Diezel Herbert vs Bogner Ecstacy - Zen Amps - Am I Losing My Mind?

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I've been obsessing a bit lately on potentially picking up a Bogner Ecstasy 101. So I have been doing a bit of deep dive rabbit hole research on the Ecstasy and how it compares to other amps that I own, or have owned. Most seem to report that it is a great amp, but best suited for rock to hard rock and not really favorably voiced for metal (a bit under-gained, vintage sounding and loose in the low end). I came across the Zen Amps (love their vids) Ecstasy demo video (see below) and I compared it to the Diezel Herbert (I owned one from 2006 - 2008) video. Now, I know that the Herbert has a ton of very usable gain, is definitely a "metal" amp and can sound very aggressive...But it does present as somewhat "polished and produced" sounding. In any case, if you reference the ecstasy clip at 4:53 against the Herbert clip at 2:45 (same riffs - same guitar - same player) is actually seems like the Bogner is more aggressively voiced and gained out. Am I losing my mind???...Do you guys hear what I'm hearing??? Perhaps it's how the amps are dialed in? It really surprised me as I keep hearing that the Ecstasy is not a "metal" amp...I would be very interested in any thoughts. Particularly if you have owned an Ecstasy, or compared it to other amps traditionally associated with metal tones. THANKS.




 
The Ecstasy can get plenty aggressive and could easily be used for metal, especially with the right boosts. Here's a soundcloud playlist I made a while back comparing a boosted Ecstasy 101b to an EVH 100w EL34 and Mesa Mark IV:

 
I own a mk3 Herbert and a '96 101b, so I have compared them alot.

My Ecstasy on the Red channel can absolutely do metal. Now, it won't project the huge low end without getting flabby like a Herbert can, but it can get just as aggressive, dialed in properly. Maybe even more so, with those Bogner mids, where as the Herbert is more hi-fi sounding.

That is without any boosts. For max belligerency, or the rare time I play in C or lower, I will use an external boost on the Blue channel!

Adding a 101b to your amp arsenal is a good choice: it is an equally awesome, but very different sounding and responding amp compared to a Diezel.
 
TheGreatGreen said:
The Ecstasy can get plenty aggressive and could easily be used for metal, especially with the right boosts. Here's a soundcloud playlist I made a while back comparing a boosted Ecstasy 101b to an EVH 100w EL34 and Mesa Mark IV:

Click to expand...

All those clips sound really good, very helpful...Thanks. I may actually like the number 3 clip the best...something about those mids is just nasty.
 
VHTStark said:
I own a mk3 Herbert and a '96 101b, so I have compared them alot.

My Ecstasy on the Red channel can absolutely do metal. Now, it won't project the huge low end without getting flabby like a Herbert can, but it can get just as aggressive, dialed in properly. Maybe even more so, with those Bogner mids, where as the Herbert is more hi-fi sounding.

That is without any boosts. For max belligerency, or the rare time I play in C or lower, I will use an external boost on the Blue channel!

Adding a 101b to your amp arsenal is a good choice: it is an equally awesome, but very different sounding and responding amp compared to a Diezel.
Click to expand...
Thanks brother...I think I may go after the Bogner 101A 6L6 that is for sale locally, I have not played one in person, but all the clips seem to have this quality in the mids that is really compelling and unlike my current amps.
 
polished and produced has always been the Deizel thing, id actual expect it would have been even more of a difference.
 
TheGreatGreen said:
The Ecstasy can get plenty aggressive and could easily be used for metal, especially with the right boosts. Here's a soundcloud playlist I made a while back comparing a boosted Ecstasy 101b to an EVH 100w EL34 and Mesa Mark IV:

Click to expand...

Love the tone, which one was which (or am I being daft?)
 
My XTC 101B blue channel boosted with an SD-1 and a BB2 low output pickup in a Gibson traditional. This isn’t maxed out gain wise on the amp or the pedal - there’s plenty more.

It fucks hard and gets plenty aggressive. The massive 525V on the plates loaded gives it insane headroom and they’re loud AF.

Here’s an in room mic recording

 
glpg80 said:
My XTC 101B blue channel boosted with an SD-1 and a BB2 low output pickup in a Gibson traditional. This isn’t maxed out gain wise on the amp or the pedal - there’s plenty more.

It fucks hard and gets plenty aggressive. The massive 525V on the plates loaded gives it insane headroom and they’re loud AF.

Here’s an in room mic recording

Click to expand...

Pretty nasty!
 
The XTC isn't the most aggressive amp around but it can get pretty raucous once you stop looking at the knob positions and just go with you eyes. Treble and Presence way up works great, and yep it takes boosts well.

The Herbert is very compressed but that's the Diezel way. I feel it works best in a mix, even though it's fat. I don't love the isolated tones in our video, but go to the 4:00 mark and damn it gets the job done.
 
ZEN Amps said:
The XTC isn't the most aggressive amp around but it can get pretty raucous once you stop looking at the knob positions and just go with you eyes. Treble and Presence way up works great, and yep it takes boosts well.

The Herbert is very compressed but that's the Diezel way. I feel it works best in a mix, even though it's fat. I don't love the isolated tones in our video, but go to the 4:00 mark and damn it gets the job done.
Click to expand...
Greatly appreciated sir. Yes, some of those darker voiced amps definitely require an aberrative dose of treble and presence to bring forth an aggressive tone. I have found this to be true of the VH4 as well...particularly at manageable volumes. I have to day I really enjoy your demo videos and the Diezel VH4 and Bogner 101B are a few of my favorites...There's just something unique about how the mids present in both of those amps. My primary concern about the 101B has always ne it's supposed inability to cop a convincing metal tone, but the heavy tones in your video sound fantastic. I'll find a way to try one locally for myself at some point.
 
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