How to avoid tone sucking

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audiomidijace

audiomidijace

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I've been doing a lot of experimenting over the last year. Pickups, modules, Speaker cabs, clean boost pedals and FX. My rig sounds best when I plug directly in to my preamp and have nothing connected to my FX loop. I do jump the parallel loop and set the mix at full. It sounds wonderful. But the moment I put a clean boost pedal in front of my preamp that direct sound is gone when the pedal is bypassed. Same thing happens when I connect my TC Nova System in the series loop. Everything is set for optimum input and output levels, but my tone is seriously degraded. I get mediocre tone with really nice sounding FX. I suppose I can invest in another power amp and cabinet for a true wet/dry system, but I feel like I shouldn't have to! Is it the quality of the loop, the A/D & D/A of my digital FX or what? I also want to be able to use a clean boost and a wah pedal in front of my amp and not lose feel and tone. I don't know what to invest in to help with that.
Any ideas? :doh:
 
How old is the Nova System? I used to have a Nova Delay and it siphoned off high end frequencies. I haven't noticed any issues with their newer TonePrint gear though.

It might be just how the loop is designed? I can hear difference in EQ or volume on my amp when using the loop or even switching on the reverb.
 
Try balanced TSR cables. My antiquated Jubilee loop turned transparent after buying a cheap pair to use with my Rocktron Intellifex. Not sure why but another member here used these cables with his 5153 and it improved in the same way..I got the info from him. You're supposed to have ALL input/outputs balanced for this to work but I'm damn sure the '87 Marshalls aren't...but there it is right in front of me. Transparency.
 
What clean boost are u using in front of your preamp? is it buffered?
 
Have you tried using a little loop switcher in front of your amp and instead of turning effects off, you just remove them from the path??
 
For the problem in the loop, try this test. Connect only a single cable from send to return. Compare that tone to when that cable is disconnected. If the tone is degraded it's either the cable or the quality of the loop. I found on some amps that using the loop itself sucks tone, no matter how good the cable is and with no effects connected. One solution to this is the Fryette Power Station. I'm using it mainly as an attenuator, but it has the side effect of having a phenomenal loop, which is letting me run effects post-distortion that I stopped using with an amp that has a bad loop.

I had the Nova System and I remember having issues like this though. I picked up a used A/D/A converter. I got a Midiman Flying Cow. I ran the amp's loop to/fromit and then ran the coax digital lines to/from the Nova System. So the Nova System was hooked up only digitally, bypassing its converters. From what I recall this helped, meaning the analog-digital converters on it aren't good.

The only other fix I've found for tone suck is to use a buffer, and then to avoid using buffered pedals. Put one good buffer first in the signal chain, and use true bypass pedals following it. You can try this for the pedals between the guitar and amp, although a buffer also helped with one amp in its effects loop with issues with a true bypass pedal. But I say to avoid buffered pedals because some of them contribute to tone sucking when the pedal's effect is off.
 
Thanks for all of the input folks!
I removed the TC Nova System from the series loop
and instead go from the preamp out to the TC to the power amp.
This actually sounds much better.
I'm thinking of getting 2 of these guys:
http://www.loop-master.com/looper-micro ... -p-30.html
One to bypass my boost pedal and wah in the front of the amp
and one to bypass the TC Nova System when I want a true dry tone.
 
You need a buffer. First off , no matter how you slice it, all amps sound better when you plug straight in. Second to that though, you need a buffer of sometype built into your pedals. Screw the true bypass thing unless it is a wah. I have a koko boost which I use with the buffer on. A secret weapon I have found is the Digitech bad monkey. That's right, a bad monkey bypassed has a nice sounding buffer which adds the clarity and snap back into the tone. You may also want a looper pedal where you can swith the engaged pedals in and out of the main run as needed so that they are bypassed when off.
 
I do want to add that I'm ONLY playing in my home studio.
So I don't have any long cable runs.
I'm also only using the clean boost in the front to overdrive
my preamp.
The TC Nova System has a post boost I can use for an actual
volume boost for solos. (Not that I really need it in the studio.)
I also don't need any elaborate MIDI switching or anything
as I'm just turning FX on/off as needed. I have one preset.
I change channels on the preamp with a simple 4 button footswtich.
 
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