Herbert- more gain on ch2+ ?

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Lurchhammer

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Is it possible to increase the gain saturation on channel 2+ on the Herbie?

First off, this amp is the best! Ch1 cleans and Ch3 leads are perfection.

I love Ch2+ for rhythms with it's nice mids to cut through the mix, but I have to boost it slightly with a Maxon overdrive pedal in front to get the thrash thickness/smoothness, and also to tighten the low end 'flubbiness' a bit. I hate using a pedal with an amp of this caliber because it's sooo close- just a bit more saturation and tighter bottom would do it...

Are there any trim pots inside to adjust these two aspects, or some simple resistor value changes that I can make?

Btw: My Herbert has all stock tubes (EL-34's in the power section), I use Mesa oversize cabs with Vintage 30's, Les Paul's with EMG 81's or DiMarzio Evo's, and I only play thrash/death metal. I plan on keeping this amp forever, so slight modifications hurting the resale value is not a concern for me.

Thanks for any info!
 
What exact EL34 type do you have installed (like EL34-xyz)? How old are those tubes?

What exact preamp tubes do you have installed and how old are they?

Kind regards,

Jens Kruse
 
I came from playing Engl amps, i think i know what you mean.
On channel 2 plus use more channel volume, i like mine between 1 and 2 o'clock
 
I'll have to check my tubes at next practice, but I'm pretty sure the power tubes are Ruby EL34 STR. They are a few years old, but they still sound strong. I don't have any idea what brand/type the preamp tubes are, but they are the stock ones from the factory.

I've read that 6550 tubes may tighten up the bottom end, and Chinese 12AX7's will increase gain (if that isn't what's already in there?). I'd hate to lose that great midrange grind that this amp has with the EL34's though.

I've also owned an Engl SE670 and tried both 6L6's and EL34's. It did have a tighter feel to the bottom end, but it was missing the midrange meat the Herbert has. It was almost 'hollow' sounding, if that makes sense?
 
Well, if your power tubes and preamp tubes are more than 2 years old, I recommend changing them. If you play very regularly, the power tubes might need replacement more often (like once a year). Some of our touring customers change every 6 months.
If you are loosing gain and have little bottom end, the tubes are done. The Herbert is famous for it's HUGE bottom end.

Jens
 
when i got the herbert i traded the e670 after a view months
the Engl has a better midrange but with the herbert i just play and with the engl i would always spend my time getting the right tone
anyway goodluck with the problem, if youre tubes are a view years old i would retube, when loosing the edge you wont notice it that much unless you got a other herbert there
I had the 6550 tubes in it, the bottem end was to much, id keep the el34's and the 6550 are to hot for the amp
 
Lurchhammer":2za07ep7 said:
Is it possible to increase the gain saturation on channel 2+ on the Herbie?

First off, this amp is the best! Ch1 cleans and Ch3 leads are perfection.

I love Ch2+ for rhythms with it's nice mids to cut through the mix, but I have to boost it slightly with a Maxon overdrive pedal in front to get the thrash thickness/smoothness, and also to tighten the low end 'flubbiness' a bit. I hate using a pedal with an amp of this caliber because it's sooo close- just a bit more saturation and tighter bottom would do it...

Are there any trim pots inside to adjust these two aspects, or some simple resistor value changes that I can make?

Btw: My Herbert has all stock tubes (EL-34's in the power section), I use Mesa oversize cabs with Vintage 30's, Les Paul's with EMG 81's or DiMarzio Evo's, and I only play thrash/death metal. I plan on keeping this amp forever, so slight modifications hurting the resale value is not a concern for me.

Thanks for any info!
Click to expand...

Welcome to the board :thumbsup:

Please send an email to:

peterdiezel (at) diezelamplification (dot) com
 
Not enough gain on CH2+ ? I use this channel with gain around 2 o'clock and it is way over the top ( but I like it this way), no boost. I feel that gain around 12 o'clock is optimal for cutting metal rythm sound, rest of my EQ is around 11-1 o'clock (including depth, presence, midcut) . My Herbert is one of the last MKI, stock tubes and I use mesa recto 4x12 oversized. The sound is very searing, saturated, middle voiced, no overbearing low end (as with my Roadking amp). I have also Engl Invader so playing with lot of gain is no problem for me. The gain on the Herbert CH2+ is in the same level of saturation like the Engl Invader on CH3 (higain on). Most of my guitars are equipped with emg pickups.
 
