Which Mids-Heavy Amp?

[droptrd]

I am always comparing my 5150 and Mark III, trying to figure out which one will go when he time comes I have to sell amps for money. I always go back and forth.

Honestly, they are quite a bit different. I pretty much always play high gain modern stuff, so thats all I really worry about. Honestly I don't really think the Mark sounds modern. I would call it thrashy. I think it is great at that early 90's thrash tone. the 5150 is much more modern.

The 5150 is more of an aggressive crunchy amp. Not many amps sound as pissed off as the 5150. I don't find it smooth, or to have great chord clarity, but it doesn't matter as this amp is for chugging IMO.

The Mark is much smoother, and has much more chord clarity. I honestly don't think it is that brutal, but it is a great lead amp as mentioned. It doesn't sound as big and mean as the 5150. It is more of a narrow, compressed beam.

Its hard for me to pick one or the other. Most of the time I prefer the 5150, but I have my days when I want something a little less extreme. But, I also have a Recto, which kind of sits in between these 2...

+1 exactly I own a Mark III , a 5150 and a Tverb. I go back and forth between the Mark and the 5150. If youd ask me this last week I wouldve said the 5150 but since today is Fri Nov 19th, Ill have to say get a Mark

 

[Mailman1971]

I am always comparing my 5150 and Mark III, trying to figure out which one will go when he time comes I have to sell amps for money. I always go back and forth.

Honestly, they are quite a bit different. I pretty much always play high gain modern stuff, so thats all I really worry about. Honestly I don't really think the Mark sounds modern. I would call it thrashy. I think it is great at that early 90's thrash tone. the 5150 is much more modern.

The 5150 is more of an aggressive crunchy amp. Not many amps sound as pissed off as the 5150. I don't find it smooth, or to have great chord clarity, but it doesn't matter as this amp is for chugging IMO.

The Mark is much smoother, and has much more chord clarity. I honestly don't think it is that brutal, but it is a great lead amp as mentioned. It doesn't sound as big and mean as the 5150. It is more of a narrow, compressed beam.

Its hard for me to pick one or the other. Most of the time I prefer the 5150, but I have my days when I want something a little less extreme. But, I also have a Recto, which kind of sits in between these 2...

+1 exactly I own a Mark III , a 5150 and a Tverb. I go back and forth between the Mark and the 5150. If youd ask me this last week I wouldve said the 5150 but since today is Fri Nov 19th, Ill have to say get a Mark

Yup....they both have their own thing. I would start the Night with the Mark IV and then end up playing the 5150 toward the end of the night.
If I had to chose one I would take the 5150. Something about that Crunch Channel with a clean boost is freaking TONE HEAVEN!!

 

[Shask]

A lot of people on here say that Mark's are for 80's music or they have that signature 80's tone or something. Its a real turn off whenever I hear that because I have no interest in 80's music at all. It's just one thing making me hesitant about them in general. Then again, if Metallica can record the Black Album, Lamb of God can make their entire career on Marks, and Ola Englund's can make his Mark IV video, then they must be pretty awesome metal amps. At least I think so.

You know, the thing is, I think the Mark series is a GREAT metal amp, despite what people may think I think about them since I always bash them for modern music

I just don't think they are the best for the modern tone. I define that as the the newer bands that mainly use Rectos and 5150's, generally 7 strings, and those are probably tuned down. Just the most extreme stuff out there now.

But, outside of that stuff, the Mark is a good metal amp. Like I said above, it is a very clear, smooth, tight amp. LOG is a good example. I wouldn't say they are restricted to 80's music, I just think they have a vintage vibe to them. They don't have that big modern aggressive sound, but that doesn't mean it is only good for 80's. They do get heavy, just a different kind of heavy.

Actually, I would say my favorite tone out of them is similar to a Sepultura Chaos AD tone... that early 90's thrash tone...

 

[ericsabbath]

Peavey Triumph would be a nice in between and it's really cheap ($200-$350), so might be worth a try
has a lot of the Mesa Mark III, but Peavey voiced
very overlooked amp

 

[JakeAC5253]

Splawn Quick Rod?

