AxeFx vs Kemper vs real amplifier.

[squank]

10 more years and its all over for tube amps

Hahahaha!

No.

I dunno about 10 years (but perhaps), but it's coming soon. Heck, people have been recording with PODs for years and many guitarists were none the wiser. I gigged an AxeFX for years and fooled a lot of people. The Kemper's even closer, and is just one more step in that direction.

When it comes to gear, electric guitarists (as a group) are the most old-fashioned, conservative, close-minded people anywhere. It will take a while for a lot of them to even entertain the idea of switching. Many simply won't do it, "dying with their boots on" so to speak. But the younger players are adopting the technology at a much faster rate.

They're all tools. I have no resistance to technology. I just like what I have because it works. No need to fix it.

Bottom line for me is that with all the technology out there, records don't sound any better, people aren't writing better songs than in the past and typically, from my experience live guitar tone doesn't sound any better than it has in the last 30 years.

So what's really the point of it all if it has not assisted in making better sounding records or live shows?

I wasn't singling you out at all, just commenting on the general opinion.

But I would definitely argue that guitar tone sounds much, much better than they did in the 80s. Part of that, of course, is due to better PA gear. Another part is that amps have gotten better. But a Kemper makes it even easier to get great amp tones on record or through the PA than any of the many of amps I've owned.

Songwriting quality is another subject

 

[guitarmike]

My situation is a little different in that my body has told me that if I am to continue gigging it will not be with 1/2 stacks. I am down to 2 amps, a CCV and a BE-100. I will have to sell one to buy a modeler. I realize the modeler will never quite be the same as an amp, just like no 2 amps are the same, I am ok with that. I would dial in 3 tones that were "my" sound, clean, crunch, and metal, and probably use my pedals in the loop like I am now. I like the idea of the Kemper more but as I said earlier, try to find a clip of it in a live band situation, very difficult to find. I am starting to gig with a 1x12, perhaps getting a lunchbox amp like the pink taco or a Friedman modded Jet City is the answer.........

 

[Shark Diver]

When I had the Axe it was for covers. Everything from Etta James to Chic to VH to Guns and Roses. Hard to get one amp to do that,

Went back to an amp since the tonal spectrum I need has been shrunk to strictly New Wave and Hairband tones. Amp and a few pedals do that fine.

Haven't tried the Axe II or Kemper. Heard the Kemper at the LA Amp show, but just through little studio monitors. It was ok. But without really trying it who knows?

I can cover that many tones and then some with a Stratocaster with a bucker and a tap with a couple pedals and a Plexi. It's all in the volume knob, tone knob and pickup selection.

No, you can approximate it

If that was true then why would there be Mesa camps, Marshall, Fender, Soldano, etc camps. They sound different enough that they all have there following. If not we'd all play the same amp, with the same cab/speaker, etc.

I've gotten more gigs from my tone than from my playing believe me. Some Casino-Show bands are extremely particular. I did a few gigs with a 50's band that "put up with" my Axe Fx tones a few years ago, but insisted I hide it behind a combo amp. In the end they bitched so much that I ended up getting a Fender combo.

Sure many bands I've been in we don't even think about trying to sound like the original. That wasn't the vibe of those bands. But some require a more exact effort.

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

I've never had an issue and actually enjoy the band as a whole being able to switch gears and cop different styles and flavors - much like a really great actor. It is an art that is easy to dismiss until you try it.

 

[Mailman1971]

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

Man you nailed it right there!!! I like to have 'my tone'.....then play every thing around it....maybe slightly tweaking it.
I can cover Zepplin.....to Thin Lizzy.....to Lamb of God. Same amp....just tweaking the settings a little....adding a boost here and there. I try to switch between amps mid session.....

Fucks me up.

 

[Shark Diver]

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

Man you nailed it right there!!! I like to have 'my tone'.....then play every thing around it....maybe slightly tweaking it.
I can cover Zepplin.....to Thin Lizzy.....to Lamb of God. Same amp....just tweaking the settings a little....adding a boost here and there. I try to switch between amps mid session.....

Fucks me up.

