..::Video::.. Celestion Greenback 08Ω vs 16Ω

[Del Rei]

Hey, guys!!

Recorded this video today, comparing 02 Greenbacks with different impedances!

Hope it's useful for someone!

 

[sg guy]

-George Lynch says 8ohm speaker's sound better, only thing I'm positive about is 8ohm speaker's are louder-(half the resistance)-in my V-30/Greenback cab, where you have to put the V-30's on the bottom, Greenbacks on top due to efficiency to hear the Greenbacks, I have one 8ohm 55hz greenback on the bottom, and two 16ohm V-30's-(in parallel)- on top because the 8ohm greenback is that much louder-(yes, detuned cab, and it sound's FUCKIN huge!!!)-

 

[Kapo_Polenton]

Wow! This is a tough one... they both sound great. The 16 are maybe a tad more woody and not as tight and the 8 sound fuller and tighter. It really depends on the sound you would be going for. Maybe dirty Indy rock or punk dudes would like that woody tone more.. metal guys will prob dig the 8 more. I can go either way on this to be honest. There isn't a loser.

 

[JamesPeters]

only thing I'm positive about is 8ohm speaker's are louder-(half the resistance)

Impedance shouldn't be a factor in this if you're matching the impedance with your amplifier.

If the sensitivity rating is higher for one version though, that will make it louder all else being equal. It's possible the 8 ohm version is more sensitive than the 16 ohm version.

 

[maddnotez]

So this is two different speakers I assume? And not just wired at different ohms?

Was just having a debate on this at GAB.

 

[FourT6and2]

Is this just one speaker of each? So one 8 ohm speaker into 8 ohm output on amp? And one 16 ohm speaker in 16 ohm output of amp?

Sounds good, thank! I do think the 8ohm speaker was a tiny bit tighter. Other than that, pretty similar.

 

[mixn4him]

Only thing you should be hearing is the Output transformer and less windings of the transformer at 8ohms, speaker impedance shouldn't change tone...

 

[JamesPeters]

So this is two different speakers I assume? And not just wired at different ohms?

Was just having a debate on this at GAB.

I'm assuming the OP is using an 8 ohm greenback with the amp set at 8 ohms, and a 16 ohm greenback with the amp set at 16 ohms.

Only thing you should be hearing is the Output transformer and less windings of the transformer at 8ohms, speaker impedance shouldn't change tone...

There are differences in resonant peaks between the two models since they have to be made a bit differently for one impedance or another. This means they do in fact sound a bit different even when properly matching impedances. (The same goes for other models of speakers.)

As for the thought about the number of transformer windings being used, that seems to factor less into the sound than the difference in 8 ohm versus 16 ohm version of a speaker. (In my experience anyway.)

 

[Racerxrated]

^^James, I have a question. I'm assuming I can do this...I just got a 8 ohm 1977 Marshall blackback cab. My other vintage cab is a 74 16 ohm Marshall with creambacks. I should be able to run both cabs if my Marshall is set to 4 ohms correct? I know the 16 ohm will run less efficiently...
Thanks

 

[JamesPeters]

^^James, I have a question. I'm assuming I can do this...I just got a 8 ohm 1977 Marshall blackback cab. My other vintage cab is a 74 16 ohm Marshall with creambacks. I should be able to run both cabs if my Marshall is set to 4 ohms correct? I know the 16 ohm will run less efficiently...
Thanks

The total impedance is 5.33 ohms so you could set your amp for either 4 or 8 ohms. Either way is a mismatch of approximately the same percentage, and neither mismatch is particularly bad. And yes the 16 ohm cab will sound quieter than the 8 ohm cab. Lots of people who try this later say it's not worth bothering because of that difference.

 

[Racerxrated]

^^James, I have a question. I'm assuming I can do this...I just got a 8 ohm 1977 Marshall blackback cab. My other vintage cab is a 74 16 ohm Marshall with creambacks. I should be able to run both cabs if my Marshall is set to 4 ohms correct? I know the 16 ohm will run less efficiently...
Thanks

The total impedance is 5.33 ohms so you could set your amp for either 4 or 8 ohms. Either way is a mismatch of approximately the same percentage, and neither mismatch is particularly bad. And yes the 16 ohm cab will sound quieter than the 8 ohm cab. Lots of people who try this later say it's not worth bothering because of that difference.

Ok thanks.

