Wizard master volumes

[narad]

Just a quick question for the Wizard aficionados who have compared a couple different models. I have a Wizard Modern Classic that I grabbed specifically for the Type C transformer that seemed to be what I liked in the demos. When I first plugged in it was pretty good, but I was surprised by how high the master had to be to really open up. Maybe like glorious at around 4 on the master volume, but that's very loud. For Tokyo, that's way too much.

I've watched some demos of the MCII and MTL, and from the looks of it, the masters are way lower, but the sound is just as saturated (or way more, in case of the MTL). Is this accurate? Are the MCII or MTL better "low volume" amps? The MCI opened up is one of the best amps I've ever heard, but tbh, I don't use it much because of how different I need to set it up vs the other amps (even with an attenuator, I have to be extra careful switching things around), and I've been thinking about trying to sell it for one of the other models, but it's a lot of effort to do internationally.

 

[Techdeth]

my mtl2 is pretty loud with master at 2 and love the tone at thst volume . It worked out perfectly for me : it saturates even more pretty quick but if you back of the gain as you get loud and it can even out quite nicely . I just got rebalance the gain. Btw mine our 100 watt MTL2s

 

[* velcro-fly *]

It wasn’t too much for Godzilla or Rodan. Maybe you need to move ?

For Tokyo, that's way too much.

 

[narad]

It wasn’t too much for Godzilla or Rodan. Maybe you need to move ?

Even if it was merely Pokemon, my neighbors would find a way to complain or be otherwise passive aggressive.

 

[RedB4Black]

How old is your amp? I’ve never had a problem getting a good low volume tone on newer Wizards. But they do sound best with the volume pushed a little.

if I had to play at low apartment volumes, I’d just get an Axe Fx

 

[lespaul6]

all of the wizards I owned were like fender masters, full out by 0900... I had one that needed more throw- like you're describing. I just assumed rick used a non log pot or whatever with all the throw at the end. all mine were from the 2010 era.

 

[nightlight]

Have you considered a reactive loadbox plus IRs setup? Granted, it doesn’t move a lot of air, but if it keeps your neighbours happy, that is your best option.

After all, got to cut the suit according to the cloth you have.

 

[Greazygeo]

If you have an effects loop, run a patch cable between the send and return. You will be able to use the return as a master volume.
My Modern Classic is not a bedroom amp. But I didn’t buy it to be one. It is band volume around 9:00.
Another option is grab a load box and send it thru another amp’s power section or ir’s into a daw and headphones. Mine sounds good that way too.

 

[Smash]

How old is your amp? I’ve never had a problem getting a good low volume tone on newer Wizards. But they do sound best with the volume pushed a little.

if I had to play at low apartment volumes, I’d just get an Axe Fx

I don't know if you have ever played low volume. I don't play tube amps at low volume. I don't know who started this trend or why, but it goes against everything.

I practice or write songs at low volume, because i don't want to punish people that live with or around me. That is on neural software on computer. But when I play, I play fucking loud on a tube amp.
Clean amps sound good at low volume. They do something special with volume....High gain lives at volume.

 

[RedB4Black]

I don't know if you have ever played low volume. I don't play tube amps at low volume. I don't know who started this trend or why, but it goes against everything.

I practice or write songs at low volume, because i don't want to punish people that live with or around me. That is on neural software on computer. But when I play, I play fucking loud on a tube amp.
Clean amps sound good at low volume. They do something special with volume....High gain lives at volume.

Well low volume is relative. Lol

I need a decibel meter like you have

 

[LPMojoGL]

I think older ones had a bad mv, newer ones have a great mv.
The 2016 models I had were fine at any volume.

 

[Techdeth]

How old is your amp? I’ve never had a problem getting a good low volume tone on newer Wizards. But they do sound best with the volume pushed a little.

if I had to play at low apartment volumes, I’d just get an Axe Fx

My newer MTL2s just go loud instantly. I thought maybe all the 100 watt wizards were Msybe this way .

 

[Racerxrated]

all of the wizards I owned were like fender masters, full out by 0900... I had one that needed more throw- like you're describing. I just assumed rick used a non log pot or whatever with all the throw at the end. all mine were from the 2010 era.