And I agree. But those are all rock songs. Now use the same amp/tone for country, disco, RB, Old School, etc. Yeah, I know all you guys would rather die first

 

[Mailman1971]

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

Man you nailed it right there!!! I like to have 'my tone'.....then play every thing around it....maybe slightly tweaking it.
I can cover Zepplin.....to Thin Lizzy.....to Lamb of God. Same amp....just tweaking the settings a little....adding a boost here and there. I try to switch between amps mid session.....

Fucks me up.

And I agree. But those are all rock songs. Now use the same amp/tone for country, disco, RB, Old School, etc. Yeah, I know all you guys would rather die first

Touche'.....
I never dabble outside the rock block.....
would love to try something different. But cant get past my comfort zone?

 

[Shark Diver]

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

Man you nailed it right there!!! I like to have 'my tone'.....then play every thing around it....maybe slightly tweaking it.
I can cover Zepplin.....to Thin Lizzy.....to Lamb of God. Same amp....just tweaking the settings a little....adding a boost here and there. I try to switch between amps mid session.....

Fucks me up.

And I agree. But those are all rock songs. Now use the same amp/tone for country, disco, RB, Old School, etc. Yeah, I know all you guys would rather die first

Touche'.....
I never dabble outside the rock block.....
would love to try something different. But cant get past my comfort zone?

And that was the bitch for me. Learning funk and country kicked my ass to be decent at it. But I'm kind of a jack of all trades, but not really good at any of it.

 

[Mailman1971]

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

Man you nailed it right there!!! I like to have 'my tone'.....then play every thing around it....maybe slightly tweaking it.
I can cover Zepplin.....to Thin Lizzy.....to Lamb of God. Same amp....just tweaking the settings a little....adding a boost here and there. I try to switch between amps mid session.....

Fucks me up.

And I agree. But those are all rock songs. Now use the same amp/tone for country, disco, RB, Old School, etc. Yeah, I know all you guys would rather die first

Touche'.....
I never dabble outside the rock block.....
would love to try something different. But cant get past my comfort zone?

And that was the bitch for me. Learning funk and country kicked my ass to be decent at it. But I'm kind of a jack of all trades, but not really good at any of it.

I get like that when we try to do Old Rush or Pink Floyd....(cleans with Delay)...
I get nervous and choke.

 

[stephen sawall]

I learned different styles right from the beginning. I have no problem & often do change the sound I am using. I play rock & heavy ... but never considered myself that kind of guitar player. I just play guitar ....

Today I have been playing guitar on & off all day... used several different amps & used dozens of sound types.

 

[Mailman1971]

I tried to learn Skynard/Zepplin back when I started......but the lure of Hair metal ruled me.

 

[TrueTone500]

What would be cool is a software program that duplicates your current amplifier circuit via inputing the schematic data. First you would make a sonic profile of your actual amp, same as you do with a Kemper. Converted into a digital file, this would serve as the stock amplifier tone. Then using this sonic profile, you could make 'virtual mods' on your computer to whatever area of the circuit you wish. Want to hear what your amp would sound like with an alternate value coupling cap off the cathode resistor? How about changing the value of the slope resistor? Or maybe you're thinking of swapping a bypass cap? I think you can see where I'm going here... If you like what you hear, you could then make those changes to your actual amplifier. Maybe also as accessory software with Kemper and AxeFx for in-depth tweaking of modeled amps.

 

[stephen sawall]

I would consider Skynard/Zepplin both just variations of rock music .... I am talking about very different styles. Like flamingo, country, funk, R&B, blues, classical, reggae, rock, metal, jazz, hip hop, Latin, folk, Dixie Land, Motown, Progressive, Rumba, etc... I play everything...
I play finger style using all ten digits as often as a pick...& a lot of slide styles.

