Anyone Tried G12H-75 x G12H-30 Anniversaries?

glpg80

glpg80

Well-known member
Anyone tried Creamback H-75 with H30 Anniversaries before? If so what did you think? Debating building a cab with these
 
I'm going to run the H75 in a separate cab and mix with my creamback g12m-25. If I can find a dark cab I may use the anniversaries. The 30s are bright from the rumor I heard but we'll see.
 
Exo-metal said:
I'm going to run the H75 in a separate cab and mix with my creamback g12m-25. If I can find a dark cab I may use the anniversaries. The 30s are bright from the rumor I heard but we'll see.
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Glad to see I’m not the only one thinking they would do best in a mix with something. I like the idea of Creamback G12M but I think I like the top end better with anniversaries. Mesa standard cabs tend to be on the darker side IMO, I wonder if that would be an ideal candidate?
 
I have a cab with a creamback h75 and 60 watt hellatone v30, it’s ok, much prefer the h75’s together. I used to have an open back Bogner cab with an anniversary and greenback that sounded killer.
 
acidvoodoo said:
I have a cab with a creamback h75 and 60 watt hellatone v30, it’s ok, much prefer the h75’s together. I used to have an open back Bogner cab with an anniversary and greenback that sounded killer.
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Yeah, I dig the anniversary/greenback combo as well.
I have a Wizard 4x12 with 2 x EVH greenbacks up top and 2x anniversary H30's on the bottom, and it sounds fantastic.
When I got the cab, it was loaded with the 2 x Annie's, and 2x Heritage G12H30's, and it was way too much high end.
If you're stuck on using 2 Annie's, the H75 creambacks might make the cab a little harsh.
All this stuff is subjective, and you may love that combo, but that was my experience with an H magnet greenback type speaker mixed with the Annie's.
 
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Feedback greatly appreciated and it tracks with YouTube speaker recordings to my ears too. Sounds like it will be too much extended top end.

I think instead of Creamback H75 x Anni’s, I’ll try Creamback G12M-65 x G12H30 Anni’s. The 65 creambacks tend to have a more relaxed top end and more sitting-lower frequency response perfect for mixing with another aggressive speaker.
 
The GH30s have the same amount of highs as a G12T75, but with more Greenback like mids and cone breakup. My only reservation with putting 30w speakers in a 412 cab is that the cab will only have a 120w handling.
 
D-Rock said:
The GH30s have the same amount of highs as a G12T75, but with more Greenback like mids and cone breakup. My only reservation with putting 30w speakers in a 412 cab is that the cab will only have a 120w handling.
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I’ve been running 25W greenbacks in a 100W cab and giving them hell like there’s no tomorrow for extended periods during circuit development and they’re doing just fine. Two G12M-65 are 120W handling on their own so the cab would be around 180W when mixed with H30s.
 
fusedbrain said:
Yeah, I dig the anniversary/greenback combo as well.
I have a Wizard 4x12 with 2 x EVH greenbacks up top and 2x anniversary H30's on the bottom, and it sounds fantastic.
When I got the cab, it was loaded with the 2 x Annie's, and 2x Heritage G12H30's, and it was way too much high end.
If you're stuck on using 2 Annie's, the H75 creambacks might make the cab a little harsh.
All this stuff is subjective, and you may love that combo, but that was my experience with an H magnet greenback type speaker mixed with the Annie's.
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I'd love to hear your Wizard Cab. I have a Marshall 1960BHW with 4 G12H30 Heritage & it's bright & fizzy.
 
D-Rock said:
The GH30s have the same amount of highs as a G12T75, but with more Greenback like mids and cone breakup. My only reservation with putting 30w speakers in a 412 cab is that the cab will only have a 120w handling.
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Yeah. like a large amount of the cabs from the 70's or the EVH Cabs.
 
glpg80 said:
I’ve been running 25W greenbacks in a 100W cab and giving them hell like there’s no tomorrow for extended periods during circuit development and they’re doing just fine. Two G12M-65 are 120W handling on their own so the cab would be around 180W when mixed with H30s.
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Nope. For any speaker cab the max wattage equals the # of speakers wired together x the wattage rating of the lowest powered speaker.

