What’s wrong with my Blackback speaker?

Cap217

Active member
I have a 77 marshall cab. Sounds great. Full volume nothing cuts out. But at lower volumes on palm mutes I hear a clear crackle. I didn’t pinpoint a speaker yet but it sound bad. When louder it masks it and at lower volumes it’s not pushing it hard enough to crackle.

I don’t think it’s blown. Handles power so far and sounds great. Ohm meter shows all are correct.

Where do I start? It’s not a loose part in the cab either.
 

SpiderWars

Well-known member
Is it louder in front of the speaker or back? I would check to see if the dust cap (front) or spider (back) has become partially unglued.
 

Techdeth

Well-known member
How are the blackjacks over all ? I have no experience with them but there’s a local cab for sale with them
 

SpiderWars

Well-known member
How are the blackjacks over all ? I have no experience with them but there’s a local cab for sale with them
To me they sound most similar to Greenbacks but a little more sizzle and a tiny bit less of the GB midrange color.


My first thought when I played thru my '78 cab with BB was VH1. Not saying he used them, I think the sizzle there comes from the JBLs. But just for comparison sake, that's the way they differ from a Greenback.

Mine are G12M 25W with 75Hz cones There is also at least one bass version.
 

Techdeth

Well-known member
To me they sound most similar to Greenbacks but a little more sizzle and a tiny bit less of the GB midrange color.


My first thought when I played thru my '78 cab with BB was VH1. Not saying he used them, I think the sizzle there comes from the JBLs. But just for comparison sake, that's the way they differ from a Greenback.

Mine are G12M 25W with 75Hz cones There is also at least one bass version.
Thanks for the info ! Definitely new to these speakers
 

Racerxrated

Well-known member
Blackbacks sound flat to me until you put some volume to them. But at lower to med volumes, hard pass. I've tried 3 cabs and they all had that same result. After the first cab, I thought they were just spent. But then the next two, same thing. The earlier cream/grey backs sound much better to my ears.
OP, maybe that's what you're experiencing?
 

ericb

Active member
Blackbacks sound flat to me until you put some volume to them. But at lower to med volumes, hard pass. I've tried 3 cabs and they all had that same result. After the first cab, I thought they were just spent. But then the next two, same thing. The earlier cream/grey backs sound much better to my ears.
OP, maybe that's what you're experiencing?

Not my experience, but 1 Blackback doesn't equal another Blackback. . .I had 4 30 watt Blackbacks in my late 70's Marshall 4x12, and they were absolutely great at all volumes but too bright for me. Of course I could hear back then. . haha. . I got it in the mid 80's probably and ended up selling 2 of them , and having 2 reconed into Blues. . that didn't work so I sold them to Scumback speakers to redo again. . Anyway, they were incredible speakers at all volumes but loud and bright for me. Today I'd love them. . I recently got a Scumback BH75 and BM75 and they are just perfect for me. .

Meanwhile, I have 25 watt Tan/Cremebacks from about 1974 in that Marshall Cab now and although I don't use it, I should. They sound fantastic and nowhere near as bright as my original 30 watt blackbacks were. I really really like them, and although I use 2x12's at my gigs, am so tempted to start using this 4x12 somewhere .. Damnnn

Eric
 
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ericb

Active member
I have a 77 marshall cab. Sounds great. Full volume nothing cuts out. But at lower volumes on palm mutes I hear a clear crackle. I didn’t pinpoint a speaker yet but it sound bad. When louder it masks it and at lower volumes it’s not pushing it hard enough to crackle.

I don’t think it’s blown. Handles power so far and sounds great. Ohm meter shows all are correct.

Where do I start? It’s not a loose part in the cab either.

Is this a 4x12? Are the handles plastic or metal? My handles in my 70's Marshall 4x12 ended up rattling since they were plastic and old, and I needed to replace. Also make sure it's definitely not a dirty jack. Other than that, if definitely the speakers, you'll have to isolate and figure out which one as like SW said, the dustcap could be unglued and just vibrating. Good luck! Eric
 

SpiderWars

Well-known member
Is this a 4x12? Are the handles plastic or metal? My handles in my 70's Marshall 4x12 ended up rattling since they were plastic and old, and I needed to replace. Also make sure it's definitely not a dirty jack. Other than that, if definitely the speakers, you'll have to isolate and figure out which one as like SW said, the dustcap could be unglued and just vibrating. Good luck! Eric
^Yep! Tightening up an old Marshall cab is just part of the deal. The interior screws often need tightening and the jacks and wiring often need attention. And then there's those rattly side handles...sometimes. All mine have the rivets removed and are screwed. Scumback has some cool products for that.

