Bogner Überschall vs Bogner Helios Eclipse?

[Simon Dorn]

Who played both?
I have a Mesa Dual Rev F with the matching leather tolex cab at the moment and i'm looking for a second amp (and cab, maybe).
I sold my Rev Blue in favor for the F, but i'm still thinking about another Uber
Has there been any changes to the circuit of the Rev Blue in 2018/19? I read something about that...

I'm also tempted by the Eclipse. At least i should try one.

Uber vs Eclipse vs boosted 2203 for the low tuned old school brutals?

What's your opinion?

Regards,
Simon

 

[John4021]

Own both the Blue and Eclipse

Two very different amps.
More of a Marshall grind with the Eclipse.

Rev Blue just flat out kills in the Hard rock to Metal tones.

Lot of tone options with the Eclipse . Doesn't need boosted but I hit it with a Revv G3 pedal just
for shits and giggles.

Spice of life owning both. (..and a few other Bogners.)

 

[Simon Dorn]

Thanks for your reply!
How does the Eclipse cut through the mix?
Does it have that "Marshall roar"?

I'm a bit more Marshall, than Mesa
Maybe a 2203 would be the best fit.

 

[John4021]

Sorry for not posting sooner.
The Bogner Eclipse is very British in flavor.
It's like a 4 hole Plexi but with huge gain.
The channel pre EQ voicing can be a bit darker(like jumping channel )
Or can cut in the pre EQ mode akin to the Treble input .
3 different settings make it shape the tone to your liking

 

[Simon Dorn]

Thanks, no problem!
Which of the amps is more aggressive?
I guess i just should try one, if i have the chance. Otherwise i'll never know it

 

[John4021]

Uber = ground shaking tone

 

[Simon Dorn]

Yes, but when:
Uber = ground shaking tone
then:
Helios Eclipse = ?

I need an earthquake

 

[the4thlast1]

I have an Eclipse. I have not owned and Uber. I have owned many amps that are in the ball park of an Uber though. The Eclipse is not a wide wall of sound amp if that makes sense it's very focused in the mid range. It's not like a Recto or 5150 lowend. The Eclipse has tight lows though it's not flubby at all . But once again it's just more of that punchy midrange type of tone , it has tons of gain and can do modern metal but it does it in a more classic way than the modern voiced Uber would . I would say the Eclipse would shine more in a modern rock environment than hardcore metal although it can do anything. If you want a do it all amp that has a lot of midrange cut with smooth highs and a marshall voicing you might love the eclipse. If you want "Earth Quake" I dunno lol

 

[Simon Dorn]

Thanks for your reply! Yes, that makes sense
What's holding me back a little from the Eclipse is the unbypassable diode clipping circuit. In the 90ies this was called a "design flaw" Maybe it's just me...I don't have a problem putting diode clipping in front of the amp
How would you compare a boosted Marshall 2203 (80ies, vertical input) to the Eclipse?
I have a Marshall MF400B, that's looking for a head
The Bogner Twin Jet was too tight for me. It did not have enough "balls"
And i found the Ref F bigger and fatter sounding than my Rev Blue at that time. I sold both Bogners a while ago.
Don't know why i want another one
I have the chance to play a '83 Marshall, with my equipment on wednesday. Unfortunately it's already beaten up a little too much for my taste, but technically (including the power tubes) it's all original. Will compare it to my Rev F.
I like Marshall- and Mesa-Style amps.
Maybe it's better to stay with the originals....?!

 

[the4thlast1]

I was never a big Marshall fan , but over the past couple years Ive gotten in to the Marshal style of tone but from other builders so I have only tried a few Marshall amps that were not mine briefly , like a stock 800 , a JVM and a Fortin modded 800. To be honest though I love the Eclipse but its a specific type of tone that is very smooth and harmonically rich , It has that 800 type of high midrange kick to it but its very refined and organic , it has a touch of that classic bogner ecstasy type chewiness to it also. But if you want a more raw and open bark go for the 20th anniversary Shiva that's a mean sounding amp, not really a thrash Metal amp either though its once again better suited to heavy rock ...... but it has this mean snarl to it that's awesome .

If you want a modern Metal tone I personally think as far as Bogners go it would have to to be an Ubershall or possibly the XTC red channel with a boost in front but even that tone isn't super modern and aggressive , its more of a smooth metal tone.

 

[Simon Dorn]

The Bogners are probably too smooth. I even couldn't really hear myself just jamming with a drummer, playing through the Uber+matching cab.
But the Reissue 2203s are a bit too stiff, brittle and harsh. And i don't really like the "modern" Marshalls.
I had several KKs (2 of them modded) and JVMs, DSL and TSL, SLP, 1987x but ended up selling all of them.