I'd be curious to own one of these someday, but right now what I've got as far as amps go is too close to what a Splawn would give me. A different level of quality for sure, but along the same lines.

 

[JakeAC5253]

Quick funny story: my above post is actually how I accidentally met Russ (Variable) here at RT. He was plugged into a Mesa Mark IV combo at a music store, and not digging the tones out of it. I walked over and helped him dial it in. When I got home, he had posted the story here at RT. Turns out I was helping a fellow member and didn't know it!

What, you mean you guys don't wear your handles around your neck when you leave the house? hmm... weird?

I usually have mine stapled to my ass. My leather jacket covered it up that day though.

Your leather jacket covering your ass-less chaps then?

 

[JakeAC5253]

I am always comparing my 5150 and Mark III, trying to figure out which one will go when he time comes I have to sell amps for money. I always go back and forth.

Honestly, they are quite a bit different. I pretty much always play high gain modern stuff, so thats all I really worry about. Honestly I don't really think the Mark sounds modern. I would call it thrashy. I think it is great at that early 90's thrash tone. the 5150 is much more modern.

The 5150 is more of an aggressive crunchy amp. Not many amps sound as pissed off as the 5150. I don't find it smooth, or to have great chord clarity, but it doesn't matter as this amp is for chugging IMO.

The Mark is much smoother, and has much more chord clarity. I honestly don't think it is that brutal, but it is a great lead amp as mentioned. It doesn't sound as big and mean as the 5150. It is more of a narrow, compressed beam.

Its hard for me to pick one or the other. Most of the time I prefer the 5150, but I have my days when I want something a little less extreme. But, I also have a Recto, which kind of sits in between these 2...

+1 exactly I own a Mark III , a 5150 and a Tverb. I go back and forth between the Mark and the 5150. If youd ask me this last week I wouldve said the 5150 but since today is Fri Nov 19th, Ill have to say get a Mark

Yup....they both have their own thing. I would start the Night with the Mark IV and then end up playing the 5150 toward the end of the night.
If I had to chose one I would take the 5150. Something about that Crunch Channel with a clean boost is freaking TONE HEAVEN!!

I think I definitely need to own both of them at some point. I think they'd be good tonal compliments and I'd love having both around. Right now (means as of this second, I'm very impulsive mind you) I think the Mark offers me something totally different than anything that I have, and for that reason I may be leaning toward getting the Mark first. Not that the 5150 isn't a good amp or that I don't want one, but the way I see it is this...

I've got a Marshall hybrid amp which can pull off hot rodded Marshall tones and in my DAW I can EQ it to sound somewhat similar to a 5150. Can't nail it exactly, but it's along those same lines. No amount of EQing can give me the Mark sound. That's a whole different amp feel and can't be emulated with a Marshall type amp.

Nothing is final though, so lets keep talking about it. I would like to get more opinions on this if possible.

 

[JakeAC5253]

A lot of people on here say that Mark's are for 80's music or they have that signature 80's tone or something. Its a real turn off whenever I hear that because I have no interest in 80's music at all. It's just one thing making me hesitant about them in general. Then again, if Metallica can record the Black Album, Lamb of God can make their entire career on Marks, and Ola Englund's can make his Mark IV video, then they must be pretty awesome metal amps. At least I think so.

You know, the thing is, I think the Mark series is a GREAT metal amp, despite what people may think I think about them since I always bash them for modern music

I just don't think they are the best for the modern tone. I define that as the the newer bands that mainly use Rectos and 5150's, generally 7 strings, and those are probably tuned down. Just the most extreme stuff out there now.

But, outside of that stuff, the Mark is a good metal amp. Like I said above, it is a very clear, smooth, tight amp. LOG is a good example. I wouldn't say they are restricted to 80's music, I just think they have a vintage vibe to them. They don't have that big modern aggressive sound, but that doesn't mean it is only good for 80's. They do get heavy, just a different kind of heavy.