 

[Shark Diver]

What would be cool is a software program that duplicates your current amplifier circuit via inputing the schematic data. First you would make a sonic profile of your actual amp, same as you do with a Kemper. Converted into a digital file, this would serve as the stock amplifier tone. Then using this sonic profile, you could make 'virtual mods' on your computer to whatever area of the circuit you wish. Want to hear what your amp would sound like with an alternate value coupling cap off the cathode resistor? How about changing the value of the slope resistor? Or maybe you're thinking of swapping a bypass cap? I think you can see where I'm going here... If you like what you hear, you could then make those changes to your actual amplifier. Maybe also as accessory software with Kemper and AxeFx for in-depth tweaking of modeled amps.

Doesn't the Axe do this? I thought it went pretty deep with changing tone stacks and values.

 

[Badronald]

When I had the Axe it was for covers. Everything from Etta James to Chic to VH to Guns and Roses. Hard to get one amp to do that,

Went back to an amp since the tonal spectrum I need has been shrunk to strictly New Wave and Hairband tones. Amp and a few pedals do that fine.

Haven't tried the Axe II or Kemper. Heard the Kemper at the LA Amp show, but just through little studio monitors. It was ok. But without really trying it who knows?

I can cover that many tones and then some with a Stratocaster with a bucker and a tap with a couple pedals and a Plexi. It's all in the volume knob, tone knob and pickup selection.

No, you can approximate it

If that was true then why would there be Mesa camps, Marshall, Fender, Soldano, etc camps. They sound different enough that they all have there following. If not we'd all play the same amp, with the same cab/speaker, etc.

I've gotten more gigs from my tone than from my playing believe me. Some Casino-Show bands are extremely particular. I did a few gigs with a 50's band that "put up with" my Axe Fx tones a few years ago, but insisted I hide it behind a combo amp. In the end they bitched so much that I ended up getting a Fender combo.

Sure many bands I've been in we don't even think about trying to sound like the original. That wasn't the vibe of those bands. But some require a more exact effort.

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

I've never had an issue and actually enjoy the band as a whole being able to switch gears and cop different styles and flavors - much like a really great actor. It is an art that is easy to dismiss until you try it.

Apparently you've never played a good Stratocaster through a good Plexi with a couple boost pedals and a delay.
It's all on there. You need to make it happen.

 

[Shark Diver]

When I had the Axe it was for covers. Everything from Etta James to Chic to VH to Guns and Roses. Hard to get one amp to do that,

Went back to an amp since the tonal spectrum I need has been shrunk to strictly New Wave and Hairband tones. Amp and a few pedals do that fine.

Haven't tried the Axe II or Kemper. Heard the Kemper at the LA Amp show, but just through little studio monitors. It was ok. But without really trying it who knows?

I can cover that many tones and then some with a Stratocaster with a bucker and a tap with a couple pedals and a Plexi. It's all in the volume knob, tone knob and pickup selection.

No, you can approximate it

If that was true then why would there be Mesa camps, Marshall, Fender, Soldano, etc camps. They sound different enough that they all have there following. If not we'd all play the same amp, with the same cab/speaker, etc.

I've gotten more gigs from my tone than from my playing believe me. Some Casino-Show bands are extremely particular. I did a few gigs with a 50's band that "put up with" my Axe Fx tones a few years ago, but insisted I hide it behind a combo amp. In the end they bitched so much that I ended up getting a Fender combo.

Sure many bands I've been in we don't even think about trying to sound like the original. That wasn't the vibe of those bands. But some require a more exact effort.

So you change your guitar tone (per song) to emulate the original artist tone then? I have to use 'my' sound for everything I play. I know that my seem weird, but changing tones messes with my hearing to the point where it becomes difficult to decipher notes. Turning on a wah pedal creates a similar issue also... Maybe my hearing is busted?

I've never had an issue and actually enjoy the band as a whole being able to switch gears and cop different styles and flavors - much like a really great actor. It is an art that is easy to dismiss until you try it.

Apparently you've never played a good Stratocaster through a good Plexi with a couple boost pedals and a delay.
It's all on there. You need to make it happen.

