A
Anonymous
Guest
so i finally was able to find some time and mess around with my new tubes. So, this is my Egnater Tourmaster 4212 Preamp Tubes experiment / recommendation / review
First, I labeled all my original preamp tubes (1-8) and my power section too ( i bought a quad of ruby tubes..more on that later). i used my 1992 les paul studio lite with m3 electronics. it has an alnico 2 pro humbucker in the neck, a duncan duckbucker in the middle and a duncan screamin' demon in the bridge. it also has graph tech string saver saddles and all upgraded wiring (i used a higher grade belden wire when i rewired the PUPS 10 years ago). also, i like a more hard hitting, and actually sterile, consistent sound in my hi-gain...or so i thought! ( my previous rig was a mesa heartbreaker that i just couldnt get dialed in, and before that i had 2 digitech 2101's thru a mosvalve 982 single rack power amp. i was pretty used to a sterile processed sound, so i set out to achieve that with some character? maybe? haha. i've also played a TON of amps, as i've said on her before, searching for the right one)
orginally, based on recommendations i found here and on the net, I got a jjecc83 for V1, a tungsol for v2, a 12axb shaguang for 3 and a matched (it has handwritten 97 on the label) sovtek lps for the v8 PI. i figured, even if the amp DIDN'T need a balanced PI tube (i dont know enough about this particular amp, and it's hard to find info on it currently) the extra 5.00 bux wasn't going to kill me. some places i've read say go get the balanced, some say it's a waste of money. In the end, as you'll read, I think it made a big difference in feel and presence.
my channel volume settings stayed around 2 oclock and the master around 1-2. each of my tourmaster channel volume settings has a sweet spot of around 2 oclock, where things really open up and start to thump, sing and hit harder..and feel better...even when im backing off on the master amp volume a bit. Master wise, the sweet spots there, or where i like the sound and feel is right around 1 oclock...from there on, it just gets bigger, fuller and stronger sounding. It also sounds good at lower volumes, but the magic in this amp is like I said above..channel volumes around 2, master around 1-3. REALLY fucking loud.
first up, i put the sovtek LPS in the PI and noticed an immediate increased feel on the OD2 channel, and what seemed to be faster response at high volumes. fantastic, this is part of what i was looking for, as i felt this amp was slightly "cold" or bland sounding and sluggish feeling attackwise, even though i was biasing the stock GT 5881's at 132. i also noticed a slight difference in treble response too...but i wont completely attribute it to the tube, or not, as my ears were ringing from playing 2 hours at pretty loud volume...I'm going to check that though and see, once my ears have rested. On the clean channels, they just "felt" better (i use that term a lot about my amps..feel is really important to me). i could dig in, or lay back, and it was just better all the way around with the LPS. i dont like terms like bubbly, sparkly, and shimmery when i refer to amps, because everyone hears those terms differently. what i CAN tell you though, is that there was a marked difference on the clean channels with the sovtek LPS in v8 when i was fiddling with the power grid, as opposed to the grid really not feeling like it made a difference with the gtecc83s that was in there. It felt and sounded differently on each grid setting, which was nice. All in all, I think for this amp, or type of amp (anyone care to input why?) the Sovtek balanced LPS was a definite winner.
I put the recommended tubes in position, turned the amp on...WOW, not what I expected. more of a vintage distortion (not what I'm after at all) and major MUD in my cleans. hated it immediately on the cleans, messed with both OD's, and decided I'd go back stock (what I'm used to) and start from square one.
