What would it take to get you back to primarily using a tube amp?

I never could get modelers to be 100% what I wanted. FRFR sucks nuts, and through a cabinet worked better for me, but then you got the weight of a cabinet, poweramp, etc that sort of contradicts the compact convenience of a modeler. I don't really use effects, delay on leads and sometimes a high mix reverb for some textural shit, but that's about it. There's many ways to get a good DI sounds from a head now if you want to skip the mic process on stage. I am playing a Badlander right now and that's built right in, sounds great through a PA after changing the stock impulses. I'm looking into maybe getting a Helix Rack though for my reverb/delays because I hate setting up 4CM just for a couple pedals, but that's whole second rack to carry with the Helix and controller, so idk. But I wouldn't use it for the modeled amps, Helix amps are kind of wonky to me. A big thing for me is needing to adjust shit on the fly. I need physical knobs for my split-second half-drunk caveman brain to work with. Axe FX, Kemper, etc have these but you have to remember exactly how to use them, and when you got a half second break in a song to do something, and you've been drinking, sometimes that know-how doesn't sit on top of the head haha.
 
Spaceboy said:
I never could get modelers to be 100% what I wanted. FRFR sucks nuts, and through a cabinet worked better for me, but then you got the weight of a cabinet, poweramp, etc that sort of contradicts the compact convenience of a modeler. I don't really use effects, delay on leads and sometimes a high mix reverb for some textural shit, but that's about it. There's many ways to get a good DI sounds from a head now if you want to skip the mic process on stage. I am playing a Badlander right now and that's built right in, sounds great through a PA after changing the stock impulses. I'm looking into maybe getting a Helix Rack though for my reverb/delays because I hate setting up 4CM just for a couple pedals, but that's whole second rack to carry with the Helix and controller, so idk. But I wouldn't use it for the modeled amps, Helix amps are kind of wonky to me. A big thing for me is needing to adjust shit on the fly. I need physical knobs for my split-second half-drunk caveman brain to work with. Axe FX, Kemper, etc have these but you have to remember exactly how to use them, and when you got a half second break in a song to do something, and you've been drinking, sometimes that know-how doesn't sit on top of the head haha.
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Just wondering have you ever tried any of the Bluguitar amps? They may do everything you are trying to achieve so long as you like the tones you can get from it.
 
Metalhex said:
Just wondering have you ever tried any of the Bluguitar amps? They may do everything you are trying to achieve so long as you like the tones you can get from it.
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Yep I have had the Mercury version and currently have the Iridium. It has some faults but I carry one in my guitar case for a backup amp, and sometimes use it for jams, practice etc when I'm in a rush or feeling too lazy to carry sometime. My biggest compaint about it is that it's not a good DI solution. The DI sounds like shit, and while you can use some sort of pedal as an IR loader, and even though it's a solid state, something about how it's designed makes it sounds much better when you connect a cabinet. So even with the pedal sized amp you always need a load. The thing is, there's a load built into the unit, but for some reason they made it so that you can only access it by using MIDI or buying that huge BLuGuitar branded Remote which just got discontinued I think. But for backup and traveling it's been great. I do a few random fests every year and if there's nothing on the backline I like I bring the BluGuitar and it's never let me down.
 
RaceU4her said:
why just once though? id be too curious what the thing is actually capable of if i spent some time with it.
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"Time" being the operative word in your post.
I got one because I had planned to write and record with it.
But I don't have the time to learn the process of recording using computer programs for drums and recording/mixing.
I had hoped that a couple of local bros would get that stuff worked out for me but they don't have the time either.
That's the problem with being old,having families and jobs. None of us can find the time or inclination to learn new stuff.
That was well over a year or two ago. I guess we all just gave up and moved on to other stuff.
To make matters worse,this situation made me loose interest in playing all together.
Haven't plugged into anything in over a year now...maybe closer to two years. Not sure anymore.
The whole situation kinda broke my heart.
I'm neither kidding nor exaggerating. The Kemper was the impetus for me to stop playing guitar.
I'm hoping that this new guitar build for my truck will get me back in the saddle.
Will probably take the Kemper into the truck with it and see if I get interested again.
We will see.
 
