Chorus Pedal for STP Tones

JT087":3kf04a9k said:
I'll record a video showing the Intelliverb vs some chorus pedals, and how you can tweak certain parameters on the rack that give it that psychedelic sound. Particularly the 116 Chorus/Verb preset, when that one gets tweaked the right way hitting a G chord sounds like you've woken up Frankenstein's monster when running a bunch of gain into it. I'd say this one sounds closest to what I hear on songs like Rooster or Plush. Not sure if it's the exact one they use as there's a metric shitload of chorus patches, all of them are highly tweakable and have the potential to sound somewhat close or very different.
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Can you please post the video, I am very curious as to what tones you have come up with and the settings?

Also I see some other posting that the Intellifex is the same or you will get similar tones vs the "verb". No you won't I have a few Intellifex units here as well. Lots of major differences in the hardware let alone software vs the Intelliverb.

Hopefully just trying to save someone some cash if they get an Intellifex and are not impressed with the chorus, delay or flanger. Not saying it's bad either but it's not some sort of cheap alternative to the Intelliverb either.
 
JT087":1ixffpbd said:
SFW":1ixffpbd said:
I recently joined an STP tribute band. It's been pretty fun learning songs from my college days again. I can cover most of the base tones using my Spawn QuickRod and my Les Paul. What I am struggling with is the chorus sounds. Songs like Plush have a thick chorus to them. In fact, the entire Core album has a slight chorus effect on all of the songs. I know that Dean uses an Intellifex in his live rig and in the studio. I've also read that he uses an old Boss CE-1. So what chorus pedal can I use to get close to the tones that he gets? I currently have a TC Corona, but I really don't care for it. To my ears it just meh... I'd like to get that thick lush chorusing that doesn't overpower the core tone. I don't really want to drop the kinda money that original CE-1s are now commanding. So what do y'all suggest? Thanks in advance.
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There's a bit of confusion I think when it comes to the Core sound, mainly that the Boss CE-1 was used for it's chorusing. The CE-1 was mainly for splitting the signals to two amps, with the exception of a few songs that made use of the pedal's Vibrato side. However anytime you hear that signature overdriven chorus sound on songs like Sin, Plush, ect, it's always the Rocktron Intelliverb.

One of the reasons I never could get pedals to do this sound, is because the Rocktron is much more psychadelic in nature due its presets having multiple choruses, swirling around each other. I never got to try a pedal that has this feature. Not to mention there's a particular setting on the Rocktron that gives the chorus a bit of a flangey bite to it that is pretty unique and further distances itself from pedals.

The other part is the Demeter TGP3, in it's own right is a very unique sounding piece of gear and accounts for a lot of that tone. The sound of the TGP3's gain stage hitting a modulation effect is pretty special, but even moreso when it's the Intelliverb. For whatever reason these 2 were made for each other. I've tried my Rocktron with other Marshally style amps and it just doesn't have that mojo. Probably close enough to make most people happy but I was a bit OCD about chasing that tone so the pairing of the 2 really did it for me.

My advice would be to buy / save up for an Intelliverb when one pops up if you're really trying to nail that sound. Maybe the Intellifex is another decent option? I've never tried one but I hear they're close. Otherwise look for some kind of multi-voiced chorus preferably with control over the depths of each chorus.

Here's Dean in a live setting, back in the day when he made a lot more use of the effect. Compare that to what you hear in the demos of most pedals and I'd say there's a difference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgrS3fwLUiM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FEdYQUUgzA&feature=youtu.be&t=77

Personally I settled on this, found it to be the best tool for the job.
W590dae.jpg
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That is a killer rig. Do you have any experience with the TGA-3? I've always wondered how close it comes to the TGP-3 hitting the VHT power section.
 
EXPcustom":1f3zxfxv said:
JT087":1f3zxfxv said:
I'll record a video showing the Intelliverb vs some chorus pedals, and how you can tweak certain parameters on the rack that give it that psychedelic sound. Particularly the 116 Chorus/Verb preset, when that one gets tweaked the right way hitting a G chord sounds like you've woken up Frankenstein's monster when running a bunch of gain into it. I'd say this one sounds closest to what I hear on songs like Rooster or Plush. Not sure if it's the exact one they use as there's a metric shitload of chorus patches, all of them are highly tweakable and have the potential to sound somewhat close or very different.
Click to expand...