My Herbert has PLENTY of gain for any variety of metal on chan 2+ with the gain set at 2-3 o'clock. It seems that he is trying to alter the characteristics and "feel" by using a boost.
 
Thanks for all the replies!

I still haven't had a chance to check my tubes, but I will this weekend.

I'll email you Peter when I get that tube info- thank you so much for responding! :rock:

BTW: I hate to drop names, but Erik Rutan loved the definition of a Herbert they had in a Texas studio with 6550's, but they tried mine with EL34's here in Tampa and didn't care for it. They were trying different amps to blend with the Mesa-Triple-Rec rhythm tracks on the new Cannibal Corpse album.

Bato":i6fiz16b said:
When use a boost in front of ch2 it sound´s like ch3?!
Click to expand...

Similiar in saturation texture, but not in EQ. Maybe that is what I need- CH3's fluidly smooth gain and compression, but with CH2+'s EQ and bite?

Diezel US Support":i6fiz16b said:
Well, if your power tubes and preamp tubes are more than 2 years old, I recommend changing them. If you play very regularly, the power tubes might need replacement more often (like once a year). Some of our touring customers change every 6 months.
If you are loosing gain and have little bottom end, the tubes are done. The Herbert is famous for it's HUGE bottom end.

Jens
Click to expand...

Thanks! You may be right about the tubes losing gain, but there was/is always too much bottom end, but it's 'flubby'. It just needs a little EQ trimming to make it 'tight' and percussive.
 
Lurchhammer":3mppfb0e said:
Similiar in saturation texture, but not in EQ. Maybe that is what I need- CH3's fluidly smooth gain and compression, but with CH2+'s EQ and bite?
Click to expand...

Smooth comp with bite??? You´re sure this can go together?
I was a Marshall guy before i get my Herbert...a 80´s Marshall guy. And now my Herbert nearly sounds like a Marshall.
But my requirement on ch3 are more comp and smoothnes because I only play solo´s on this channel.
Also I share your opinion that ch3 isn´t as useable for tight rhythms as ch2 is.
I ch2 I dial a lot´s of treble, bass at 1 o´clock and mids at noon. Ch3 nearly all pots at noon.

Did you try to low the gain on ch3 down to about 9 o´clock. You can raise the treble and turn the midcut on. This is huge, but it´s nothing for me because it´s a horrible setting for solo´s.
 
Funny--when I had my Herbert I used channel 3 for rhythm and channel 2+ for solos.
 
1. Go with all KT88's. Same mid range, tighter bottom end, less compression with a bigger over all sound.

2. DUMP your Mesa recto cabs. The Herbert does not match well at all with the recto cab. Get yourself a standard sized cab with front loaded V30's or K100's.

3. Just use a boost in front of Ch2, works for me.
 
RJF":3tp49ikm said:
1. Go with all KT88's. Same mid range, tighter bottom end, less compression with a bigger over all sound.

2. DUMP your Mesa recto cabs. The Herbert does not match well at all with the recto cab. Get yourself a standard sized cab with front loaded V30's or K100's.

3. Just use a boost in front of Ch2, works for me.
Click to expand...

My Herbert LOVES my traditional sized recto cab.
 
spguitar":2dw04b9y said:
RJF":2dw04b9y said:
1. Go with all KT88's. Same mid range, tighter bottom end, less compression with a bigger over all sound.

2. DUMP your Mesa recto cabs. The Herbert does not match well at all with the recto cab. Get yourself a standard sized cab with front loaded V30's or K100's.

3. Just use a boost in front of Ch2, works for me.
Click to expand...

My Herbert LOVES my traditional sized recto cab.
Click to expand...
Traditional size, as in standard size. Like I said, anyone using an oversized recto cab should toss it to the ditch and get something different.
 
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