On to V1. I tried the JJ ecc83 in V1, and it was just not big sounding. at all. the stock tube sounded better, so I put it back after about 10 minutes. I just didn’t like the sound and didn't feel that it was tonally better than the Stock, it did lend a vintage feel. So I eventually moved it to v2, v3 and v4. It gave me a basis of what I didn't want, which was more of a "not better than the GT stock tubes" not a "not good enough" distortion wise. So I took a long shot and put it in V5 (contour circuit buffers for the OD channels). WOW!! JUMPIN JAHOSAFATS!!!!. FINALLY, OD2 comes alive!! seriously, what a difference. I have to also mention, I've previously tried two different sovtek 12ax7WA's in here, and they weren't the answer. The JJ added a good bit more control to the contour knob. Pushing the contour button in, and the knob all the way to the right (minimal contour setting IMHO) REALLY made the mids come alive, and made this amp even louder! Not a hurtful loud, just more cutting (obviously) and smoother. With the contour knob around 12-2, unlike before, it started to dial out some of the mids and hi mids and added some metal bite. between 9-12 is where the harder metal lies with the JJ in the contour v5 position. Incredibly deep, HEAVY thick metal sounds...and, I didn't even touch my other tone knobs!! Between 7-9, its just insane scooped....I can't explain it fully, but, I might be hanging around in that range, as I have it set around 7, with my mid knob at 12....Seriously, with my volume settings, it was like someone was whomping me in the chest with a 10 foot baseball bat made of air!! Felt good, sounded gooder, and all in all, was just more better-er. There was an added depth to the bass, mids, and high end...Hard to explain, again but it just made both OD channels sound deeper, and added some Mid shelving grain, and it also took away some of the muddy "high gain tube saturation" that the stock GT had in the v5. Also, I noticed more of a "tubey-ness" sound to the amp combined with that lovely mid range growl I love, but found so hard to dial in before on just about every tube amp i tried. All from one tube change!!! - V5 stock groove tube 12'ax7s to JJ ecc83-s. And that was only OD2. OD1 sounds so good now though. I didn't mess with it for an hour like OD2, but to sum up shortly OD1 is now a clearer, round sounding gain. Very tubey and pronounced but not annoying mids, awesome biting highs, and REALLY thumpy bottom end were noticeable. With this tube overall, in both OD channels, theres just more harmonic halo to notes, deeper resonance, better control with the tone, and more tube sound. truly, a home run with the JJ in this position.
at that point, I almost DIDN"T want to keep fucking around with the rest of the tube positions with the other 2 tubes I had...the tung sol and the chinese 12ax7b.
I put the tungsol in V1, expecting big things. I was disappointed. It was fuzzy and mushy, almost like a stock dual rec, which, personally, I just despise the sound of. it took away all the EQ definition that the JJ achieved 10 mins before....and really only added some unwanted gain, which, I really didn't want to change about my cleans where they were at, and the OD's have plenty to spare. The mushiness in the bass, and fuzz are not my taste distortion wise. so I moved it on to v3 (logically, where v2 SHOULD be, so I just plugged it in!!). THERE! that's the bit of difference I could learn to like!! I could hear MORE tube (I absolutely LOVE that mid range tubeness that is just magical when it appears...it did, and I fell in love!!! ) There was less fuzz, and an added bit of sustain and harmonics. There WAS SOME mushiness bass wise, but I was able to dial it out with the bass knob and a tweak of the contour to my liking got it back to tight and thumpy. Just for SnG (shits in giggles) I moved the tung to v2, but it just didn't sound as good... the tung in the v4 added mid rangy feedback (not squeal, just more howl and inherent instrument/amp feedback at high volume) and took away what I liked about it in v3, so I put it back. Now, to find the spot for the shaguang 12ax7b....
after the let down with the tung in v1, I was almost ready to call it a night. I bet most of you reading this by now, wish I would have. I didn’t.
I put the shaguang in v1, let it warm up, and turned it on. sonic heaven. I FINALLY found MY tube sound. wait. what was that? wtf?? when rolling off on my volume, I could hear a squeal going on, a low volume, hi pitched squeal. I put my finger on the tube, and it went away. but I had to push hard. I'm guessing it was micro phonics. FUCK ME! I could go on forever about how good this tube sounds in v1, but I wont. what I might do is use it there at lower volumes though, even though it really doesn't shine like it does with my volumes pumped like I like them. I was irritated. I put the stock GT back in and moved it to v3.
livable. actually, save for having it in v1, the shaguang in v3 sounded the best of all. with the current tube combinations in positions that I mentioned above...it just adds more...I don’t know how to describe it. it adds more "me". more touch, more metal, more TUBE distortion, less oversaturated gain, mids that jump out and growl...
unfortunately, my video camera wont stream to this computer so I cant put up some clips for you guys to check out.
next up was the power swap.
the stock GT 5881's were floating bias wise (i.e. , Id set them at 132, and an hour later after playing, they had either went up, or went down. I was told it was a bad tube..) I recently bought that set of ruby 6l6strs for 50 bux from GTR center. I put them in, put the amp on standby, went up and ate dinner. turned it on, biased it at 132, and went back upstairs while they burned in for about 15 mins. don’t know if I needed to at all, or longer, I just did it that way.
