Daisy chain cabs. How to wire?

[mchn13]

I'll try and be brief. My other guitarist in the band and I have 6 cabs and want to run half stacks in the middle and full stacks on the outside, with our marshall heads sitting on the halfs in the middle of the wall. My engl cabs are wired to daisy chain, but the other four marshall cabs are stereo 1960 cabs.
Trying to figure out how to wire the 1960 cabs so we can daisy chain them to 8ohms, then run them with the Engls. Is it just wiring the positive and negative from the input jack straight to an output jack?
I'm guessing I would need to bypass the circuit board in the 1960 cabs?

 

[paulyc]

You can't run an odd number of cabs (3/head)

 

[mchn13]

You can't run an odd number of cabs (3/head)

Did not know that. I thought only the ohms mattered. Back to the drawing board.

 

[paulyc]

Well, it is the ohms that matter, but an odd number of cabs will be a weird ohm load

 

[paulyc]

And if one cab is different ohms than the others it's really an odd ohm load

 

[mchn13]

And if one cab is different ohms than the others it's really an odd ohm load

Well my thought was the Engls are 8ohm cabs and the marshalls are all 16; so was going to daisy chain the 16's to 8, then run one output to the daisy chained cabs now at 8ohm combined, and one output to the engl cab which is already 8ohm, and set the head to 4 ohm. ?? But again that's why I'm asking cause I really don't know and haven't figured out how to wire the marshalls to daisy chain either.

 

[paulyc]

I'm pretty sure you can't do that, but maybe you can. If any of the cabs fail the amp is in danger, I know that. If the amps have a line out on them you could run the line out to a poweramp and then power the cab or cabs...

 

[mchn13]

I'm pretty sure you can't do that, but maybe you can. If any of the cabs fail the amp is in danger, I know that. If the amps have a line out on them you could run the line out to a poweramp and then power the cab or cabs...

They're both jcm800's(2204). They do have a di output on the back. I've never thought to use them.

 

[eternal_idol]

the only way it will work is a Pair of Marshall's with a single Engl cab, as long as there are 16ohm mono inputs on the marshalls and a single 8 ohm mono input on the engl


one custom cable to run two marshal cabs in parallel (basic speaker cable Y) and a single speaker cable to the ENGL

so your getting 8ohm from the parallel marshall cabs (16/16) and 8 ohm from the engl, you use both speaker outputs on the amp and have the ohm selector set to 4 ohms. (derp'd on the list mathing still on first coffee apologies)

This is all assuming i didn't miss understand the situation and there is 4 marshall cabs and two engl cabs total.

 

[paulyc]

In that scenario if ANYTHING (cab, cab wiring, cable, etc...) fails the Engl 8 ohm cab will see twice as much power as the lone 16 ohm Marshall cab and the speakers will be cooked, and the amp will see a 16 ohm and an 8 ohm load at the same time...YMMV.

 

[eternal_idol]

5.3 ohms on a 4ohm tap isn't going to pop one cabinet full of 60w-75W speakers. and this is purely if one of the Marshall cabs fails.

if the Engl Fails, it becomes an 8ohm load on a 4 ohm tap. Not ideal, but still both are considered a safe mismatch. It will get you thru the show, or in the most scrupulous situations the end of the song.

http://blog.hughes-and-kettner.com/ohm-cooking-101-understanding-amps-speakers-and-impedance/

 

[mchn13]

the only way it will work is a Pair of Marshall's with a single Engl cab, as long as there are 16ohm mono inputs on the marshalls and a single 8 ohm mono input on the engl


one custom cable to run two marshal cabs in parallel (basic speaker cable Y) and a single speaker cable to the ENGL

so your getting 8ohm from the parallel marshall cabs (16/16) and 8 ohm from the engl, you use both speaker outputs on the amp and have the ohm selector set to 4 ohms. (derp'd on the list mathing still on first coffee apologies)
This is all assuming i didn't miss understand the situation and there is 4 marshall cabs and two engl cabs total.

No you had it right, and that was what I was initially thinking. Only difference was going to daisy chain the marshalls(16ohm) to make it 8ohms out of one tap, and the 8ohm(engl) out of the other tap and run the head at 4 ohms. But; a Y cable to both would work too.

 

[eternal_idol]

the only way it will work is a Pair of Marshall's with a single Engl cab, as long as there are 16ohm mono inputs on the marshalls and a single 8 ohm mono input on the engl


one custom cable to run two marshal cabs in parallel (basic speaker cable Y) and a single speaker cable to the ENGL

so your getting 8ohm from the parallel marshall cabs (16/16) and 8 ohm from the engl, you use both speaker outputs on the amp and have the ohm selector set to 4 ohms. (derp'd on the list mathing still on first coffee apologies)
This is all assuming i didn't miss understand the situation and there is 4 marshall cabs and two engl cabs total.

