

Recto (3-channel, 2nd channel)

SLO

Which itself is not far off from a JCM800 tonestack (granted lots of other circuit changes in both also)

I guess everything is a modded bassman in the end…
5f6a tonestack

 

[stratjacket]

Interesting read. I’m not sure if this thread makes me want a Recto or after 6 pages (and counting) of explaining how to dial it in makes me want to run the other way. Haha

 

[JackBootedThug]

hey...you either like them or you don't......

 

[BesaMoogie]

Did anyone mentioned the cab before?
Lately I`ve been digging a bit into Mesa 4x12 cabs and to my understanding, the 4x12 OS contributes a lot the the overall character of the amp. A lot of people who compared it to the stiletto/traditional cab say, that the traditional cab is much tighter in the bottom end, tracks faster and the punch comes more from the mids.
So maybe, beside boosting the frontend, thats the ticket here?

 

[VESmedic]

Did anyone mentioned the cab before?
Lately I`ve been digging a bit into Mesa 4x12 cabs and to my understanding, the 4x12 OS contributes a lot the the overall character of the amp. A lot of people who compared it to the stiletto/traditional cab say, that the traditional cab is much tighter in the bottom end, tracks faster and the punch comes more from the mids.
So maybe, beside boosting the frontend, thats the ticket here?

In the recording world, there’s many different reasons to use the traditional over the OS cab. The OS believe it or not, is often much tighter sounding under a mic, by far. It is more scooped sounding, but sits better in a mix. To me anyways. They both rule, but it really just depends on your goal and what the mix needs.

 

[Nigel]

Okay! Now we're talking! In order to dial these things in right, we REALLY need to discover (creatively comprehend) how the controls interact, and to some degree, their values.

This is priceless, gents please do not miss it! Learning how to dial in a Fender TMB changed my life and how I relate to my beloved amp:

https://robrobinette.com/How_The_TMB_Tone_Stack_Works.htm
Plug in your values (to the appropriate tone stack calculator) and see how it EQ's the signal!

https://www.guitarscience.net/tsc/info.htm
I like diming my TMB and swapping out the 25K mid for a 50K per Pete n' Dave for EVH brought it closer to flat with less of a smile and more lower mids, plus no "crashing" treble.

Another thing that's killer is running the treble at 7, Mids at 3, and Bass at 2 as a starting point.

 

[Nigel]

That's very interesting asI would have not guessed it. I've either used a Bogner Uberkab or the a Mesa Traditional. Now using the Trad exclusively

I found an ‘03 OS for a song and every time I plug in, it’s magick. It is “that” sound. There is no substitute!

 

[MadAsAHatter]

Okay! Now we're talking! In order to dial these things in right, we REALLY need to discover (creatively comprehend) how the controls interact, and to some degree, their values.

This is priceless, gents please do not miss it! Learning how to dial in a Fender TMB changed my life and how I relate to my beloved amp:

https://robrobinette.com/How_The_TMB_Tone_Stack_Works.htm
Plug in your values (to the appropriate tone stack calculator) and see how it EQ's the signal!

https://www.guitarscience.net/tsc/info.htm
I like diming my TMB and swapping out the 25K mid for a 50K per Pete n' Dave for EVH brought it closer to flat with less of a smile and more lower mids, plus no "crashing" treble.

Another thing that's killer is running the treble at 7, Mids at 3, and Bass at 2 as a starting point.

This is awesome! I always like to know what goes on behind the scenes. I find it helps me do my part up front better.

 

[TheGreatGreen]

In the recording world, there’s many different reasons to use the traditional over the OS cab. The OS believe it or not, is often much tighter sounding under a mic, by far. It is more scooped sounding, but sits better in a mix. To me anyways. They both rule, but it really just depends on your goal and what the mix needs.

Hey, do you have any experience recording with Mesa OS straight cabs? Any thoughts on them compared to the OS slants?

 

[Jack Luminous]

Hey, do you have any experience recording with Mesa OS straight cabs? Any thoughts on them compared to the OS slants?

The original Mesa straight OS recto cab is just the same as the slanted one. Only the shell is straight, the baffle is slanted just the same anyway. Mesa only started to make real straight OS recto cab about 10 years ago. That means all the 90s/00s sound has been recorded with slanted cabs. The OS cab records very well in my own experience. I've seen way more OS than trad cabs in recording studios.

 

[VESmedic]

Hey, do you have any experience recording with Mesa OS straight cabs? Any thoughts on them compared to the OS slants?

All I use are straight cabs! But they are all great, slants are great too. They sound different slightly yes, especially in the midrange because of how far back the speaker moves in a slant vs straight baffle, but they both sound great!