the first thing I noticed with the ruby 6L6's,, in combination with the new v8 PI tube, this amp responds faster than I ever thought it would!! WOW!!! holy WHAA!!! and compared to the GT power tubes, it also sounds better at lower volumes with the tube grid settings on lower power in all channels. the GT5881s (possibly, they may have been just worn) WERE more boomy, which I liked a LOT... but less consistently were that way due to the floating bias..sometimes it went down as far as 110 from 132 after an hour or so playing it. I just checked the bias on the rubys and they were sitting idle at 126, so there was some float, possibly a burn in issue? they have maybe 1.5 hours on them, and no time on them opened up and cranked. after about 10 hours, I'll report back.
that's about it..overall, I'd go back to the groove tubes. I really like the way those 5881s sounded and felt with that 4-7 rating once I put the LPS in the PI position, so, I may go back, or try mixing the ruby's do sound to me to be more focused and transparent..allowing for more of the preamp tube tone to shine through, which, I will have to come back and talk about later. Just not enough experience overall yet with the newer tubes...the groove tubes seemed to add some of their own color...not bad at all...actually, I liked them, but for 50 bux for a quad of 6l6's, what the hell right? I just might mess around with mixing the 2 types like I said...ruby's in the inside and Gt's on the out or vice versa, to see what I like/what feels best. I have a mesa green 6l6 laying around, I might even mix that in there.
for sure, I like my options now with this amp better than ever...and, initially, it was already a versatile and nice sounding amp that I liked, and had high hopes for. now I LOVE the sound of this amp on OD2. it's a powerful amp, for sure, and with some new tube experimenting, some of you guys might find some tonal bliss like I did last night.
my next move will probably be to order 2 more shaguang 12ax7b 's and an electroharmonix or 2. I might go with 2 of both, and see what that brings.
for now, I'm loving my tube amp!!
a for sure recommendation would be get the sovtek 12ax7lps and put it in the PI slot, try a JJ ecc83 in the v5 slot, and mess around with the other tone slots with whatever you have laying around.
I REALLY hope I can find a quiet Shaguang 12ax7b...or, go on living life wanting after THAT sound for ever hahahha!!
First, I labeled all my original preamp tubes (1-8) and my power section too ( i bought a quad of ruby tubes..more on that later). i used my 1992 les paul studio lite with m3 electronics. it has an alnico 2 pro humbucker in the neck, a duncan duckbucker in the middle and a duncan screamin' demon in the bridge. it also has graph tech string saver saddles and all upgraded wiring (i used a higher grade belden wire when i rewired the PUPS 10 years ago). also, i like a more hard hitting, and actually sterile, consistent sound in my hi-gain...or so i thought! ( my previous rig was a mesa heartbreaker that i just couldnt get dialed in, and before that i had 2 digitech 2101's thru a mosvalve 982 single rack power amp. i was pretty used to a sterile processed sound, so i set out to achieve that with some character? maybe? haha. i've also played a TON of amps, as i've said on her before, searching for the right one)
orginally, based on recommendations i found here and on the net, I got a jjecc83 for V1, a tungsol for v2, a 12axb shaguang for 3 and a matched (it has handwritten 97 on the label) sovtek lps for the v8 PI. i figured, even if the amp DIDN'T need a balanced PI tube (i dont know enough about this particular amp, and it's hard to find info on it currently) the extra 5.00 bux wasn't going to kill me. some places i've read say go get the balanced, some say it's a waste of money. In the end, as you'll read, I think it made a big difference in feel and presence.
my channel volume settings stayed around 2 oclock and the master around 1-2. each of my tourmaster channel volume settings has a sweet spot of around 2 oclock, where things really open up and start to thump, sing and hit harder..and feel better...even when im backing off on the master amp volume a bit. Master wise, the sweet spots there, or where i like the sound and feel is right around 1 oclock...from there on, it just gets bigger, fuller and stronger sounding. It also sounds good at lower volumes, but the magic in this amp is like I said above..channel volumes around 2, master around 1-3. REALLY fucking loud.