My '78 cab ended up having a bad speaker. The bad one made sound but was low output, very thin, and if you tapped on the cone it was almost like you tapped on concrete. There should be a noticeable 'thump' and a tiny bit of 'give' when you gently tap on the cone. This was firm concrete.

I've compared/mixed them with early 70s greenbacks and creambacks and I really like them mixed with either of those other two. That sizzle is addicting but 4 of them is not "green" enough for me. But those early/mid 70s Creams are magic for me.
 

Racerxrated

Well-known member
Not my experience, but 1 Blackback doesn't equal another Blackback. . .I had 4 30 watt Blackbacks in my late 70's Marshall 4x12, and they were absolutely great at all volumes but too bright for me. Of course I could hear back then. . haha. . I got it in the mid 80's probably and ended up selling 2 of them , and having 2 reconed into Blues. . that didn't work so I sold them to Scumback speakers to redo again. . Anyway, they were incredible speakers at all volumes but loud and bright for me. Today I'd love them. . I recently got a Scumback BH75 and BM75 and they are just perfect for me. .

Meanwhile, I have 25 watt Tan/Cremebacks from about 1974 in that Marshall Cab now and although I don't use it, I should. They sound fantastic and nowhere near as bright as my original 30 watt blackbacks were. I really really like them, and although I use 2x12's at my gigs, am so tempted to start using this 4x12 somewhere .. Damnnn

Eric
I hear ya; all cabs with the same type of speakers will sound different. But, that same low/medium volume ‘lameness’ was there with all 3 cabs. Great cranked volume tone but that was the only way they sounded good; to me anyway. I far prefer the 74-76 Creambacks and even the first reissue 6402 cones to BBs. Of course, my 72 Pulsonic cab slays them all.
 

Cap217

Active member
I have played a few great marshall cabs and I own a 73 which was/is my standard. But this 77 which is a slant and I dont like slants with blackbacks just has "it". Its way more aggressive in the upper mids, punchy, bright but not harsh. The 73 is darker and not as aggressive. I had an older blackback cab maybe 10 years ago and sold it but that cab had "it" as well, I just didnt know what I had back then. This cab wakes up every head that I have. Of course you may play it and hate it...
 

Cap217

Active member
^Yep! Tightening up an old Marshall cab is just part of the deal. The interior screws often need tightening and the jacks and wiring often need attention. And then there's those rattly side handles...sometimes. All mine have the rivets removed and are screwed. Scumback has some cool products for that.

My '78 cab ended up having a bad speaker. The bad one made sound but was low output, very thin, and if you tapped on the cone it was almost like you tapped on concrete. There should be a noticeable 'thump' and a tiny bit of 'give' when you gently tap on the cone. This was firm concrete.

I've compared/mixed them with early 70s greenbacks and creambacks and I really like them mixed with either of those other two. That sizzle is addicting but 4 of them is not "green" enough for me. But those early/mid 70s Creams are magic for me.

I tightened everything and stuffed stuff in the handles. I am going to do scumback metal handles on it anyways and regrill it because it was painted black. Everything is tight but I will redo it all again. I didnt take the speakers out yet but when I do Im sure it will be clear if there is an issue or not.
 

ericb

Active member
I hear ya; all cabs with the same type of speakers will sound different. But, that same low/medium volume ‘lameness’ was there with all 3 cabs. Great cranked volume tone but that was the only way they sounded good; to me anyway. I far prefer the 74-76 Creambacks and even the first reissue 6402 cones to BBs. Of course, my 72 Pulsonic cab slays them all.

There's also 55 hz , and 75hz H magnet (30 watter) Blackbacks and M magnet, 25 watters. . Mine were the 30 watters , 75hz.