Can you please post the video, I am very curious as to what tones you have come up with and the settings?

Also I see some other posting that the Intellifex is the same or you will get similar tones vs the "verb". No you won't I have a few Intellifex units here as well. Lots of major differences in the hardware let alone software vs the Intelliverb.

Hopefully just trying to save someone some cash if they get an Intellifex and are not impressed with the chorus, delay or flanger. Not saying it's bad either but it's not some sort of cheap alternative to the Intelliverb either.
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Sorry I forgot to record the video before sending the preamp off, had to have a modification done to the channel switching circuit so it could work with my new switcher. When it gets back I'll get I'll upload some sounds and show what settings are used.
 
glassjaw7":2or1ud5n said:
JT087":2or1ud5n said:
SFW":2or1ud5n said:
I recently joined an STP tribute band. It's been pretty fun learning songs from my college days again. I can cover most of the base tones using my Spawn QuickRod and my Les Paul. What I am struggling with is the chorus sounds. Songs like Plush have a thick chorus to them. In fact, the entire Core album has a slight chorus effect on all of the songs. I know that Dean uses an Intellifex in his live rig and in the studio. I've also read that he uses an old Boss CE-1. So what chorus pedal can I use to get close to the tones that he gets? I currently have a TC Corona, but I really don't care for it. To my ears it just meh... I'd like to get that thick lush chorusing that doesn't overpower the core tone. I don't really want to drop the kinda money that original CE-1s are now commanding. So what do y'all suggest? Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

That is a killer rig. Do you have any experience with the TGA-3? I've always wondered how close it comes to the TGP-3 hitting the VHT power section.
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Thanks, it's definitely my favorite rig I've played to date, it covers a ton of ground. Some of the best Bassman like clean tones, classic Plexi crunch but with a bit more low end (or you can boost the 2nd channel to add even more low end and gain - sounds real similar to the 3rd channel), and the 3rd channel does that heavy STP thing all the way into slightly gated fuzz depending on how you've got it dialed in. Sometimes it feels like a damn modeling amp with the amount of sounds you can get out of it. There's even AC30-esque tones if EQ'd properly.

From what I understand Core was actually recorded on a TGA-3 that Dean borrowed since his rack wasn't ready yet. So yeah when you hear Plush on the record it's not the rack. The head is going to be a bit more old school and organic, and the rack a bit more hi-fi but ultimately they're pretty damn close. There will be some differences too in the VHT Classic using EL34's, and the TGA-3 using 6L6's. I recently ordered a 110watt TGA-3 with a Pentode/Triode switch that will let me take it from 110w down to 60w, and at 60w it'll have more midrange and get you closer to EL34 territory. Surprisingly the rack is killer at low to medium volume, and I'm sure the TGA-3 will too. Just using the FX send to control the output level to the power amp section sounds just as good to my ears as when I use the UA Ox to attenuate.

Oddly enough while it was Dean that got me interested in this setup, it was Ryan Wariner that made me pull the trigger on it. The guy can make anything sound amazing, but I've never heard him sound this good through a Marshall:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phLmfAyC_8Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9NorsvPzx0
 
Had an intelliverb at one point...Was a GREAT sounding unit....Unfortunately the plastic socket for the DSP chip is weak and broke. Just one day out of the blue the socket broke and wouldn't seat the chip. Something to be aware of(mine was in a shock rack too). If you have one, treat it good(I did and it still happened)....>Also, the intelliverb has a MASSIVE wall wart. Something else to keep in mind.
 
Awesome thread! I love STP and especially that old chorus sound. I hear some of that on the first Candlebox as well...really fun to play with.

I've got a Helix and a Fractal and from everything I've played with, it's far more of a detune/pitch shift sound than a swirling chorus. You can hear that quite a bit with the early SNL performances, just that classic predelay thickened tone. But you can hear a tiny bit of swirl at say the end of Plush. The references to multi-choruses though are interesting...I might have to try running the detune and chorus in parallel.

JT087, that's a killer setup! I would love that rack, probably my dream analog rig. I stumbled upon Ryan's videos as well and they are killer. I'd love more demos of that setup.
 