Here's an observation, this blackback cab came to me with just the 4 corner screws in the back panel. I noticed that I didn't have any feedback even at high gain, I just attributed that to the type of GB they are, T1871, supposedly more open sounding. I found some screws and tightened it down. Boom, feedback like any other cab.

Does this make sense? Or just some weird coincidence?

 

[JamesPeters]

Ok thanks.

Here's an observation, this blackback cab came to me with just the 4 corner screws in the back panel. I noticed that I didn't have any feedback even at high gain, I just attributed that to the type of GB they are, T1871, supposedly more open sounding. I found some screws and tightened it down. Boom, feedback like any other cab.

Does this make sense? Or just some weird coincidence?

Interesting. If I had to guess what's going on: having only the 4 corners with screws allows the back to flex enough such that whatever frequencies are feeding back get cancelled to a degree (as the speaker reacts differently due to the difference in damping that's specific to that situation). Perhaps that energy is coincidentally in the frequency region that it is, and relative to the cab's construction/materials/etc. (in other words I wouldn't expect a different cab to yield the same results exactly under these circumstances). Anyway if you want to know if this is happening, test it one more time both ways. It sounds obsessive but it's pretty much the only way of knowing. And then if you want to measure a bunch of stuff and do math you can go further...but again it'll probably only apply to that cab (to the extent it does) and not be a universal thing.

I'm also betting that with only a few screws holding the back panel in place, it felt like it had more "movement" and "warmth" in the sound...but it also probably didn't do so great with lots of gain and bass at higher volumes (not as "tight" sounding). That's something I've noticed in cabs which aren't very well sealed. I'd bought a Marshall GB loaded cab that sounded "vintage" and it turned out the center post wasn't attached to the back panel and a bunch of screws were loose. After fixing that, it sounded more stiff and "not broken in" that's for sure. I came up with a "relic mod" to imitate that: insert thin washers between the speakers and the baffle so that some air can escape a bit there at higher volumes. That way it's easier to control the amount of "vintageness" the cab had in its sound. And all the screws can be properly tightened, so nothing's going to fall apart or continue to just get looser.

 

[Racerxrated]

Ok thanks.

Here's an observation, this blackback cab came to me with just the 4 corner screws in the back panel. I noticed that I didn't have any feedback even at high gain, I just attributed that to the type of GB they are, T1871, supposedly more open sounding. I found some screws and tightened it down. Boom, feedback like any other cab.

Does this make sense? Or just some weird coincidence?

Interesting. If I had to guess what's going on: having only the 4 corners with screws allows the back to flex enough such that whatever frequencies are feeding back get cancelled to a degree (as the speaker reacts differently due to the difference in damping that's specific to that situation). Perhaps that energy is coincidentally in the frequency region that it is, and relative to the cab's construction/materials/etc. (in other words I wouldn't expect a different cab to yield the same results exactly under these circumstances). Anyway if you want to know if this is happening, test it one more time both ways. It sounds obsessive but it's pretty much the only way of knowing. And then if you want to measure a bunch of stuff and do math you can go further...but again it'll probably only apply to that cab (to the extent it does) and not be a universal thing.

I'm also betting that with only a few screws holding the back panel in place, it felt like it had more "movement" and "warmth" in the sound...but it also probably didn't do so great with lots of gain and bass at higher volumes (not as "tight" sounding). That's something I've noticed in cabs which aren't very well sealed. I'd bought a Marshall GB loaded cab that sounded "vintage" and it turned out the center post wasn't attached to the back panel and a bunch of screws were loose. After fixing that, it sounded more stiff and "not broken in" that's for sure. I came up with a "relic mod" to imitate that: insert thin washers between the speakers and the baffle so that some air can escape a bit there at higher volumes. That way it's easier to control the amount of "vintageness" the cab had in its sound. And all the screws can be properly tightened, so nothing's going to fall apart or continue to just get looser.

I'm gonna take the screws out that I put in, and try again. Then I'll do the same with my other greenback cab and see how that one performs....

It would seem that the previous owner did it on purpose, I bought it used from GC and when they sent pics I thought the lack of screws meant the speakers got pulled before trade in, but nope..all original.

I will report back over the weekend.

 

[Del Rei]

Hey, guys!
Thank you for the comments!!

Yeah, I used two different speakers.
One 8 Ohms and the other 16 Ohms.
And used the Friedman Smallbox to run the cabinet (isobox)... And set the corresponding output for each speaker, sure.

 

[AndyK]

Cool! The 8 ohms sounds way richer and tighter. I just ordered some Lynchbacks (8 ohm), hope they sound as good!