Requesting R&D input on a pedal looper/switcher design

[scottosan]

Not intended to be spam as I am not close to selling these, but looking at the market, there seems to be quite a bit of markup on items that don't need to be so expensive. For example. Since back into building amps and pedals solely for personal use, an seeing what's in the market I see a lot of market smack. I am a fan of true bypass, but at the same time feel that if using a lot of pedals, that the use of a high quality buffer should be taken into consideration. I am seeing 5 loop switchers costing $200 and I think that's crazy.

I am almost done with my own that has some useful features and wanted to get a feeler for what people think would be good or bad.

5 loop switcher with a single high quality buffer on the front end (Burr Brown OPA604 Opamp)

Subsequent loops are true bypass with switching switchcraft jacks so that if pedal is not plugged into that loop, you don't accidentally kill your signal by hitting the foot switch accidentally because when no pedal is plug in the jack shots to return jack.

Any combination of loops can be put in and out of circuit

Pedals can be anywhere on board and control from (1) Hammond 1032L Encluser (2.65" x 9.75" x 2.0")

All loops have LED indicator.

No graphics to drive up cost, just powder coded enclosure with easy instructions and intuitive functions.

So, I am curious people thoughts on if people think the buffer up front provides an value. It would always be in circuit. Looking at parts and power coating, I think these could be much more affordable than some of the stuff out there.

 

[fusedbrain]

An insert point between loop 3 and 4 for four cable method without losing a loop?
A tuner out that doesn't suck tone?

 

[fusedbrain]

And yes, a high quality buffer up front is a good idea

 

[scottosan]

An insert point between loop 3 and 4 for four cable method without losing a loop?
A tuner out that doesn't suck tone?

Thought about the tuner. Could use one loop for send only to tuner. Hit the footswitch sends to tuner and mutes output?


As for the loop insert, could certainly do but added jacks, added real estate. Looking for opinions. one a template is worked out, drilling a few extra holes really doesn't add to cost just a few jacks.

 

[scottosan]

An insert point between loop 3 and 4 for four cable method without losing a loop?
A tuner out that doesn't suck tone?

Thought about the tuner. Could use one loop for send only to tuner. Hit the footswitch sends to tuner and mutes output?


As for the loop insert, could certainly do but added jacks, added real estate. Looking for opinions. one a template is worked out, drilling a few extra holes really doesn't add to cost just a few jacks.

Also thought about adding a dpdt switch to each loop to assign to front end or effects loop?

 

[fusedbrain]

An insert point between loop 3 and 4 for four cable method without losing a loop?
A tuner out that doesn't suck tone?

Thought about the tuner. Could use one loop for send only to tuner. Hit the footswitch sends to tuner and mutes output?


As for the loop insert, could certainly do but added jacks, added real estate. Looking for opinions. one a template is worked out, drilling a few extra holes really doesn't add to cost just a few jacks.

Also thought about adding a dpdt switch to each loop to assign to front end or effects loop?

Yeah, that's cool. I thought adding 2 jacks for an insert point would be cheap enough. Or the dpdt switch is a good idea as well. Whatever you think would work best. Just sayin' for me and probably a lot of other guys, I'd run 3 pedals in front of the amp and 2 in the loop.
The tuner out was just a thought, but now I'm thinking most guys would probably just go guitar > tuner pedal > looper. And no tuner out keeps your looper simpler, which is part of the design goal.

Good luck with the project!
Everything you've built so far has turned out stellar

And by the way, I picked up one of those Mythical Overdrives you mentioned in the Klone thread. Really cool pedal. Thanks for the heads up!

 

[scottosan]

An insert point between loop 3 and 4 for four cable method without losing a loop?
A tuner out that doesn't suck tone?

Thought about the tuner. Could use one loop for send only to tuner. Hit the footswitch sends to tuner and mutes output?


As for the loop insert, could certainly do but added jacks, added real estate. Looking for opinions. one a template is worked out, drilling a few extra holes really doesn't add to cost just a few jacks.

Also thought about adding a dpdt switch to each loop to assign to front end or effects loop?

Yeah, that's cool. I thought adding 2 jacks for an insert point would be cheap enough. Or the dpdt switch is a good idea as well. Whatever you think would work best. Just sayin' for me and probably a lot of other guys, I'd run 3 pedals in front of the amp and 2 in the loop.
The tuner out was just a thought, but now I'm thinking most guys would probably just go guitar > tuner pedal > looper. And no tuner out keeps your looper simpler, which is part of the design goal.

