MIDI Thru not working on ENGL Savage Mark II

[T00DEEPBLUE]

Hi. I'm trying to use a MIDI thru port on the back of my ENGL Savage so I can pass a MIDI message onto my Disaster Area NNB controller to control my Neunaber Expanse pedal. I'm using a Harley Benton FXL8 Pro as my MIDI controller.

Here's how I've set my MIDI cables up:

MIDI Loop switcher > ENGL Savage MIDI input
ENGL Savage MIDI Thru > Disaster Area NNB

The loop switcher only has a single MIDI output.

When I connect the HB loop switcher's MIDI output directly to the NNB, it works absolutely fine. And when I connect the HB loop switcher into the Savage's MIDI input, it also works perfectly fine.

The problem is when I connect the MIDI thru port from the Savage into the NNB. The NNB immediately shuts off all its power and stops working the second I plug it in. When I unplug the cable from the Savage, the NNB comes back to life again.

Plugging the Savage's MIDI Thru port into the NNB is literally stopping it from working, until I unplug it.

Why is this happening? I'm using a brand new MIDI cable. I've never used the MIDI Thru port on the Savage before until today.

Has anyone else been reporting any issues with the MIDI thru port on the ENGL Savage II not working as intended? And if so, how did they fix it (if at all)

Thanks!

 

[T00DEEPBLUE]

I would also like to add:

For the sake of being systematic, I've also plugged the MIDI input of the NNB into the MIDI input of the ENGL Savage. Nothing happens. The NBB still has power, but otherwise nothing else happens. This is what I'd expect to happen.

However when I plug the MIDI Thru cable of the Savage into the NNB at any point, regardless of the amp being switched on or off, the NBB just shuts off completely. Dead. Until I unplug it again and it immediately jumps back to life.

This makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. Isn't the MIDI Thru port of the Savage only supposed to be a pass through from what the MIDI in is getting? Because that's literally what it says in the Savage's manual. Yet instead of letting signals pass through, its killing power to the pedal completely.

I am so confused. Please help.

 

[mcstinger]

Connect the MIDI cable to the NNB. At the other end, short the individual pins against each other with a piece of wire. Also against the metal ring. Watch if NNB turns off and with which pin combination.

 

[strungout82]

Also check the small switch next to the MIDI In on the Savage. The one labeled Engl Midi footcontroler. It should be on the right side unless you use an engl midi switcher.

 

[T00DEEPBLUE]

I appreciate you're all trying to help.

Connect the MIDI cable to the NNB. At the other end, short the individual pins against each other with a piece of wire. Also against the metal ring. Watch if NNB turns off and with which pin combination.

I've just done some testing.

Pins 1 and 3 are delivering 3.3v in reference to ground. Shorting pins 1 and 2 together shuts off the NNB. Shorting pins 2 and 3 together makes the LED indicator on the NNB turn red (weird)

The Harley Benton loop switcher is delivering 5v on pin 5 and ~0.3v on pin 4. Nothing on pins 1 or 3.

To recap, connecting the loop switcher to the NNB directly makes the NNB work perfectly normal. Connecting it to the MIDI thru shuts the NNB off.

Instead of mucking around with fault finding or modifying the pin outs on the Savage or the NNB, I managed to score one of these used on Reverb for very cheap as a sort of workaround:

Totally fixed my problem. The loop switcher communicates with the Savage and the NNB just fine with this splitter. Its an active splitter but it doesn't use an external power brick. It takes advantage of the 5v pin inside the MIDI cable from the loop switcher for power. So its a very elegant solution to this compatibility problem.

Also check the small switch next to the MIDI In on the Savage. The one labeled Engl Midi footcontroler. It should be on the right side unless you use an engl midi switcher.

Yeah I checked this too as mentioned in the manual. The phantom power has always been switched off.

 

[mcstinger]

My guess was that MIDI Thru on Savage is OK. That's why I asked you to do pin shorting test on the MIDI cable. Standard MIDI cables use just pins 4 and 5. Shielding on 2. Manufacturers use pins 1 and 3 in many, sometimes crazy ways. MIDI Thru box is a good solution, but also cable without connected pins 1 and 3 would do.

 

[FLUXX]

Check on the back on the amp,
on the small Dip-Switch Panel of 6 small switches.
Make sure that Dip-Switch #6 is "On" (pull switch down)
That enables a number of midi controls.
Hope this helps

 

[T00DEEPBLUE]

Check on the back on the amp,
on the small Dip-Switch Panel of 6 small switches.
Make sure that Dip-Switch #6 is "On" (pull switch down)
That enables a number of midi controls.
Hope this helps

OK this is just bullshit. I've just tried this and the MIDI thru port actually works now.

ENGL's manual specifies in semi-broken English that setting DIP switch 6 to ON enables, "certain amp functions" without ever specifying that one of those "certain" functions is enabling the MIDI thru port of the amp to actually work.

How was anyone reading the manual supposed to know that?

Why would anyone ever need a DIP switch setting where the MIDI thru port doesn't work? Anyone with common sense would assume it should work by default.

That's £30 buying a MIDI thru splitter wasted.

I'm glad the amp works as intended now. But its frustrating that the manual isn't more specific.