Say you have those two 30 watt G12H Anniversary and two 65 watt Creambacks all wired together in series parallel, then you would still have a 120 watt cab as a whole since 4x30=120. Feeding the cab any more wattage than that amount would risk frying the voice coils on the 30 watt speakers.

If you're playing with a group, then you also run into the problem that the G12H Anniversary is a much more sensitive speaker at 100 or 101 db iirc? Whereas the 65 watt Creamback is like 97 db iirc. I am not a fan of mixing speakers with way different sensitivities, if they're all being run from one mono amp. While it might sound perfect in one spot in front of the amp where they blend just right as you move back and forth/side to side usually the more efficient and louder speaker dominates the sound.

Now if you have two totally separate power amps, or a stereo amp with separate volumes per channel running each pair of speakers independently you could then run the pair of Anniversary G12H's at 60 watts, and the pair of Creambacks at 130 watts. This would yield 190 watts of power handling. While this seems it would be way less balanced, not so much.

Technically 60 watts fed into a pair of high efficiency speakers at 100 or so db is gonna sound just as loud as 120 watts fed into a pair of lower efficiency 97 db or so speakers. In reality each speakers frequency curve is going to impact if either will be perceived as louder.
 
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Hiwatts-n-Gibsons said:
Nope. For any speaker cab the max wattage equals the # of speakers wired together x the wattage rating of the lowest powered speaker.

Say you have those two 30 watt G12H Anniversary and two 65 watt Creambacks all wired together in series parallel, then you would still have a 120 watt cab as a whole since 4x30=120. Feeding the cab any more wattage than that amount would risk frying the voice coils on the 30 watt speakers.

If you're playing with a group, then you also run into the problem that the G12H Anniversary is a much more sensitive speaker at 100 or 101 db iirc? Whereas the 65 watt Creamback is like 97 db iirc. I am not a fan of mixing speakers with way different sensitivities, if they're all being run from one mono amp. While it might sound perfect in one spot in front of the amp where they blend just right as you move back and forth/side to side usually the more efficient and louder speaker dominates the sound.

Now if you have two totally separate power amps, or a stereo amp with separate volumes per channel running each pair of speakers independently you could then run the pair of Anniversary G12H's at 60 watts, and the pair of Creambacks at 130 watts. This would yield 190 watts of power handling. While this seems it would be way less balanced, not so much.

Technically 60 watts fed into a pair of high efficiency speakers at 100 or so db is gonna sound just as loud as 120 watts fed into a pair of lower efficiency 97 db or so speakers. In reality each speakers frequency curve is going to impact if either will be perceived as louder.
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That’s the safest assumption but that’s not how things work above DC. Speaker coils are inductors and are largely reactive devices that have a real and reactive power loss coefficients. Reactive power does work but it doesnt consume power - it just transduces as work. The loss due to resistivity is what you’re thinking of and in a parallel circuit the total power handling of the whole cabinet is a combination of adding real and reactive power just as you would add real and reactive power rating of a speaker coil itself.

When placed in parallel with a load, a real inductor, which has both a resistive and inductive component, behaves as a single equivalent impedance with a specified frequency response at that impedance, and the total real and reactive power will be the vector sum of the power dissipated by the resistive components and the reactive power handling by all speakers.

So no, the cabinet can handle well more than 120W since speakers are reactive and resistive both. You start to get into power handling trouble when you start mixing speakers with different impedances in the same cab from the same power source. That will get you into real trouble real fast. It’s even worse when you start mismatching impedances from the OT to the speaker load as well.
 
glpg80 said:
That’s the safest assumption but that’s not how things work above DC. Speaker coils are inductors and are largely reactive devices that have a real and reactive power loss coefficients. Reactive power does work but it doesnt consume power - it just transduces as work. The loss due to resistivity is what you’re thinking of and in a parallel circuit the total power handling of the whole cabinet is a combination of adding real and reactive power just as you would add real and reactive power rating of a speaker coil itself.