Will post how i liked the vintage 2203, compared to my Rev F.
My Rev F is a mean sounding amp. It needs 2 boosts and a noisegate in front of it, but it's killer
I have a nice Vintage high gain and a modern high gain and a clean channel, if i want. Actually it can do all i need...

 

[Pearly Gates]

HE100 sounded similar to a BE100 to me, certainly feel wise I think they were quite similar at high gain. Both very tight with a lot of low end, smoothed and polished sound with a midrange you hear more than feel if that makes sense. I personally prefer rawer amps than these polished & super focused amps.

 

[John4021]

You know ,the Ubershall does not have to have
the gain over 2 or 3 o'clock to shine.
I'm happy with it set below noon.
Killer rock tones with hair.

 

[Simon Dorn]

HE100 sounded similar to a BE100 to me, certainly feel wise I think they were quite similar at high gain. Both very tight with a lot of low end, smoothed and polished sound with a midrange you hear more than feel if that makes sense. I personally prefer rawer amps than these polished & super focused amps.

Yeah, me too, actually. I played a BE 100 (the latest one, before the Deluxe) in a "Messe" environment and liked it with passive pickups, though i thought it's probably too smooth and later ordered a Gen 1 BE 100 and it did not like my active pickups. So back it went.

 

[Simon Dorn]

You know ,the Ubershall does not have to have
the gain over 2 or 3 o'clock to shine.
I'm happy with it set below noon.
Killer rock tones with hair.

Yes, definitely.
But with a guitar tuned to low A it's a different story...

 

[Simon Dorn]

The guy, i talked about, brought his '83 2203 yesterday. And while i like 800s i liked my Mesa more. It's simply bigger sounding. Oh wonder

 

[Ventura]

I have an Eclipse. I have not owned and Uber. I have owned many amps that are in the ball park of an Uber though. The Eclipse is not a wide wall of sound amp if that makes sense it's very focused in the mid range. It's not like a Recto or 5150 lowend. The Eclipse has tight lows though it's not flubby at all . But once again it's just more of that punchy midrange type of tone , it has tons of gain and can do modern metal but it does it in a more classic way than the modern voiced Uber would . I would say the Eclipse would shine more in a modern rock environment than hardcore metal although it can do anything. If you want a do it all amp that has a lot of midrange cut with smooth highs and a marshall voicing you might love the eclipse. If you want "Earth Quake" I dunno lol

If ya want earthquake go with the TwinJet

 

[Simon Dorn]

I have an Eclipse. I have not owned and Uber. I have owned many amps that are in the ball park of an Uber though. The Eclipse is not a wide wall of sound amp if that makes sense it's very focused in the mid range. It's not like a Recto or 5150 lowend. The Eclipse has tight lows though it's not flubby at all . But once again it's just more of that punchy midrange type of tone , it has tons of gain and can do modern metal but it does it in a more classic way than the modern voiced Uber would . I would say the Eclipse would shine more in a modern rock environment than hardcore metal although it can do anything. If you want a do it all amp that has a lot of midrange cut with smooth highs and a marshall voicing you might love the eclipse. If you want "Earth Quake" I dunno lol

If ya want earthquake go with the TwinJet

Had one. Sold it. Liked the Rev Blue better

 

[WizardSouth-JP]

I had both, the Eclipse and Uber are very different in terms of voicing. Both have loads of gain, the Eclipse would probably cut better in a mix if that's what you need...but for bigger grunt and low end thump (assuming your bass player not around) the Uber has a bunch more.

The regular Helios had more low end than the Eclipse if I recall, but it's been a while. If the Eclipse has a little less gain, and had more low end grunt that was on par with a Rev F it would be fantastic, whereas the Eclipse as it stands is just a "good" amp. Oh, the Eclipse was also really noisy, so a noise gate is a must.

 

[Simon Dorn]

I had both, the Eclipse and Uber are very different in terms of voicing. Both have loads of gain, the Eclipse would probably cut better in a mix if that's what you need...but for bigger grunt and low end thump (assuming your bass player not around) the Uber has a bunch more.

The regular Helios had more low end than the Eclipse if I recall, but it's been a while. If the Eclipse has a little less gain, and had more low end grunt that was on par with a Rev F it would be fantastic, whereas the Eclipse as it stands is just a "good" amp. Oh, the Eclipse was also really noisy, so a noise gate is a must.

Hi,

you did the Eclipse clip in channel 3 for me on YT. Thanks again
I'm just looking for a second amp (Marshall-Style) as complement now. Don't know, why one amp isn't enough
Thought about another VH4 in the meantime. Can get one for 1600 to 1800.- But i'm not sure.
Would like to try an Eclipse. But i would have to buy it first - and then probably send it back.
Actually the Uber did not cut well - and when it did, it was too fizzy.

Any amp tips?

Regards,
Simon