Eric
 

Racerxrated

Well-known member
I had one H55 slant; and 2 M25 75 hz straight cabs. After all the internet lore I expected great things but was disappointed. At volume they were nice but anything lower vol just didn’t sound near as good.
 

ericb

Active member
I had one H55 slant; and 2 M25 75 hz straight cabs. After all the internet lore I expected great things but was disappointed. At volume they were nice but anything lower vol just didn’t sound near as good.
So yea your slants/speakers were different than mine.. . Off topic, but I can't help but to have noticed the 2021 Naylor sd60 in your signature as incoming.. Is this really still incoming? It's been awhile right? Keep in mind I got my 30 watter blackback slant in about 1980-1981. I was 20-21 in those years. Guarantee you my ears were better then than now.. .no contest! I used it with a 1971 Marshall Superlead that was killer . . I couldn't gig with it over 1 1/2 and then it was still too loud :)

Eric
 

Racerxrated

Well-known member
So yea your slants/speakers were different than mine.. . Off topic, but I can't help but to have noticed the 2021 Naylor sd60 in your signature as incoming.. Is this really still incoming? It's been awhile right? Keep in mind I got my 30 watter blackback slant in about 1980-1981. I was 20-21 in those years. Guarantee you my ears were better then than now.. .no contest! I used it with a 1971 Marshall Superlead that was killer . . I couldn't gig with it over 1 1/2 and then it was still too loud :)

Eric
Well, I'm hoping it is. It's been a while. But he responds when I message him. It'll be a year in July. He hasn't screwed anyone that I've heard. Maybe one of these days I'll give another BB cab a try. But it may be a bit redundant as my 72 cab is killer, and I have a pair of 1963 Vox Blues that are in a league of their own.
 

LPMojoGL

Well-known member
I have a 77 marshall cab. Sounds great. Full volume nothing cuts out. But at lower volumes on palm mutes I hear a clear crackle. I didn’t pinpoint a speaker yet but it sound bad. When louder it masks it and at lower volumes it’s not pushing it hard enough to crackle.

I don’t think it’s blown. Handles power so far and sounds great. Ohm meter shows all are correct.

Where do I start? It’s not a loose part in the cab either.
A clip would help.
You can systematically eliminate noises with cabs.
Sometimes a little piece of foam between the center post and rear panel helps. I prefer that to a screw.
Crackles I've experienced have been tubes, something in the amp (like a cold solder on a Bogner Shiva) or crappy wiring in the cab.
Tubes and amp are crossed off if it's just this cab. In which case, check wiring, every screw, every additional part like handles, corner protectors, casters, anything loose inside the cab.
If none of that helps, I'd play thru each speaker separately with back off, see if you can isolate which speaker is the offender.
 

ericb

Active member
Well, I'm hoping it is. It's been a while. But he responds when I message him. It'll be a year in July. He hasn't screwed anyone that I've heard. Maybe one of these days I'll give another BB cab a try. But it may be a bit redundant as my 72 cab is killer, and I have a pair of 1963 Vox Blues that are in a league of their own.

Hey if I was you I'd stick with those ultimate cabinets you have and not worry about any more! lol... I'm going to sell a few of mine as although I collected them for years, I just tend to use the same ones at all my gigs. I definitely wasn't insinuating Naylor was screwing anyone either, just surprised at how long it was taking. It's too bad, as everyone loves the amps, and they used to be no problem to find, but these days forget it. Rare as can be, and you were the only guy I had noticed was waiting for a new one. You're much more patient than I've ever been in my life . I can't even imagine how good that 72 cab or those 63 Vox Blues sound :)

Eric
 

Racerxrated

Well-known member
Hey if I was you I'd stick with those ultimate cabinets you have and not worry about any more! lol... I'm going to sell a few of mine as although I collected them for years, I just tend to use the same ones at all my gigs. I definitely wasn't insinuating Naylor was screwing anyone either, just surprised at how long it was taking. It's too bad, as everyone loves the amps, and they used to be no problem to find, but these days forget it. Rare as can be, and you were the only guy I had noticed was waiting for a new one. You're much more patient than I've ever been in my life . I can't even imagine how good that 72 cab or those 63 Vox Blues sound :)

Eric
I know of 2 more that have orders with him. One amp and a cab. Patience is a virtue lol.
I’m good on cabs; I recently grabbed a 1988 2205 halfstack; the cab came with the early version 8 ohm Marshall Vintage speakers. Really underrated and hard to find. Sounds similar to juicier 65s.
 
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