Harmony help...

[The_Kid]

Hey guys, is there an easier way for me to determine what type of scale was used in a song for a harmony?

I'm trying to do a harmony section on a lead for a song and it wants to know what type of scale to use...

The song in question is Round and Round, by Ratt

 

[Rob R]

yeah i have been having problems with harmonies to, I think you just move the melody up 3 steps, or down 3 steps, sometimes you have to change the pattern a bit, thats were things get confusing

 

[K Odell]

Generally harmonies move in 3rds, but about every four notes or so you will have it move 4 notes up rather than 3. Its also dependant on the scale pattern, but I don't think "Round and Round" has anything out of the norm going on.

 

[mixohoytian]

once you buy that fancy axe fx of yours, you'll know the answer

correct, 3rds, or to be more specific, move the exact lick up 3 frets

 

[mysticaxe]

once you buy that fancy axe fx of yours, you'll know the answer

correct, 3rds, or to be more specific, move the exact lick up 3 frets

umm, 3 frets isn't a 3rd... I not a theory whiz, but a third is 4-5 frets (minor vs. major) unless I'm way off...

 

[killertone]

once you buy that fancy axe fx of yours, you'll know the answer

correct, 3rds, or to be more specific, move the exact lick up 3 frets

umm, 3 frets isn't a 3rd... I not a theory whiz, but a third is 4-5 frets (minor vs. major) unless I'm way off...

You have to follow the key diatonically. That is, make sure that you follow the arrangement of whole and half steps in the scale. In Round and Round, the solo is in A minor (actually Ab minor because they tuned down a half step). In this case the harmonic key is C major, which is the relative major key of A minor. The solo, even though it is in A minor, has a few licks that land on the natural third, a note that doesn't occur in the A pure minor (Aeolian) scale. That was/is a trick that DeMartini (and Lynch in Dokken) used quite a bit. Sounds very cool when resolving to the A5 chord since there is no third in that chord. Hope that helps. Any more questions, ask away.

 

[The_Kid]

ok, but for the mass cover band crowd, if I set a harmonic patch to kick in on a scale...what scale would it be...I can set the key and the scale...I just dont know much about scales.

Would I set it to Eb, pentatonic minor..???

 

[titanamps]

based on what killertone just said, i'd think CM would be the scale...

however, i barely understood any of what he said

 

[kasperjensen]

It depends on the chord that's played under it. Harmonies are usually derived from the rhythm instrument.

So if its Am, and you want to sing a third above it, you would sing a C.

If its an A major, you would sing a C*.

Basically, you just gotta follow the scale. Theoretically in Am (or C major) you can sing any note from the scale over it.
Think of it in the same way as doing harmony lines on the guitar...

Hope that helps.

 

[ttosh]

ok, but for the mass cover band crowd, if I set a harmonic patch to kick in on a scale...what scale would it be...I can set the key and the scale...I just dont know much about scales.

Would I set it to Eb, pentatonic minor..???

If your unit is asking for a key and a scale then it is doing Diatonic harmonies for you which is what killertone explained how to do for yourself. You just need to know the proper key and scale you want to be in. I think for the Ratt tune it has already been answered above.....

 

[squealie]

ok, but for the mass cover band crowd, if I set a harmonic patch to kick in on a scale...what scale would it be...I can set the key and the scale...I just dont know much about scales.

Would I set it to Eb, pentatonic minor..???

Killertone is on the money. But since they change the harmony to resolve to an AMaj diad, only in spots, you will have a difficult time recreating the harmony precisely with a box.

Live, youd certainly be able to get away with A minor (C maj) and forget it. Make sure you offset it if you downtune your guitar.

 

[killertone]

ok, but for the mass cover band crowd, if I set a harmonic patch to kick in on a scale...what scale would it be...I can set the key and the scale...I just dont know much about scales.

Would I set it to Eb, pentatonic minor..???

No, the solo section is in A minor. Just set your harmonizer to A minor or C major and wail away. If you are tuning doen a half step like they did, then it would be Ab minor or B major (Cb).

That is a cool tune, have fun.

 

[stephen sawall]

I never realized none of you know much about theory at all .... every answer so far is wrong. Some are kind of close.

Harmony is any time you have more than one note. It can be any two notes.
A chord is any time you have 3 or more notes at the same time.

ABCDEFGA
CDEFGABC

This is the difference of A minor and a third up ..... it can be major or minor. You just move up 3 notes.

ABCDEFGA
DEFGABCD

This is the difference of A minor and a 4th up.