When placed in parallel with a load, a real inductor, which has both a resistive and inductive component, behaves as a single equivalent impedance with a specified frequency response at that impedance, and the total real and reactive power will be the vector sum of the power dissipated by the resistive components and the reactive power handling by all speakers.

So no, the cabinet can handle well more than 120W since speakers are reactive and resistive both. You start to get into power handling trouble when you start mixing speakers with different impedances in the same cab from the same power source. That will get you into real trouble real fast. It’s even worse when you start mismatching impedances from the OT to the speaker load as well.
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I'm not an electrical engineer, so much of what you said flew over my head. As far as the risk to the speakers I can only say I've seen a good few posts on forums over the years from people who fried their voice coils by utilizing mismatched cabs and feeding them too much wattage, and by the conservative ratings amp manufacturers put on their cabs when putting out amps/cabs with mixed speakers.

As far as the sensitivity rating versus percieved volume I've mixed a good amount of speakers in cabs over the years. My experience lines up pretty well with what I said in the above post. The biggest other factor seeming to be how the speakers EQ curves line up.

That's why a Greenback pairs up well with something like a V30, or G12H30, but even then the louder speaker seems to be emphasized more as I move back from the cab and around the room.
 
Hiwatts-n-Gibsons said:
I'm not an electrical engineer, so much of what you said flew over my head. As far as the risk to the speakers I can only say I've seen a good few posts on forums over the years from people who fried their voice coils by utilizing mismatched cabs and feeding them too much wattage, and by the conservative ratings amp manufacturers put on their cabs when putting out amps/cabs with mixed speakers.

As far as the sensitivity rating versus percieved volume I've mixed a good amount of speakers in cabs over the years. My experience lines up pretty well with what I said in the above post. The biggest other factor seeming to be how the speakers EQ curves line up.

That's why a Greenback pairs up well with something like a V30, or G12H30, but even then the louder speaker seems to be emphasized more as I move back from the cab and around the room.
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Oh for sure we are in agreement here - I didn’t say it was wrong, just that it’s the safest. You were quick to correct my post though and I’m just stating a fact that it’s a lot more complicated than the answer you provided. There’s nothing wrong with erring on the safe side.

Certain speakers mixed with one another could cause a worst case scenario of damage to the coils as you can’t just divide the power equally over frequency if you can’t determine which speakers will get the most current at any one point in time. You’re right in that if you’re going to mix you should do so with similar response speakers just so that risk is mitigated alone. Also don’t go asking for trouble mixing a 15W speaker with a 150W for example. That is exactly why companies rate on the far conservative side for legal reasons and don’t venture too far off on wattage ratings if mixing speakers at all.

You go throwing 100W reactive power into a 465W cabinet with a single 15W speaker and it’s obvious what outcome you’ll get. It’s not close to what the speaker was ever intended to work within even if the load is equally or unequally spread (depending on frequency response characteristics) across other three other 150W rated speakers.
 
glpg80 said:
I’ve been running 25W greenbacks in a 100W cab and giving them hell like there’s no tomorrow for extended periods during circuit development and they’re doing just fine. Two G12M-65 are 120W handling on their own so the cab would be around 180W when mixed with H30s.
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No to calculate cab wattage it's the lowest powered speaker x 4. You don't just add up all the wattages for a total.
 
D-Rock said:
No to calculate cab wattage it's the lowest powered speaker x 4. You don't just add up all the wattages for a total.
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Safest is lowest wattage x 4. However that rule of thumb exists only for safety margin. Go read post 13 for actual power handling.
 
glpg80 said:
Safest is lowest wattage x 4. However that rule of thumb exists only for safety margin. Go read post 13 for actual power handling.
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Why run any rig unsafely? It's a rule that everyone follows for good reason.
 
D-Rock said:
Why run any rig unsafely? It's a rule that everyone follows for good reason.
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Who said anything about unsafe conditions? Either you understand reactive power and know what you’re doing or you don’t and you err on the side of caution. There’s no wrong either way.
 
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