first up, i put the sovtek LPS in the PI and noticed an immediate increased feel on the OD2 channel, and what seemed to be faster response at high volumes. fantastic, this is part of what i was looking for, as i felt this amp was slightly "cold" or bland sounding and sluggish feeling attackwise, even though i was biasing the stock GT 5881's at 132. i also noticed a slight difference in treble response too...but i wont completely attribute it to the tube, or not, as my ears were ringing from playing 2 hours at pretty loud volume...I'm going to check that though and see, once my ears have rested. On the clean channels, they just "felt" better (i use that term a lot about my amps..feel is really important to me). i could dig in, or lay back, and it was just better all the way around with the LPS. i dont like terms like bubbly, sparkly, and shimmery when i refer to amps, because everyone hears those terms differently. what i CAN tell you though, is that there was a marked difference on the clean channels with the sovtek LPS in v8 when i was fiddling with the power grid, as opposed to the grid really not feeling like it made a difference with the gtecc83s that was in there. It felt and sounded differently on each grid setting, which was nice. All in all, I think for this amp, or type of amp (anyone care to input why?) the Sovtek balanced LPS was a definite winner.
I put the recommended tubes in position, turned the amp on...WOW, not what I expected. more of a vintage distortion (not what I'm after at all) and major MUD in my cleans. hated it immediately on the cleans, messed with both OD's, and decided I'd go back stock (what I'm used to) and start from square one.
On to V1. I tried the JJ ecc83 in V1, and it was just not big sounding. at all. the stock tube sounded better, so I put it back after about 10 minutes. I just didn’t like the sound and didn't feel that it was tonally better than the Stock, it did lend a vintage feel. So I eventually moved it to v2, v3 and v4. It gave me a basis of what I didn't want, which was more of a "not better than the GT stock tubes" not a "not good enough" distortion wise. So I took a long shot and put it in V5 (contour circuit buffers for the OD channels). WOW!! JUMPIN JAHOSAFATS!!!!. FINALLY, OD2 comes alive!! seriously, what a difference. I have to also mention, I've previously tried two different sovtek 12ax7WA's in here, and they weren't the answer. The JJ added a good bit more control to the contour knob. Pushing the contour button in, and the knob all the way to the right (minimal contour setting IMHO) REALLY made the mids come alive, and made this amp even louder! Not a hurtful loud, just more cutting (obviously) and smoother. With the contour knob around 12-2, unlike before, it started to dial out some of the mids and hi mids and added some metal bite. between 9-12 is where the harder metal lies with the JJ in the contour v5 position. Incredibly deep, HEAVY thick metal sounds...and, I didn't even touch my other tone knobs!! Between 7-9, its just insane scooped....I can't explain it fully, but, I might be hanging around in that range, as I have it set around 7, with my mid knob at 12....Seriously, with my volume settings, it was like someone was whomping me in the chest with a 10 foot baseball bat made of air!! Felt good, sounded gooder, and all in all, was just more better-er. There was an added depth to the bass, mids, and high end...Hard to explain, again but it just made both OD channels sound deeper, and added some Mid shelving grain, and it also took away some of the muddy "high gain tube saturation" that the stock GT had in the v5. Also, I noticed more of a "tubey-ness" sound to the amp combined with that lovely mid range growl I love, but found so hard to dial in before on just about every tube amp i tried. All from one tube change!!! - V5 stock groove tube 12'ax7s to JJ ecc83-s. And that was only OD2. OD1 sounds so good now though. I didn't mess with it for an hour like OD2, but to sum up shortly OD1 is now a clearer, round sounding gain. Very tubey and pronounced but not annoying mids, awesome biting highs, and REALLY thumpy bottom end were noticeable. With this tube overall, in both OD channels, theres just more harmonic halo to notes, deeper resonance, better control with the tone, and more tube sound. truly, a home run with the JJ in this position.
at that point, I almost DIDN"T want to keep fucking around with the rest of the tube positions with the other 2 tubes I had...the tung sol and the chinese 12ax7b.