No you had it right, and that was what I was initially thinking. Only difference was going to daisy chain the marshalls(16ohm) to make it 8ohms out of one tap, and the 8ohm(engl) out of the other tap and run the head at 4 ohms. But; a Y cable to both would work too.

the bolded part is what i got wrong initially, but caught the typo likely before anyone else saw it... i hope. i had the wrong number in there for a few seconds LOL


I think all three on one tap would cause issues and just be a total PITA, as the Marshall cabs are wired differently than Engl's, it involves to many changes, to many places for thing to be done wrong.

alternatively to a Y cable, you could make a small enclosure like a 1590BB pedal size, Use Isolating jacks one in - two out and MAKE SURE TO WIRE WITH SPEAKER GAUGE WIRE!!! this will be alot more durable and show worthy than a made@home custom cable

 

[Scumback Speakers]

Your two 16 ohm Marshall cabs would need single input jack (no stereo plate scenario works), and the 16 ohm speakers wired in series/parallel to retain the 16 ohm load. This means you'd have to rewire the Marshall cabs (if they have the stereo plate) internally. Then you'd have to make a parallel Y speaker cable for the two Marshall cabs, resulting in an 8 ohm load. At that point you'd run a single regular speaker cable to your Engl cab (8 ohms) and your custom parallel Y speaker cable to the two Marshall cabs (2 16 ohms in parallel is an 8 ohm load) and set the amp to 4 ohms.

Frankly that's a lot of work, and the Engl cab would see twice as much power as the two Marshall cabs, and a volume imbalance would occur.

I think the idea of 3 cabs isn't good, two sure, 3, no.

But it can be done, I just don't think it would turn out like you hoped. Good luck with it, though!

 

[eternal_idol]

Your two 16 ohm Marshall cabs would need single input jack (no stereo plate scenario works), and the 16 ohm speakers wired in series/parallel to retain the 16 ohm load. This means you'd have to rewire the Marshall cabs (if they have the stereo plate) internally. Then you'd have to make a parallel Y speaker cable for the two Marshall cabs, resulting in an 8 ohm load. At that point you'd run a single regular speaker cable to your Engl cab (8 ohms) and your custom parallel Y speaker cable to the two Marshall cabs (2 16 ohms in parallel is an 8 ohm load) and set the amp to 4 ohms.

Frankly that's a lot of work, and the Engl cab would see twice as much power as the two Marshall cabs, and a volume imbalance would occur.

I think the idea of 3 cabs isn't good, two sure, 3, no.

But it can be done, I just don't think it would turn out like you hoped. Good luck with it, though!

ya, didn't say anything about how it would sound, just saying it is possible.

i've had this situation work out with a pair of Marshall cabs @16ohm and an unknown brand 2 x15 @8ohm, however in this situation the 2x15 needed the extra power to actually sit balanced in the mix,

With purely only 12" speakers I think it would be hard to have a perfect balance on stage, mixing and matching efficiency would only do so much.

Sound guy is likely only to mic one cab, it would mostly just be augmenting the on stage monitors, in which case i don't think the mismatch volumes will matter, it will just add to the body of the guitar sound on stage. for rehearsals? that is just.. unnecessary?

 

[mchn13]

Your two 16 ohm Marshall cabs would need single input jack (no stereo plate scenario works), and the 16 ohm speakers wired in series/parallel to retain the 16 ohm load. This means you'd have to rewire the Marshall cabs (if they have the stereo plate) internally. Then you'd have to make a parallel Y speaker cable for the two Marshall cabs, resulting in an 8 ohm load. At that point you'd run a single regular speaker cable to your Engl cab (8 ohms) and your custom parallel Y speaker cable to the two Marshall cabs (2 16 ohms in parallel is an 8 ohm load) and set the amp to 4 ohms.

Frankly that's a lot of work, and the Engl cab would see twice as much power as the two Marshall cabs, and a volume imbalance would occur.

I think the idea of 3 cabs isn't good, two sure, 3, no.

But it can be done, I just don't think it would turn out like you hoped. Good luck with it, though!

Gotcha. Thanks for the info man. That's exactly what I need to hear. Didn't know that about the power imbalance. The other stuff is just labor, and I'm not doing it to actually use but at practice cause I have all these damn cabs around. If I do it I'm going to use a separate power amp to the odd cab instead.
I have a stereo power amp somewhere

 

[Scumback Speakers]

You are welcome for the help, mchn13.

 

[Dopethrone]

You could pitch in on a cheap monoblock styl stereo power amp and run your line outs to each sides input.

feed your cabs from there.

 

[mchn13]

You could pitch in on a cheap monoblock styl stereo power amp and run your line outs to each sides input.

feed your cabs from there.

That's what we're gonna do.

 

[Alex_S]

why would you'd like to do that? Actually I can't see any good reasons to do that?