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CaptainCrunch
New member
OPINIONS FOR METAL
steve_k
New member
The IIC+ put the "Metal" in "Metallica".
The Simulclass runs the outer sockets in Class A or A/B. It will also allow you to safely run 34's in the outer pair and 6L6's always in the inner pair (from the factory set-up). The 60/100 is sort of a half power switch that will kill the outer pair of tubes and run only the inner pair. The IIC/III are either 60/100 or Simulclass, but never both. Different OT.
I have a Simulclass, but I run straight 6L6's in mine. Some like the 34's in there.
If you find a IIC+ with GEQ with Simulclass or 60/100, don't be too picky. Running either at the S/C or 100 watt setting will get you much metal.
Steve
The Simulclass runs the outer sockets in Class A or A/B. It will also allow you to safely run 34's in the outer pair and 6L6's always in the inner pair (from the factory set-up). The 60/100 is sort of a half power switch that will kill the outer pair of tubes and run only the inner pair. The IIC/III are either 60/100 or Simulclass, but never both. Different OT.
I have a Simulclass, but I run straight 6L6's in mine. Some like the 34's in there.
If you find a IIC+ with GEQ with Simulclass or 60/100, don't be too picky. Running either at the S/C or 100 watt setting will get you much metal.
Steve
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tripstan
New member
Steve just double checking, simulclass kills the outter pair? I thought it killed the inner pair? You have much more experience with Boogies thats why I ask. I need to get my MK III retubed, its running all 6l6's right now.
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Heritage Softail
New member
3. Make certain the speaker works properly and is plugged in correctly: single 8-ohm speaker goes in 8-ohm jack of 60 watt models BUT in 4 ohm jack with 100/60 switch in 60 RMS position on Hundred watt models (four 6L6’s) for most powerful operation within speaker ratings. The center pair of power tubes is turned on for 100 watt operation. If less power is desired use 8-ohm jack and 60 RMS.
Just google the online manual to get the entire thing.
Just google the online manual to get the entire thing.
steve_k
New member
tripstan":1n4k6t42 said:
No, Simulclass kills nothing. If you have an amp with 60/100 watt output option, it kills the outer pair and runs the 2x6L6 inner pair in Class A/B @ 60 watts.
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CaptainCrunch
New member
Thx. Was more curious about which one to buy. The simul or 60/100 and I am not sure which one James used (haven't done the research). I would be running the same set up he had into aphex eqf-2's and early 80's marshall cabs with g12 80's. A guy is selling a 60/100 and said it was more aggressive than the simul in the lead mode for metal which is all I am concerned about but wanted to ask around. I'll be calling Mike B on Monday anyways.
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Heritage Softail
New member
CaptainCrunch":2lyycqo3 said:
This is interesting. I wonder why it would? Mine is simulclass. I can tell a difference running both 6's and 34's.
Please post back what mike says. When I called about mine, I was told running all 6's would sound a little harder, edgier. The el34 mix would make it more crunchy. When I bought it, it had 6's and E34L's. I like all 6L6's for the cleanish breakup too.
Great amp either way you go.
Good luck on the tone quest.
EXPcustom
Well-known member
I ran mine in simul class with 6l6 and El34s thought it sounded crappy, agreed to trade the head to my friend but as part of the trade deal I had to take the head to mesa for new caps and filters, also one of the tube socket pins got pulled out by accident so the tube socket had to be replaced.
Anyways long story short, I picked the head up from Mesa took it to my friend's house plugged it in and regretted trading it because it now sounded totally killer and nailed early Metallica. It was already a done deal and there was no way I was getting the head back.
Moral of the story is the IIC+s now are close to 30 years old and are due for new caps and filters. Also once you give head its hard to be able to go back on it.
Anyways long story short, I picked the head up from Mesa took it to my friend's house plugged it in and regretted trading it because it now sounded totally killer and nailed early Metallica. It was already a done deal and there was no way I was getting the head back.
Moral of the story is the IIC+s now are close to 30 years old and are due for new caps and filters. Also once you give head its hard to be able to go back on it.
H
Heritage Softail
New member
EXPcustom":1tg9nfxl said:I ran mine in simul class with 6l6 and El34s thought it sounded crappy, agreed to trade the head to my friend but as part of the trade deal I had to take the head to mesa for new caps and filters, also one of the tube socket pins got pulled out by accident so the tube socket had to be replaced.
Anyways long story short, I picked the head up from Mesa took it to my friend's house plugged it in and regretted trading it because it now sounded totally killer and nailed early Metallica. It was already a done deal and there was no way I was getting the head back.
Moral of the story is the IIC+s now are close to 30 years old and are due for new caps and filters. Also once you give head its hard to be able to go back on it.
Mine is getting the tune up to stock and mod by Mike from MKIIC to +. It ain't going anywhere! It took years just to find one.
steve_k
New member
CaptainCrunch":3t7bkczr said:
Cool, report back with Mike's take on it. We need a good, "once and for all" thread on the IIC+. But, in the 100 watt mode, it is the same as Simulclass. You have two 6L6 pairs working on class A/B. Mine has a quad of the green label Mesa STR415's in it and I haven't touched them. I think that 34's on the outside will bring the amp into more of a multi-tasking palette of tone, but you will lose what you are looking for in the IIC+. One note...if you want to run 34's on the outside, you have to make sure that pins 1/8 are jumped on the trace.
Steve
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GuitarGoat
Member
steve_k":294tq18n said:
Running a 60/100 head in 100W mode isn't the same as Simulclass. In Simulclass, the inner pair of tubes is running in Class A/B and the outer in Class A. In the 100W mode on a 60/100, all of the tubes are running in Class A/B. Maybe I misunderstood what you said but just wanted to clarify...