Actually, I would say my favorite tone out of them is similar to a Sepultura Chaos AD tone... that early 90's thrash tone...

Thanks for clearing that up

 

[some dude]

A lot of people on here say that Mark's are for 80's music or they have that signature 80's tone or something. Its a real turn off whenever I hear that because I have no interest in 80's music at all. It's just one thing making me hesitant about them in general. Then again, if Metallica can record the Black Album, Lamb of God can make their entire career on Marks, and Ola Englund's can make his Mark IV video, then they must be pretty awesome metal amps. At least I think so.

Me personally, I feel it only sounds as modern as you make it feel. The amp is pretty tweakable and I don't personally feel limited to dialling in old Metallica tones (although it will do them pretty easily). It's not going to achieve the sounds of a Recto or Recto+OD808... but that makes it cool in it's own regard IMO.

One thing I feel changes the paradigm is modern cabs. Lamb of God for instance has a bit of a vintage flavour to them but they're also using 'Traditional' cabs. Plug a Mark into an oversized Recto cab and things change.

 

[Shask]

A lot of people on here say that Mark's are for 80's music or they have that signature 80's tone or something. Its a real turn off whenever I hear that because I have no interest in 80's music at all. It's just one thing making me hesitant about them in general. Then again, if Metallica can record the Black Album, Lamb of God can make their entire career on Marks, and Ola Englund's can make his Mark IV video, then they must be pretty awesome metal amps. At least I think so.

Me personally, I feel it only sounds as modern as you make it feel. The amp is pretty tweakable and I don't personally feel limited to dialling in old Metallica tones (although it will do them pretty easily). It's not going to achieve the sounds of a Recto or Recto+OD808... but that makes it cool in it's own regard IMO.

One thing I feel changes the paradigm is modern cabs. Lamb of God for instance has a bit of a vintage flavour to them but they're also using 'Traditional' cabs. Plug a Mark into an oversized Recto cab and things change.

I think that is what I am always getting at. It wont get that big Recto sound, which is how I define modern metal sounds. But, that doesn't mean it cant get heavy, it just cant get that big loose, aggressive sound.

Yeah, it does that Puppets/Garage Days/Justice/Black sound all day long easily.

 

[JakeAC5253]

Has anyone here tried putting KT66 or KT77's in their Marks? I assume you would put the bias at EL34 if you wanted to use the KT77's, and use the 6L6 bias if you wanted to use the KT66's. Having the choice, how would one choose one over the other?

 

[Code001]

Has anyone here tried putting KT66 or KT77's in their Marks? I assume you would put the bias at EL34 if you wanted to use the KT77's, and use the 6L6 bias if you wanted to use the KT66's. Having the choice, how would one choose one over the other?

They're not adjustable bias.

 

[JakeAC5253]

Has anyone here tried putting KT66 or KT77's in their Marks? I assume you would put the bias at EL34 if you wanted to use the KT77's, and use the 6L6 bias if you wanted to use the KT66's. Having the choice, how would one choose one over the other?

They're not adjustable bias.

I think it may be a new feature on the Mark V's. Or it may have started on a previous version, but it's definitely there now.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/Mark5HD/

Finally a Bias Select switch is included that allows you to run EL34 power tubes in place of the stock compliment of 6L6's

 

[Code001]

Gotcha. It's not on the older ones. I think Dave ran all EL34s in one of his IIIs with no problems at one point in time.

 

[some dude]

Has anyone here tried putting KT66 or KT77's in their Marks? I assume you would put the bias at EL34 if you wanted to use the KT77's, and use the 6L6 bias if you wanted to use the KT66's. Having the choice, how would one choose one over the other?

I don't know how they'd behave due to the Mark being Simul-Class. One pair of power tubes is running in class A/B and the other is running in some sort of class A (others have argued over the details but I got confused along the way and forgot to remember the correct answer). The two pairs sit at different bias points.