I put the tungsol in V1, expecting big things. I was disappointed. It was fuzzy and mushy, almost like a stock dual rec, which, personally, I just despise the sound of. it took away all the EQ definition that the JJ achieved 10 mins before....and really only added some unwanted gain, which, I really didn't want to change about my cleans where they were at, and the OD's have plenty to spare. The mushiness in the bass, and fuzz are not my taste distortion wise. so I moved it on to v3 (logically, where v2 SHOULD be, so I just plugged it in!!). THERE! that's the bit of difference I could learn to like!! I could hear MORE tube (I absolutely LOVE that mid range tubeness that is just magical when it appears...it did, and I fell in love!!! ) There was less fuzz, and an added bit of sustain and harmonics. There WAS SOME mushiness bass wise, but I was able to dial it out with the bass knob and a tweak of the contour to my liking got it back to tight and thumpy. Just for SnG (shits in giggles) I moved the tung to v2, but it just didn't sound as good... the tung in the v4 added mid rangy feedback (not squeal, just more howl and inherent instrument/amp feedback at high volume) and took away what I liked about it in v3, so I put it back. Now, to find the spot for the shaguang 12ax7b....
after the let down with the tung in v1, I was almost ready to call it a night. I bet most of you reading this by now, wish I would have. I didn’t.
I put the shaguang in v1, let it warm up, and turned it on. sonic heaven. I FINALLY found MY tube sound. wait. what was that? wtf?? when rolling off on my volume, I could hear a squeal going on, a low volume, hi pitched squeal. I put my finger on the tube, and it went away. but I had to push hard. I'm guessing it was micro phonics. FUCK ME! I could go on forever about how good this tube sounds in v1, but I wont. what I might do is use it there at lower volumes though, even though it really doesn't shine like it does with my volumes pumped like I like them. I was irritated. I put the stock GT back in and moved it to v3.
livable. actually, save for having it in v1, the shaguang in v3 sounded the best of all. with the current tube combinations in positions that I mentioned above...it just adds more...I don’t know how to describe it. it adds more "me". more touch, more metal, more TUBE distortion, less oversaturated gain, mids that jump out and growl...
unfortunately, my video camera wont stream to this computer so I cant put up some clips for you guys to check out.
next up was the power swap.
the stock GT 5881's were floating bias wise (i.e. , Id set them at 132, and an hour later after playing, they had either went up, or went down. I was told it was a bad tube..) I recently bought that set of ruby 6l6strs for 50 bux from GTR center. I put them in, put the amp on standby, went up and ate dinner. turned it on, biased it at 132, and went back upstairs while they burned in for about 15 mins. don’t know if I needed to at all, or longer, I just did it that way.
the first thing I noticed with the ruby 6L6's,, in combination with the new v8 PI tube, this amp responds faster than I ever thought it would!! WOW!!! holy WHAA!!! and compared to the GT power tubes, it also sounds better at lower volumes with the tube grid settings on lower power in all channels. the GT5881s (possibly, they may have been just worn) WERE more boomy, which I liked a LOT... but less consistently were that way due to the floating bias..sometimes it went down as far as 110 from 132 after an hour or so playing it. I just checked the bias on the rubys and they were sitting idle at 126, so there was some float, possibly a burn in issue? they have maybe 1.5 hours on them, and no time on them opened up and cranked. after about 10 hours, I'll report back.
that's about it..overall, I'd go back to the groove tubes. I really like the way those 5881s sounded and felt with that 4-7 rating once I put the LPS in the PI position, so, I may go back, or try mixing the ruby's do sound to me to be more focused and transparent..allowing for more of the preamp tube tone to shine through, which, I will have to come back and talk about later. Just not enough experience overall yet with the newer tubes...the groove tubes seemed to add some of their own color...not bad at all...actually, I liked them, but for 50 bux for a quad of 6l6's, what the hell right? I just might mess around with mixing the 2 types like I said...ruby's in the inside and Gt's on the out or vice versa, to see what I like/what feels best. I have a mesa green 6l6 laying around, I might even mix that in there.
for sure, I like my options now with this amp better than ever...and, initially, it was already a versatile and nice sounding amp that I liked, and had high hopes for. now I LOVE the sound of this amp on OD2. it's a powerful amp, for sure, and with some new tube experimenting, some of you guys might find some tonal bliss like I did last night.
my next move will probably be to order 2 more shaguang 12ax7b 's and an electroharmonix or 2. I might go with 2 of both, and see what that brings.
for now, I'm loving my tube amp!!
a for sure recommendation would be get the sovtek 12ax7lps and put it in the PI slot, try a JJ ecc83 in the v5 slot, and mess around with the other tone slots with whatever you have laying around.
I REALLY hope I can find a quiet Shaguang 12ax7b...or, go on living life wanting after THAT sound for ever hahahha!!