tpruitt said:
DI profile your favorite amp head.I bet you’ll find it easier to turn on more.
I was right there where you are till I profiled and fine tuned it with the definition knob.
Every profile or patch I tried I hated. Didn’t sound right. Now the ones I did with my setup sounds great.
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My Kemper is loaded with lots of great sounding profiles,and I'm easy as fuck to please.
I'm not a tone super-tweaker. I pretty much dial in a tone quick and go to town.
It's just a combination of time and effort to get set up to write drums and record everything digitally that made me give up.
If I had an old school drum machine and a tape unit and console I could bust shit out quick.
I'm a child of the 80s who still doesn't do Facebook or Instagram. I have a Fire tablet I use in the truck to post online.
I'm the "unfrozen caveman lawyer" of this forum. Your digital world frightens and confuses me.
 
Sad to say, but the Line 6 collaboration with Bogner to create the Spider Valve head was the right path. If Live 6 were to put the Helix into a 100 watt tube head with the ability to direct out with IRs and run a full stack, that would be it. It's the marriage of the two that will win the war. The modeler can cop the tone, but can't move the air. The cab and amp fill the room and sound better, but introduce variables. If you could model and DI the perfect tone to FOH, and then have a stack to tweak the cab with regular eq controls that don't effect the DI, then you can have your cake and eat it too.

So, for me, it's a modeler preamp and tube power amp with a DI and separate tone controls for the DI and the tubes. You can even drop that bitch on a random provided backline cab and tweak it straight. Then, your perfect modeled tone goes to FOH, and you fill the void with going DI by having stage volume for feel and feedback. Win win.
 
It would have to be small, light, have multiple emulated XLR outs, 3 channels, onboard FX that are configurable, ability to store presets/scenes and have a board that can control everything well. I don't see this happening. Even when my cover/all-occasion band plays a big event with big stage and good production I still take my fractal rig. I know exactly what I'm getting and it always works. I can carry my entire rig in one trip (dual guitar bag, Fractal FM9, bag of stuff with small stands hooked to straps). Its only a matter of convenience and control for me. Volume/stage volume CAN be a huge issue for us and its hard to even get a Fender HRD with a pedal board to play nice without a hassle trying to find the right balance between it and stage volume requirements.

When I was younger and played in an original hard rock band, we dragged 1/2 stacks around to play a 1/2 hour set at some venue with 10 other bands and loved it. That was a whole different ball game and it was great to experience pants-flapping 100 watt+ goodness come from a 4x12 behind you. The whole dragging-of-the-gear was part of the experience. Anyone from Cleveland here that ever played at the Phantasy Nightclub and had to lug a 4X12 up those 20 floors of narrow, rickety stairs will know that "experience" well.

So even if there could be a tube amp that met every requirement, (aren't there some little H&K tube amps w/ effects?) I just don't see that replacing higher-end modelers for situations I in which I find myself. However, if guys can make it work with big tube amps in bar gigs, then that is awesome!
 
I think the question is interesting, as like either tube amps or modelers, as I am using a somewhat hybrid approach. Using a Kingsley squire Bf for my preamp and a cabm for my power amp and cab sim to the pa. It works great for me. Previous setup was a Mesa ta15 into a suhr rlir to the pa.

For me to go back to a tube amp for live, something like, the Suhr pt15ir which would allow me to shrink my pedalboard would do nicely. My buddy uses a line6 helix direct and which he sounds good with it, I don’t have much desire to switch. I like the flexibility my rig offers.
 
I have owned both the Helix stomp and floor, and the first generation AxeFX. I ended up selling them.

I have a PT15IR and for me it is the perfect rig for most cases. For my silent stage gigs, the IR'S are great. For small club gigs, it has sufficient volume. Three channels are sufficient for me. I dont need thousands of options. Now that I have a BQ500 amp, I can supplement the horsepower for bigger stages.