Not sure why Vox, Hiwatt, Soldano, Mesa, Diezel, etc even bother making amps if all you need is a Plexi? They should stop making those darn LPs and Teles too. Just user error on my part apparently

 

[TrueTone500]

What would be cool is a software program that duplicates your current amplifier circuit via inputing the schematic data. First you would make a sonic profile of your actual amp, same as you do with a Kemper. Converted into a digital file, this would serve as the stock amplifier tone. Then using this sonic profile, you could make 'virtual mods' on your computer to whatever area of the circuit you wish. Want to hear what your amp would sound like with an alternate value coupling cap off the cathode resistor? How about changing the value of the slope resistor? Or maybe you're thinking of swapping a bypass cap? I think you can see where I'm going here... If you like what you hear, you could then make those changes to your actual amplifier. Maybe also as accessory software with Kemper and AxeFx for in-depth tweaking of modeled amps.

Doesn't the Axe do this? I thought it went pretty deep with changing tone stacks and values.

I don't know? I've never played through or owned an Axe or Kemper. I'd like to see a program that could be used as a stand-alone utility for pro techs and DIY's. A program that can be loaded onto a Mac/PC, and used in realtime just as if you were making actual tweaks to your amplifier circuit. Basically a digital mockup of your physical amp.

I see a day coming where you go to a company website, tweak the online 'virtual amp' to your own specs - then submit your order for a custom build!

 

[PBGas]

Kemper is a great tool. It sounds very close. I had one since Sept. Though, I recently sold it.

Why?

Simply put....I really missed having an actual amp behind me. I also found that with the Kemper, you were at the mercy of whoever made the profile. Thanks to folks like Pete (Stratotone) who has made some fantastic profiles, it wasn't an easy decision. Financially, I can't have both. So I did what I had to do (well...really wanted to do! ).

Couple that with the fact that I was a bit pissed at the Kemper folks for making a big announcement at Namm that the units would be able to be updated with a power amp, etc., promise of performance mode, a footboard only to find out a couple months later that it wouldn't be feasible, which I understand, no question....but very poor planning on their part. So, I sold the unit and have moved on. Footboard won't be out until next Namm. I could use something else but I'm not for a bandaid solution. I didn't like many of the FRFR solutions that I tried and I wasn't going to wait 12 weeks (as I was quoted) for the atomic stuff (that wait time is a joke...sorry) I like the fact that Kemper threw in the harmonizer mode but it isn't enough for me to justify keeping it.

I went with a Torpedo Live unit and it is fantastic. I get my authentic tube tone and IMHO a better sound cabinet simulation. You also have much more control of the cab. I can use my amp with it at home, in the studio and live without issue. With the Kemper, you can move cabs and make some EQ adjustments but in the end, it becomes a bit mushy as the cab was profiled for the amp intended and you have no control over the mic used and where it was pointed. Kind of like mixing milk with lemon. I found it to curdle a bit......

Either way, Kemper is a great solution and for those that like to tweak, import profiles, etc.....all done with ease. It is fun and they have a great forum with lots of help. I imagine that they have some great things planned for the future.

 

[stephen sawall]

The more I look at this stuff the more I like the Two Notes direction .... I am in no hurry & waiting a bit to see what else develops....

 

[Heritage Softail]

While waiting on the Kemper AxeII dust to settle, I bought a Rhodes Gemini to have an amp with insane midi control.

In the end, since I don't play out enough to find setting up my gear a hassle, I'm sticking with amps. If it ever comes to pass I play out enough to need more, Two Notes seems pretty cool.

Not going to buy a fake amp to emulate the real amps I own... No need to.

 

[PBGas]

While waiting on the Kemper AxeII dust to settle, I bought a Rhodes Gemini to have an amp with insane midi control.

In the end, since I don't play out enough to find setting up my gear a hassle, I'm sticking with amps. If it ever comes to pass I play out enough to need more, Two Notes seems pretty cool.

Not going to buy a fake amp to emulate the real amps I own... No need to.

This was exactly my thought. In any case, with the Two-Notes setup, you could simply bring your head, the Live and a pedalboard and be done with it. I did this last night at a gig and the stage was pretty small. They had a great FOH setup and I had a stage monitor which was nice. Very easy setup and teardown.

Still, Kemper is a really cool tool and fun to play with.