The 2010 MC I got from you, had a really awesome ‘amp is gonna blow’ sound at apt level low vol….no idea why is sounded like that but it was unique. Went away quick once you moved the knob but it was there at quiet vol. 9 am was super loud

 

[lespaul6]

The 2010 MC I got from you, had a really awesome ‘amp is gonna blow’ sound at apt level low vol….no idea why is sounded like that but it was unique. Went away quick once you moved the knob but it was there at quiet vol. 9 am was super loud

I bought that off king guitar right before he went to jail... lol I miss that amp

 

[midnightlaundry]

If you have an effects loop, run a patch cable between the send and return. You will be able to use the return as a master volume.
My Modern Classic is not a bedroom amp. But I didn’t buy it to be one. It is band volume around 9:00.
Another option is grab a load box and send it thru another amp’s power section or ir’s into a daw and headphones. Mine sounds good that way too.

Yeah, my experience also.. It's at kill around 9-10 o'clock.
I don't know why every amp maker wouldn't use and Audio Taper for a MV so you can be a bedroom warrior without worry.

 

[MetalHeadMike]

Never owned an MCI but 4 MCIIs, W800, MTL, KT150, MC25s and my experience has been MCIIs and MC25s are great low volume amps. Always have said MCII is among the best low volume amps I've owned, but that is with an MXR 10 band in the loop acting as additional volume control & boosted up front, same goes for MC25. In addition to Wizards, SLO30, Naylor SD60, MKIII+ I've recently acquired are also among the best low volume tones I've experienced. Think it all boils down to the entire signal chain.

I set up to extremes, pushing amps to the limits with external components in the chain to get things where they excel for my purposes. Some people rely on amp, guitar only, I do not. When other components are incorporated, and extreme settings are explored, I feel many tube amps can offer satisfying experiences. Of course pushing volume is the ultimate, but low volume satisfaction can be achieved with thinking outside the box...IMHO.

Never trying to boast/brag, relevant to regarding what I say I've owned, but merely trying to offer my experiences with various amps/setups. No one amp/setup is better than another, it's all relevant and unique to an individuals perception.

 

[narad]

How old is your amp? I’ve never had a problem getting a good low volume tone on newer Wizards. But they do sound best with the volume pushed a little.

if I had to play at low apartment volumes, I’d just get an Axe Fx

I think it's on the older side, I think around 2008 IIRC. I just find it funny -- a lot of people have compared it to Marshalls or Jubilees specifically, and my Jubilee has no problem kind of opening up at way lower volumes.

Have you considered a reactive loadbox plus IRs setup? Granted, it doesn’t move a lot of air, but if it keeps your neighbours happy, that is your best option.

After all, got to cut the suit according to the cloth you have.

I have the waza tube amp expander, and it sounds great through that. There was a thread on here a while ago about a guy who blew one of his Wizard's transformers using the same loadbox though, and I think neither Rick nor Roland was particularl helpful in solving it. If one of the newer amps is going to be better at low volume, maybe it's worth swapping though.

If you have an effects loop, run a patch cable between the send and return. You will be able to use the return as a master volume.
My Modern Classic is not a bedroom amp. But I didn’t buy it to be one. It is band volume around 9:00.
Another option is grab a load box and send it thru another amp’s power section or ir’s into a daw and headphones. Mine sounds good that way too.

That's a good point, I haven't tried the loop volume pedal trick yet. Used to run my old Roccaforte that way.

I don't know if you have ever played low volume. I don't play tube amps at low volume. I don't know who started this trend or why, but it goes against everything.

I practice or write songs at low volume, because i don't want to punish people that live with or around me. That is on neural software on computer. But when I play, I play fucking loud on a tube amp.
Clean amps sound good at low volume. They do something special with volume....High gain lives at volume.

I'm on a computer like 90% of my waking day -- the last thing I want is my hobbies to be based on a computer too! But I disagree -- basically every single other amp I have, mostly 80s-90s stuff, all sound great at low volume. Even mark III coliseums sound good at low volume at like 180W or whatever. And sound better than the low wattage versions. It's definitely counter-intuitive, but apart from the Wizard, 100W+ tube amps at something not much louder than TV volume has been what's worked for me just in providing the best playing experience.

==============================

Ha, I guess the responses in the thread are also why I've been confused - you hear inherently loud right off and also some of the best master volumes ever But yea, maybe sounds like I just have an older version. I'm not sure what could be changed between older and newer version though?

About the audio taper, is this a "no free lunch" situation or is that something I should maybe try to mod in? It was my understanding that with a different taper, maybe the amp wouldn't even open up until like 6 or 7 (up from maybe 4), but that I wouldn't have to worry about moving it one atom up and having the volume leap up. I don't have the latter problem currently, but I've had other amps where it was very tricky to get the knob set precisely at the best volume.

 

[Smash]

Injust heard a sulver jubilee live,, fuck that is twice now. May be best death metal ampmever