Studio monitors or frfr speakers?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Jon BCN
  • Start date Start date

Studio monitors or FRFR Speakers?

  • Studio Monitors

    Votes: 8 61.5%

  • FRFR Speakers

    Votes: 4 30.8%

  • Others

    Votes: 1 7.7%
  • Total voters
    13
J

Jon BCN

Active member
So I’m thinking of buying a Tone X Pedal and I’m unsure which way would be the best to amplify it. I was debating between two options: a very well regarded studio monitors like the Yamaha HS8, or a very popular frfr solution like the Headrush FRFR 8 or 12.

I would like the best possible sounding solution to play at home with the Tone X. In theory the Yamaha’s seem like the higher quality product, but I’m unsure if their benefits will be negated in a small/medium untreated room.

I’m open to hear other ideas or solutions.
 
I honestly can't imagine anyone recommending a PA speaker in this scenario--they must not understand the question
 
For this situation I would go with monitors. If you intended to jam with others, I would go with FRFR.
 
The Headrush stuff is toys. I've personally played the Tone X through HS8s and they sounded great
 
I got the frfr 8 to go along with the tonex low level jamming / practice sessions and the setup worked great. For practice at home though, I usually play through reaper using the tonex plugin.

I don't have a place where I can play loud at home so that works for me through headphones, but I would say whatever limits you less and gets you to play more. I haven't used the headrush for loud band practice yet, but for everything else its been great.

If you want to start making music,get the monitors and use them at home, if you want to go out and jam with friends get the frfr
 
I’d invest in the best pair of studio monitors in your budget.
 
Another option I’m contemplating is to use the Power Amp In of my Katana 100 MK2 and use the Tonex with my Harley Benton vertical 2x12.

But I’ve heard bad things about using a modeler with real cabs as people say they sound thin and not project the sound like a tube amb unless you use them in the fx loop of a tube amp (I don’t have one at the moment).

Maybe I could buy a Pink Taco V2 and use the Tonex through it and have the best of both worlds.
 
Just so you know, studio monitors and PA speakers both are "Full Range, Flat Response" speakers. The difference between PA speakers and studio monitors is that when pushed up against design constraints, studio monitor designers will prioritize a flat response while PA speaker designers tend to prioritize volume and coverage.

In other words, "perfect" studio monitors could also be used as PA speakers, and "perfect" PA speakers could also be used as studio monitors. As guitar players, we tend to think about speakers in terms of guitar cabs, which are used to add their own flavor and character to our guitar sound. Studio monitors and PA speakers aren't like that and shouldn't be thought of that way.

That said, if you're going to be playing mostly in the house or studio, then studio monitors are most likely going to serve you best.
 
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Jon BCN said:
Another option I’m contemplating is to use the Power Amp In of my Katana 100 MK2 and use the Tonex with my Harley Benton vertical 2x12.

But I’ve heard bad things about using a modeler with real cabs as people say they sound thin and not project the sound like a tube amb unless you use them in the fx loop of a tube amp (I don’t have one at the moment).

Maybe I could buy a Pink Taco V2 and use the Tonex through it and have the best of both worlds.
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My preferred way to use a modeler is into an SS power amp into actual guitar cabs. It takes me seconds to dial in an amp tone with this setup, versus searching for the right IR for monitors/FRFR. I use a TC Bam 200 and a Duncan PS170 for the power (200 watts and 170 watts into two different 2x12)….and when I first got one of those 2x12s, an old Mesa with C90’s, I went to jam with a buddy and his drummer, buddy was using a XXX halfstack and since I figured a solid state power amp was going to need to be cranked to match a 120 watt tube amp I cranked the shit out of it, when I turned up the guitar’s volume I was paralyzed by laughter because it swallowed the XXX and the drummer, not by a little bit, they were completely drowned the fuck out. (also helps someone removed the back of that 2x12 and the bass trapped in the corner of the room considerably)

Never had an interest in FRFR stuff, saw way too many people complaining about amp in the room tones and all that shit before I even bought an AxeFX. I use HS-5’s in the studio, but for live playing it’s real cabs. No “it doesn’t feel like an amp in the room“ BS, no IR searching, just picking an amp and turning the knobs like you would on any other amp.
 