It's not a end all as I have two other amps I use live too. I just used my Splawn Competition and a 4x12 for a gig last weekend and for that genre, it was perfect! I also play in a VH tribute band and the Splawn nails that tone and vibe better.

I also play in an old Aerosmith tribute band and my 2204 build is the best amp for that....

What would I like to see?

I'd like to see a light 50 watt tube 1x12 combo with an IR output and modeler preamp section with effects and a simple two-row footswitch with 8 buttons max and a two sweep pedals that can be assigned to adjust whatever parameters you want.
 
rottingcorpse said:
My Kemper is loaded with lots of great sounding profiles,and I'm easy as fuck to please.
I'm not a tone super-tweaker. I pretty much dial in a tone quick and go to town.
It's just a combination of time and effort to get set up to write drums and record everything digitally that made me give up.
If I had an old school drum machine and a tape unit and console I could bust shit out quick.
I'm a child of the 80s who still doesn't do Facebook or Instagram. I have a Fire tablet I use in the truck to post online.
I'm the "unfrozen caveman lawyer" of this forum. Your digital world frightens and confuses me.
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i think youre making it way more complicated than it really is my dude, Reaper recording is laid out just like a console which is what drew me to it at first, the kemper im pretty sure you can use as an interface so all you have to do is plug into your comp with the usb cable, hit record and go. the hardest part is getting used to twisting knobs on the "console" with a mouse
 
RaceU4her said:
i think youre making it way more complicated than it really is my dude, Reaper recording is laid out just like a console which is what drew me to it at first, the kemper im pretty sure you can use as an interface so all you have to do is plug into your comp with the usb cable, hit record and go. the hardest part is getting used to twisting knobs on the "console" with a mouse
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Its not the kemper. Its the drum program that is kicking my bros asses...I assume.
We got the keeper to record onto the computer,and it worked great. I say "we" in the royal sense. I did nothing but try to get them to set me up.
Its all about the drum program and me being able to tune the drums where I know I want them.
Then being able to write all the different patterns needed to make it not sound like a drum machine....
...or do sound like a machine when needed.
Then I could burn it so I could play it in the truck and write the guitar patterns to fit the drum patterns I wrote.
My drive to start writing again was fucking errrrrl's fault. His videos made me wanna write and record again.
So I'm blaming him for all of this stupid shit.
 
ZEN Amps said:
If you've moved to modellers and can't or won't be coaxed back, read no further.

For those that mostly use modellers but could see a way back to the old days, or still yearn for authentic tube tone, what features and innovations would you like to see? Outlandish ideas are fine, encouraged actually.

Let's work on the fun assumption that tube amp technology will move forward, incorporate new tech, push some boundaries and bridge the gap between amp and modellers (in terms of versatility and convenience).
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I never stopped using tube amps. My RedPlate Magica 50w has all the features I need in a gigging amp, though. It's just a stellar piece of gear. I'm still dialing it in thru the front panel controls, and I haven't gotten to the controls on the back yet. Just a whole heap of good sounds that come out of that amp.
 
rottingcorpse said:
Its not the kemper. Its the drum program that is kicking my bros asses...I assume.
We got the keeper to record onto the computer,and it worked great. I say "we" in the royal sense. I did nothing but try to get them to set me up.
Its all about the drum program and me being able to tune the drums where I know I want them.
Then being able to write all the different patterns needed to make it not sound like a drum machine....
...or do sound like a machine when needed.
Then I could burn it so I could play it in the truck and write the guitar patterns to fit the drum patterns I wrote.
My drive to start writing again was fucking errrrrl's fault. His videos made me wanna write and record again.
So I'm blaming him for all of this stupid shit.
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Errrrl is one of the greats and an inspiration to us all. a lot of his drums tracks are just backing tracks we use for drumjams, i could send you the tracks and you could be recording over the same drums, its stupid easy.
 
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