The other wrench is the 10w mode. It uses one tube from the inner pair and one tube from the outer pair... 1 tube is running in pure class A and the other is used as a dummy tube to balance the transformer. I don't know how 10w mode would behave with non-standard power tubes inserted.

 

[MikeDV]

ENGL Steve Morse model. You want mids? Marshall meets atomic energy - with extra mid controls (and MIDI controls).

 

[Shask]

I just use all 6L6's in my Mark III. I am not a fan of EL34's, and putting them in there adds some annoying upper mid crap in the signal I don't want.

EDIT: Yeah, there is no adjustment on the Mark III. The inner sockets are 6L6, and the outer sockets are EL34 or 6L6. You just pop them in.

 

[droptrd]

I am always comparing my 5150 and Mark III, trying to figure out which one will go when he time comes I have to sell amps for money. I always go back and forth.

Honestly, they are quite a bit different. I pretty much always play high gain modern stuff, so thats all I really worry about. Honestly I don't really think the Mark sounds modern. I would call it thrashy. I think it is great at that early 90's thrash tone. the 5150 is much more modern.

The 5150 is more of an aggressive crunchy amp. Not many amps sound as pissed off as the 5150. I don't find it smooth, or to have great chord clarity, but it doesn't matter as this amp is for chugging IMO.

The Mark is much smoother, and has much more chord clarity. I honestly don't think it is that brutal, but it is a great lead amp as mentioned. It doesn't sound as big and mean as the 5150. It is more of a narrow, compressed beam.

Its hard for me to pick one or the other. Most of the time I prefer the 5150, but I have my days when I want something a little less extreme. But, I also have a Recto, which kind of sits in between these 2...

+1 exactly I own a Mark III , a 5150 and a Tverb. I go back and forth between the Mark and the 5150. If youd ask me this last week I wouldve said the 5150 but since today is Fri Nov 19th, Ill have to say get a Mark

Yup....they both have their own thing. I would start the Night with the Mark IV and then end up playing the 5150 toward the end of the night.
If I had to chose one I would take the 5150. Something about that Crunch Channel with a clean boost is freaking TONE HEAVEN!!

I think I definitely need to own both of them at some point. I think they'd be good tonal compliments and I'd love having both around. Right now (means as of this second, I'm very impulsive mind you) I think the Mark offers me something totally different than anything that I have, and for that reason I may be leaning toward getting the Mark first. Not that the 5150 isn't a good amp or that I don't want one, but the way I see it is this...

I've got a Marshall hybrid amp which can pull off hot rodded Marshall tones and in my DAW I can EQ it to sound somewhat similar to a 5150. Can't nail it exactly, but it's along those same lines. No amount of EQing can give me the Mark sound. That's a whole different amp feel and can't be emulated with a Marshall type amp.

Nothing is final though, so lets keep talking about it. I would like to get more opinions on this if possible.

Try running the 2 amps together. Its jaw dropping

 

[gibson08]

I have a MKV and I would say its a great choice, however that being said I cant help but feel I really missed out on the older MKs, I know that the modes are only a glimpse of the amps they are designed after, I think some of my next amps will be a IIC+ or a MKI. Maybe somebody that has actually owned them can talk of the tone differences a little.

 

[JakeAC5253]

Has anyone here tried putting KT66 or KT77's in their Marks? I assume you would put the bias at EL34 if you wanted to use the KT77's, and use the 6L6 bias if you wanted to use the KT66's. Having the choice, how would one choose one over the other?

I don't know how they'd behave due to the Mark being Simul-Class. One pair of power tubes is running in class A/B and the other is running in some sort of class A (others have argued over the details but I got confused along the way and forgot to remember the correct answer). The two pairs sit at different bias points.

The other wrench is the 10w mode. It uses one tube from the inner pair and one tube from the outer pair... 1 tube is running in pure class A and the other is used as a dummy tube to balance the transformer. I don't know how 10w mode would behave with non-standard power tubes inserted.

Definitely something to look into. Maybe I'll direct the question towards Mesa. Thanks.