TheGreatGreen said:
Just so you know, studio monitors and PA speakers both are "Full Range, Flat Response" speakers.
Click to expand...
I think it was that Atomic company that seemingly had an endorsement deal with TGP a while back. FRFR makes no sense really—who is setting the parameters on “flat”? I always wondered if that was a guitar gear geek term or if other people used it.

I’ve got good tone from an AXEFX through guitar cabs but I’ve always thought if you were going to bring a cab then what’s the point of the modeler? Modeling is attractive b/c you can bring a small rig like a Helix and run it straight to FOH and use stage monitors for yourself. If you run your modeler through a power amp and then through a guitar cab, how are you getting your signal to FOH? You either have to mic your cab (again what’s the point) of you need 2 feeds b/c what you have going to your cab is not going to work to the board.

If it isn’t saving me time and space then I’m using my real amps
 
tallcoolone said:
I think it was that Atomic company that seemingly had an endorsement deal with TGP a while back. FRFR makes no sense really—who is setting the parameters on “flat”? I always wondered if that was a guitar gear geek term or if other people used it.

I’ve got good tone from an AXEFX through guitar cabs but I’ve always thought if you were going to bring a cab then what’s the point of the modeler? Modeling is attractive b/c you can bring a small rig like a Helix and run it straight to FOH and use stage monitors for yourself. If you run your modeler through a power amp and then through a guitar cab, how are you getting your signal to FOH? You either have to mic your cab (again what’s the point) of you need 2 feeds b/c what you have going to your cab is not going to work to the board.

If it isn’t saving me time and space then I’m using my real amps
Click to expand...

For your first question, "who is setting parameters on flat?" I'm not sure I'm understanding you. It's not about setting your amp's tonestack flat. "FRFR" just means "accurate" as in "an FRFR speaker will output exactly what you put into it, nothing more nothing less." Using them means you hear the same thing as front of house (and therefore the audience) so by using FRFR you get a better picture of your actual tone.

Saying "FRFR" in this context just highlights that you're talking about traditional speaker design as opposed to the super colorful and super inaccurate world of guitar speakers. So yeah, "FRFR" is probably a phrase for people like guitar players who use intentionally "imperfect" equipment as a part of their core tone most of the time. The best description of a 4x12 guitar cab I've ever heard was "a hilarious parade of accoustic design errors that just so happens to provide the perfect filter through which to send a guitar amp."

As for your other question, "why would you run a modeler through a real cab?" Well, for same reason you'd run an amp's line out into an IR loader to send to front of house. It's so you can have your cake and eat it too, basically. You can get all the pants flapping goodness of a real cab behind you AND you get the totally consistent, 100% dialed-in sound of your favorite mic'd cab in the form of an IR to send to front of house instead of having to rely on some sound guy who doesn't give a shit just slinging a 57 in front of your cab and calling it a day.

As for how to do that, well in an Axe-Fx, all you have to do is this:
sP7F7G1.png

Send Output 1 to your poweramp and cab, send Output 2 to front of house, and you're good.
 
TheGreatGreen said:
For your first question, "who is setting parameters on flat?" I'm not sure I'm understanding you. It's not about setting your amp's tonestack flat. "FRFR" just means "accurate" as in "an FRFR speaker will output exactly what you put into it, nothing more nothing less.
Click to expand...
“Flat” is not a box that is checked or left blank however. You state that every so called “frfr” outputs “exactly what you put into it, nothing more nothing less”. Anyone with any experience at all with PA speakers or studio monitors knows that not all of these speakers are the same. The aforementioned Headrush 10 will not sound the same as an RCF 10” model monitor, trust me.