Good luck with the project!
Everything you've built so far has turned out stellar

And by the way, I picked up one of those Mythical Overdrives you mentioned in the Klone thread. Really cool pedal. Thanks for the heads up!

another though. You could split a loop channel. For example the send from loop 3 could go the the front of the amp. The amp fx send could go to the return of loop 3 and the last 2 channels of the looper and the output of the the FX return. That makes me think I need to use isolated jacks to prevent ground loops

 

[Oblivion DC]

An insert point between loop 3 and 4 for four cable method without losing a loop?
A tuner out that doesn't suck tone?

Thought about the tuner. Could use one loop for send only to tuner. Hit the footswitch sends to tuner and mutes output?


As for the loop insert, could certainly do but added jacks, added real estate. Looking for opinions. one a template is worked out, drilling a few extra holes really doesn't add to cost just a few jacks.

Also thought about adding a dpdt switch to each loop to assign to front end or effects loop?

Yeah, that's cool. I thought adding 2 jacks for an insert point would be cheap enough. Or the dpdt switch is a good idea as well. Whatever you think would work best. Just sayin' for me and probably a lot of other guys, I'd run 3 pedals in front of the amp and 2 in the loop.
The tuner out was just a thought, but now I'm thinking most guys would probably just go guitar > tuner pedal > looper. And no tuner out keeps your looper simpler, which is part of the design goal.

Good luck with the project!
Everything you've built so far has turned out stellar

And by the way, I picked up one of those Mythical Overdrives you mentioned in the Klone thread. Really cool pedal. Thanks for the heads up!

another though. You could split a loop channel. For example the send from loop 3 could go the the front of the amp. The amp fx send could go to the return of loop 3 and the last 2 channels of the looper and the output of the the FX return. That makes me think I need to use isolated jacks to prevent ground loops

I don’t want to hi jack your thread, and I know it’s standard production ideas/feedback you’re interested in hearing, but if you were interested in doing a one-off project I would definitely be interested in giving you money. Please PM if you’re so inclined.

 

[fusedbrain]

You could split a loop channel. For example the send from loop 3 could go the the front of the amp. The amp fx send could go to the return of loop 3 and the last 2 channels of the looper and the output of the the FX return.

Yes, this is an option, but the loop that is used for the insert point needs to be "locked ON". If you were to accidentally hit the switch, and turn that loop off, you lose your signal. And you lose the use of a switching loop. I think a dedicated insert point is better.

 

[CrazyNutz]

If I was going do do it, I would make it basically a small programmable switching system.

Using these $3 Arduino nanos https://www.ebay.com/itm/3Pcs-USB-CH340 ... SwOyZZdMHL

Your switches are momentary to signal the a DIO on the ucontroller, the ucontroller then activates a set of relays that control what loops you want to switch on/off.
Gives your the ability to assign patches.

I would be interested in doing one like this. I could whip up the code for the Arduino in no time if you were interested.

Momentary footswitches, and relays, with the ucontroller would be just a tad higher price than high quality 3pdt latching foot switches.
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/E- ... 5sXQ%3d%3d
https://www.mouser.com/_/?Keyword=G5V-2-H1-DC5

 

[scottosan]

If I was going do do it, I would make it basically a small programmable switching system.

Using these $3 Arduino nanos https://www.ebay.com/itm/3Pcs-USB-CH340 ... SwOyZZdMHL

Your switches are momentary to signal the a DIO on the ucontroller, the ucontroller then activates a set of relays that control what loops you want to switch on/off.
Gives your the ability to assign patches.

I would be interested in doing one like this. I could whip up the code for the Arduino in no time if you were interested.

Momentary footswitches, and relays, with the ucontroller would be just a tad higher price than high quality 3pdt latching foot switches.
https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/E- ... 5sXQ%3d%3d
https://www.mouser.com/_/?Keyword=G5V-2-H1-DC5

definately something I like to try for home use, but if I were to offer small batches, I'd want to keep costs down. I'll take a look at those

 

[scottosan]

You could split a loop channel. For example the send from loop 3 could go the the front of the amp. The amp fx send could go to the return of loop 3 and the last 2 channels of the looper and the output of the the FX return.

Yes, this is an option, but the loop that is used for the insert point needs to be "locked ON". If you were to accidentally hit the switch, and turn that loop off, you lose your signal. And you lose the use of a switching loop. I think a dedicated insert point is better.

Yea, thanks for the input, that's why I'm asking, so I can think of all ways to make it foolproof

 

[scottosan]

Also not sure I want to do the buffer.

 

[scottosan]

there really isn’t much to a buffer. This was less than $20 and I used an audiophile opamp. Minimal parts in signal path