ABCDEFGA
FGABCDEF

This is the difference of A minor and a 6th up.

These are the most common used harmonies used on the guitar. I charge $30 a hour for lessons ..... but I well give a few free here if you guys need this explained more.

Feel free to ask what ever you want. I know theory pretty well.

If you do not understand what makes up scales I just as well may be speaking Japanese for many on the harmony subject..

 

[mysticaxe]

once you buy that fancy axe fx of yours, you'll know the answer

correct, 3rds, or to be more specific, move the exact lick up 3 frets

umm, 3 frets isn't a 3rd... I not a theory whiz, but a third is 4-5 frets (minor vs. major) unless I'm way off...

The context of mine was minor vs. major for a given root -
the 3rd for Am is 3 frets above the root (C)
the 3rd for AM is 4 frets above the root (C#)

I just miscounted the number of frets last night as I was half asleep...

 

[kasperjensen]

I never realized none of you know much about theory at all .... every answer so far is wrong. Some are kind of close.

Harmony is any time you have more than one note. It can be any two notes.
A chord is any time you have 3 or more notes at the same time.

ABCDEFGA
CDEFGABC

This is the difference of A minor and a third up ..... it can be major or minor. You just move up 3 notes.

ABCDEFGA
DEFGABCD

This is the difference of A minor and a 4th up.

ABCDEFGA
FGABCDEF

This is the difference of A minor and a 6th up.

These are the most common used harmonies used on the guitar. I charge $30 a hour for lessons ..... but I well give a few free here if you guys need this explained more.

Feel free to ask what ever you want. I know theory pretty well.

If you do not understand what makes up scales I just as well may be speaking Japanese for many on the harmony subject..

Really?

 

[amiller]

...
Really?

+1

 

[killertone]

I never realized none of you know much about theory at all .... every answer so far is wrong. Some are kind of close.

Harmony is any time you have more than one note. It can be any two notes.
A chord is any time you have 3 or more notes at the same time.

ABCDEFGA
CDEFGABC

This is the difference of A minor and a third up ..... it can be major or minor. You just move up 3 notes.

ABCDEFGA
DEFGABCD

This is the difference of A minor and a 4th up.

ABCDEFGA
FGABCDEF

This is the difference of A minor and a 6th up.

These are the most common used harmonies used on the guitar. I charge $30 a hour for lessons ..... but I well give a few free here if you guys need this explained more.

Feel free to ask what ever you want. I know theory pretty well.

If you do not understand what makes up scales I just as well may be speaking Japanese for many on the harmony subject..

My answer is not wrong in the slightest. Sorry. I taught guitar lessons for 10 years and was a music major in college.

 

[stephen sawall]

You guys are right .... I did not read the thread as clear as I should have .... and feel like a idiot for it. Please except my apology .... it is all I have to offer.

 

[mixohoytian]

I never realized none of you know much about theory at all .... every answer so far is wrong. Some are kind of close.

Harmony is any time you have more than one note. It can be any two notes.
A chord is any time you have 3 or more notes at the same time.

ABCDEFGA
CDEFGABC

This is the difference of A minor and a third up ..... it can be major or minor. You just move up 3 notes.

ABCDEFGA
DEFGABCD

This is the difference of A minor and a 4th up.

ABCDEFGA
FGABCDEF

This is the difference of A minor and a 6th up.

These are the most common used harmonies used on the guitar. I charge $30 a hour for lessons ..... but I well give a few free here if you guys need this explained more.

Feel free to ask what ever you want. I know theory pretty well.

If you do not understand what makes up scales I just as well may be speaking Japanese for many on the harmony subject..

but who's answer was the funniest?

 

[stephen sawall]

I never realized none of you know much about theory at all .... every answer so far is wrong. Some are kind of close.

Harmony is any time you have more than one note. It can be any two notes.
A chord is any time you have 3 or more notes at the same time.

ABCDEFGA
CDEFGABC

This is the difference of A minor and a third up ..... it can be major or minor. You just move up 3 notes.

ABCDEFGA
DEFGABCD

This is the difference of A minor and a 4th up.

ABCDEFGA
FGABCDEF

This is the difference of A minor and a 6th up.

These are the most common used harmonies used on the guitar. I charge $30 a hour for lessons ..... but I well give a few free here if you guys need this explained more.

Feel free to ask what ever you want. I know theory pretty well.

If you do not understand what makes up scales I just as well may be speaking Japanese for many on the harmony subject..

but who's answer was the funniest?

Maybe mine ?