Purpleibby":2rq3wg6c said:
Had an intelliverb at one point...Was a GREAT sounding unit....Unfortunately the plastic socket for the DSP chip is weak and broke. Just one day out of the blue the socket broke and wouldn't seat the chip. Something to be aware of(mine was in a shock rack too). If you have one, treat it good(I did and it still happened)....>Also, the intelliverb has a MASSIVE wall wart. Something else to keep in mind.
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One solution for the wall wart is to order a custom power supply from XTS out of Nashville. I know it's more money but at least there's an option. I had them tack on a couple of extra 9v 200ma center negative slots to mine so I can add some extra stuff to the rig if need be.
 
I've read that currently "Dean DeLeo" uses the "BOSS Chorus CE-2W" which is based on the original "BOSS CE-1 Chorus Ensemble" released back in 1976. BOSS's first FX pedal, and it sounds AMAZING! Good luck finding one that isn't beat up.

ce-2w_00093.jpg


The left "S" switch position is the standard "BOSS CE-2", the middle switch position is a attempt at the original "BOSS CE-1 Chorus Ensemble" (it sounds great and very close in its own right) and the very right 3rd switch position is the tremolo.

Just take a close listen to the song "Plush" off of their second single from the band's 1992 debut studio album, "Core". You'll hear the "BOSS CE-1 Chorus Ensemble" there, for a example.

Good luck.

- CC
 
Octopus! I picked up an Intelliverb and went through all the presets first thing, Octopus alone is worth the price I paid for it.

That Plush clip kicks ass!
 
JT087":1fj1zwn0 said:
glassjaw7":1fj1zwn0 said:
JT087":1fj1zwn0 said:
SFW":1fj1zwn0 said:
I recently joined an STP tribute band. It's been pretty fun learning songs from my college days again. I can cover most of the base tones using my Spawn QuickRod and my Les Paul. What I am struggling with is the chorus sounds. Songs like Plush have a thick chorus to them. In fact, the entire Core album has a slight chorus effect on all of the songs. I know that Dean uses an Intellifex in his live rig and in the studio. I've also read that he uses an old Boss CE-1. So what chorus pedal can I use to get close to the tones that he gets? I currently have a TC Corona, but I really don't care for it. To my ears it just meh... I'd like to get that thick lush chorusing that doesn't overpower the core tone. I don't really want to drop the kinda money that original CE-1s are now commanding. So what do y'all suggest? Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

That is a killer rig. Do you have any experience with the TGA-3? I've always wondered how close it comes to the TGP-3 hitting the VHT power section.
Click to expand...

Thanks, it's definitely my favorite rig I've played to date, it covers a ton of ground. Some of the best Bassman like clean tones, classic Plexi crunch but with a bit more low end (or you can boost the 2nd channel to add even more low end and gain - sounds real similar to the 3rd channel), and the 3rd channel does that heavy STP thing all the way into slightly gated fuzz depending on how you've got it dialed in. Sometimes it feels like a damn modeling amp with the amount of sounds you can get out of it. There's even AC30-esque tones if EQ'd properly.

From what I understand Core was actually recorded on a TGA-3 that Dean borrowed since his rack wasn't ready yet. So yeah when you hear Plush on the record it's not the rack. The head is going to be a bit more old school and organic, and the rack a bit more hi-fi but ultimately they're pretty damn close. There will be some differences too in the VHT Classic using EL34's, and the TGA-3 using 6L6's. I recently ordered a 110watt TGA-3 with a Pentode/Triode switch that will let me take it from 110w down to 60w, and at 60w it'll have more midrange and get you closer to EL34 territory. Surprisingly the rack is killer at low to medium volume, and I'm sure the TGA-3 will too. Just using the FX send to control the output level to the power amp section sounds just as good to my ears as when I use the UA Ox to attenuate.

Oddly enough while it was Dean that got me interested in this setup, it was Ryan Wariner that made me pull the trigger on it. The guy can make anything sound amazing, but I've never heard him sound this good through a Marshall:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phLmfAyC_8Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9NorsvPzx0
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Nice! Please reply back with your thoughts on the TGA-3. Yeah, I still love the guitar sounds on Core and Purple. I also came across those XTS Ryan Wariner videos a couple years back and that's what made me realize that a rig like that could be super versatile and not just do the STP tones.
 
harddriver":3ghq53um said:
I came across this for you SFW I thought you might find it interesting.
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Michael got some great sounds with the Intelliverb there. He added the chorus in post editing as opposed to having the rack in series. Always different ways to skin a cat, both ways sound great.

