Signal degradation in the effects loop

[spanny]

So we all know the rule with longer the cable, more likelihood of signal degradation. How much of that rule applies to using your amps effects loop? I’m running all of my effects in front of the amp except my delays in the effects loop.

 

[crwnedblasphemy]

depends if it is serial or parallel...and loop design.

 

[spanny]

depends if it is serial or parallel...and loop design.

I should have specified... I am using the serial loop of a Diezel VH4.

 

[1meanplexi]

depends if it is serial or parallel...and loop design.

I should have specified... I am using the serial loop of a Diezel VH4.

Hmmmm !!!! I use a boss giga delay through the serial loop on my 4. No issues, Works better in that loop than the Parallel.

 

[tripstan]

IMO Diezel's fx loops are second to none. Volume pedals work amazing in them too.

 

[TP Parter]

Seeing as the loop send should be a low impedance line level signal, then you should be able to drive a good bit of cable with little to no loss as long as it's quality cabling.

I run all of this (left and right, not the Peebee in the middle)...

With no appreciable signal degradation.

I worry much more about tone suck before my amp than I do in the loop. Also, I find most tone loss as far as fx loops are concerned comes from one of the following...

1. Not matching signal levels as close to unity gain as possible
2. Too much compression caused by high gain tubes in the loop send and return slots (I prefer old American 5751's, GE, Phillips, JAN or Military tubes are fine) etc... Cuts back on excess compression, improves clarity and dynamic range, & reduces noise. (see also 1).

Yeah, it's the 50' in front of the amp I'd worry about, and not the 50' after the loop. I use Canare GS6 and George L's in front of my amp, and use the Rocktron Loop 8 to switch all my "before amp" pedals out of the signal path when not in use.

I've got almost 30' of low capacitance cable in front of the Mesa (15'+ between board and amp input, and 12'+ between guitar and board). The fx send and return between the Mesa & Loop 8 is another 18'+ each way, and the send to the other stereo amp's return is 18'+. So on either side I've got 66' of cable between the guitar input and each amplifier's fx return. That doesn't include the cabling between my pedals and the pedal switcher, so at times maybe add anywhere between as little as 6" to as much as 4' more cable.

 

[spanny]

Yeah, im essentially running the 4 cable method to my pedalboard with 25' cable, so essentially 100' of cable by the time it hits the amps return.

 

[TP Parter]

Yeah, im essentially running the 4 cable method to my pedalboard with 25' cable, so essentially 100' of cable by the time it hits the amps return.

That's why I roll my own cables to length. I literally make my board to amp input ~3' less than my FX send/returns because I know I need exactly that much less to reach the jack and have the cable sit right without kinking or stress. And I know that the tone loss from capacitance is much more pronounced on high impedance signals (guitar to board and board to amp). It also keeps my snake cleaner, because instead of a big Medusa head each cable comes off the snake at the exact right length. It also helps make it easy peasy to know what cable goes where, it's always the one cut to the exact right length to reach that spot.

Likewise I keep my guitar to board lead ~12' because I know I don't need anymore than that to reach the pedal board, and that I won't be moving any further than that from the board when I'm playing.