The Simulclass power section is a little smoother while the 60/100 is a little edgier, but like someone above said, either one is awesome!
Sick Michael
Well-known member
I run el34s in the outer slots of my simul 395. Not everyone is going to like this, but the el34s on their own (class A mode) sounds great with pedals, much more musical sounding than before. Then, if im after heavy uber crunch, i just run all 4 tubes together....sounds good with clean and high gain. Slight drop in bass with the el34s but the tradeoff is fine, cause the amp now greases and grinds a bit more...still can get old metallica tones with ease....
mojotone
New member
The 60/100 is a beast of an amp for METAL. The Simul-Class is a little more well rounded in terms of musical styles. Sylvania power tubes are the absolute "bomb" to use in these amplifiers. STR-415's for the 60/100 and STR-415/STR-416 for the Simul-Class models.
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pstar
Active member
Toured with 60/100 heads, prefered the more bite and aggregression. Missed those heads.
Trick to blow other guitarist mind while gigging, don't just mike it, use slave to foh and DI to foh and the eq all 3 channels differently. Talk about a wall of sound of doom
Trick to blow other guitarist mind while gigging, don't just mike it, use slave to foh and DI to foh and the eq all 3 channels differently. Talk about a wall of sound of doom
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CaptainCrunch
New member
Thanks guys. What did you mean slave to "FOH" and "DI" to FOH?
Also have another question. Do any of you guys know how James ran his Aphex EQF-2 through the c+? I have the eq's in the mail now and am trying to find the right lunchbox rack for them and also the line levels. Has anybody researched how James ran them through his head? I am not sure that you can just run straight through the look of the c+ with these lunchbox eq's because they are on different levels?
Also have another question. Do any of you guys know how James ran his Aphex EQF-2 through the c+? I have the eq's in the mail now and am trying to find the right lunchbox rack for them and also the line levels. Has anybody researched how James ran them through his head? I am not sure that you can just run straight through the look of the c+ with these lunchbox eq's because they are on different levels?
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CaptainCrunch
New member
Forgot to ask, the c+ i am looking at now is a 60/100 with STR 430 tubes? What are the 430's? They aren't the primo green 415's. Also how do you tell if it has the 105 PT. I saw pics of the head. On on angle I see MESA in one line, next has 105-XXXXXX, next line EIAXXXX etc. On another angle of his pic I see T100 -XXXXXX next line EIAXXX etc. I am pretty sure that the 105-XX denotes its a 105 transformer not the T100 being a 100.
steve_k
New member
mojotone":2kqba2xc said:The 60/100 is a beast of an amp for METAL. The Simul-Class is a little more well rounded in terms of musical styles. Sylvania power tubes are the absolute "bomb" to use in these amplifiers. STR-415's for the 60/100 and STR-415/STR-416 for the Simul-Class models.
I've got a quad of STR415's in my IIC+. They are the original green label Mesa's. Finding a quad of any (Phillips/Sylvania/Mesa) brand of these tubes isn't easy.....or cheap.
Steve
steve_k
New member
CaptainCrunch":2f1j3pur said:
If it has 105-xxxxxx stamped on it, then it is the 105 PT. It's not for 105 watts, just the model number. EIA was the original manufacturer of Mesa's trannies, based in Illinois. 105 is on the PT. 100-xxxx will be on the OT. The 105PT is about 4" deep and is a serious hunk of iron, as compared to the others. You can generally look at the size and tell too.
Not sure about the 430's.
steve_k
New member
CaptainCrunch":1qdp2msa said:
Slave is to use the slave out on the IIC+ and send the total output of the IIC+ to an additional power amp. I do the same thing with mine, only I use the FX loop return of a modded Marshall and use the power amp of the Marshall to drive a wet cab. I use an Intellifex inserted between the IIC+ and Marshall for a wet FX system and run the IIC+ totally dry.
Slaving to the FOH would be to send the line level signal direct from the amp to a FOH (front of house) power amp and directly to the PA speakers.
DI would be used to to send the overall line level signal direct to the FOH in the same same manner, except you use a DI box instead of a mic. Radial JDX is an example. It takes the output signal and you go to the FOH mixing desk same like you would a mic.
DI would not capture the exact tone, because it has to somewhat model the sound of the cab instead of a direct mic'd sound.
Your other question about the Aphex lunchbox modules, Radial Engineering makes some lunchbox racks. These modules are standardized. I have never used them, but I am pretty sure they have only XLR in's and out's. Make sure you have 1/4 x XLR cables if you intend on running them in a loop. FWIW, I use an old Furman PQ3 for parametric EQ duties. But, not needed on the IIC+ with GEQ. I use it in the send to the Marshall power amp.
If you really want to get down to modelling James's earlier rig....for the most part, his live rig used only the IIC+ preamp section (FX loop send) into the parametric's then to the Mesa Strategy power amps. At least at one point, anyway.
petejt
Active member
steve_k":570qnxqc said:
That's the thing hey. Musicians like James Hetfield & Brent Hinds often changed little bits of their rig all the time. Heck I do as well, I'm always changing around how my pedals are configured, so much I bust my solderless patch cables! (
) . I've read that James would slave out his IIC+ to the effects loop of a mid-80s model JCM 800. And then I've also read that "Simul-Class is the main part of the sound", implying that he used the whole amp head and didn't slave out.
Now while I enjoy reading up on how other guitarists achieve their sounds, I personally find it much more fun to make my own sounds.