I think one of the best things you can do to make all that gain work for you and not against you is have low output pickups. I think that's a big part of Dean and Ryan making that rig sound so sweet, that plus having a really good touch. Those late 70's LP's they're playing have T-Tops which generally were around 7.5k in the bridge with A5 mags.

For some reason in that clip the tele sounds a bit harsh but that's definitely not been my experience with it. Single coils are AWESOME through that rack. Some serious SRV and Hendrix tones in there, and you're not really changing any amp settings to go from STP to more classic single coil stuff. All you gotta do is make sure the 2nd channel isn't boosted so you get more of the Plexi type sounds, and leave the 3rd channel to do the STP thing. Shouldn't be too much longer before I have my gear back, will be able to upload a few examples.
 
I’d say don’t over think it and get an old CE-2 or newer CE-2w. Should be close enough in a live cranked band setting.
 
I expected the audio quality to be bad considering how I'm recording but surprised at the file size of the video, had to shorten it. Still don't have my 4x12 or VHT Classic back yet so this the Demeter TGP3, Intelliverb, Fryette 2/50/2 and Demeter 2x12. The big rig sounds better / different for sure but I figure this is better than nothing.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/1pWGNhC1b74
 
JT087":346rrznh said:
I expected the audio quality to be bad considering how I'm recording but surprised at the file size of the video, had to shorten it. Still don't have my 4x12 or VHT Classic back yet so this the Demeter TGP3, Intelliverb, Fryette 2/50/2 and Demeter 2x12. The big rig sounds better / different for sure but I figure this is better than nothing.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/1pWGNhC1b74
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Sounds great! Can you let me know what settings or presets on the intelliverb you're using?
 
EXPcustom":2dg4ztga said:
JT087":2dg4ztga said:
I expected the audio quality to be bad considering how I'm recording but surprised at the file size of the video, had to shorten it. Still don't have my 4x12 or VHT Classic back yet so this the Demeter TGP3, Intelliverb, Fryette 2/50/2 and Demeter 2x12. The big rig sounds better / different for sure but I figure this is better than nothing.

https://www.youtube.com/embed/1pWGNhC1b74
Click to expand...

Sounds great! Can you let me know what settings or presets on the intelliverb you're using?
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Thanks, although I really do think it sounds like shit. Being in the room with it sounds a hell of a lot better. So many people on the forum here seem to get good in the room sounds but for some reason I can't seem to.

Also my settings seemed to have been changed from what I previously used, probably why it's a little further away from the live early 90's versions of the Core stuff than I usually I have it sounding. When I get my 4x12 and VHT classic back I'll tweak it until I find the dead on sounds again and put up some other songs like Sin.

It's preset 116 Chorus/Verb

Mixer:
Effect level +1
L DIR 9
R DIR 9
Delay level 0
Reverb Level -18

HUSH OFF

Chorus 1 pan hard left:
Level -1
Delay 0ms
Depth 5
Rate 8

Chorus 2 pan hard right:
Level -1
Delay 0ms
Depth 13
Rate 15

Chorus 3 pan hard left:
Level -1.5
Delay 0ms
Depth 22
Rate 24

Chorus 4 pan hard right:
Level -1.5
Delay 0ms
Depth 28
Rate 31

The mixer's L and R DIR level is what's going to get you closer to that sound. When you increase the gain on your amp then you start increasing the amount of those levels, and the less gain you run the more you want to subtract from those levels. Recording is in mono too, didn't bother to hook up the 2x12 in stereo.
 
^Wow, those chorus settings are interesting. I guess it's like pressing two buttons at once on an old Roland SDD-320 "Dimension D"?
 
Instead of trying to emulate the studio recording chorus sound I would listen to some live tracks of STP and try and use that as a goal. Often times the actual artists have a hard time recreating what they did in the studio.
 
danyeo":2qvnavfw said:
Instead of trying to emulate the studio recording chorus sound I would listen to some live tracks of STP and try and use that as a goal. Often times the actual artists have a hard time recreating what they did in the studio.
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He has both a CE-1 and an Intelliverb in his live rig.

deandeleoboard.jpg



deanrack1.jpg
 
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