And if that is the case, what does flat mean again? ?‍♂️ Honest question I apologize if I’m coming across facetiously, this is why the “frfr” term always confused me. It would make complete sense if I heard it was us guitar players who coined it lol
TheGreatGreen said:
As for your other question, "why would you run a modeler through a real cab?" Well, for same reason you'd run an amp's line out into an IR loader to send to front of house. It's so you can have your cake and eat it too, basically.
Click to expand...
Don’t forget carry it as well lol. I’ve gigged with the AXEII dozens of times and I’ve gigged with the Helix dozens of times so I’m aware of what they can do routing wise (another rabbit hole—not at all easy to dial in a direct out that sounds great in every room/situation). I switched from the former to the latter because of form factor—lugging a rack along with a MIDI board along with my own monitor (because see above, not all “frfr” sound the same) was as much of a pita as bringing a head, cab and pedalboard. So the Helix was just that and my monitor.

I believe modeling can be indiscernible from real amps when used correctly, but in the end if my real amps are just as easy to bring to the gig I decided personally that would be the way to go. Not saying a modeler through a power amp and guitar cab can’t sound good, just don’t see any of the “cake” I’m missing using my tube amp->cab.
 
tallcoolone said:
“Flat” is not a box that is checked or left blank however. You state that every so called “frfr” outputs “exactly what you put into it, nothing more nothing less”. Anyone with any experience at all with PA speakers or studio monitors knows that not all of these speakers are the same. The aforementioned Headrush 10 will not sound the same as an RCF 10” model monitor, trust me.

And if that is the case, what does flat mean again? ?‍♂️ Honest question I apologize if I’m coming across facetiously, this is why the “frfr” term always confused me. It would make complete sense if I heard it was us guitar players who coined it lol

Don’t forget carry it as well lol. I’ve gigged with the AXEII dozens of times and I’ve gigged with the Helix dozens of times so I’m aware of what they can do routing wise (another rabbit hole—not at all easy to dial in a direct out that sounds great in every room/situation). I switched from the former to the latter because of form factor—lugging a rack along with a MIDI board along with my own monitor (because see above, not all “frfr” sound the same) was as much of a pita as bringing a head, cab and pedalboard. So the Helix was just that and my monitor.

I believe modeling can be indiscernible from real amps when used correctly, but in the end if my real amps are just as easy to bring to the gig I decided personally that would be the way to go. Not saying a modeler through a power amp and guitar cab can’t sound good, just don’t see any of the “cake” I’m missing using my tube amp->cab.
Click to expand...

You're not wrong in that they all sound different, but the intention of each FRFR speaker is to have a flat frequency response so it's not coloring anything. Reality doesn't really resemble that, clearly.

The only real "cake" I experience using an FM9/modeler into actual cabs is the unlimited amps and effects. Some days I want to go chugga chugga all day with Mesa's, Splawns and Peaveys, other days I want to play my hacked EJ licks into Marshalls and Twins. My cover band is always adding random shit to the setlist and while I tend to stick to the same tones throughout the set, being able to toss something specific in there in a quick amount of time is fun.
 
RevDrucifer said:
You're not wrong in that they all sound different, but the intention of each FRFR speaker is to have a flat frequency response so it's not coloring anything. Reality doesn't really resemble that, clearly.

The only real "cake" I experience using an FM9/modeler into actual cabs is the unlimited amps and effects. Some days I want to go chugga chugga all day with Mesa's, Splawns and Peaveys, other days I want to play my hacked EJ licks into Marshalls and Twins. My cover band is always adding random shit to the setlist and while I tend to stick to the same tones throughout the set, being able to toss something specific in there in a quick amount of time is fun.
Click to expand...
Def intention, but as you say that doesn’t translate to reality.

Yup, that is the advantage—essentially unlimited flexibility. I love modelers, just don’t happen to have one ATM. Always got compliments on my tone when I used them in the past.
 
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