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PostPosted: Mon, Sep 09, 2019 7:35pm 
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Recommendations are great. Especially PCB.

BOGNER/ single channel SLO peak my interest.

Something more simple. PCB is a plus. So is a layout. Looking to drop a grand in parts top. Any guidance appreciated.

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PostPosted: Mon, Sep 09, 2019 8:19pm 
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Try Nik at Ceriatone. I think he is getting ready to release an Atomica inspired build. It's called a Molecula or something like that. He also is doing a slo type build as well I think its called the FAS 100. Neither are PCB but it will have layouts etc.

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PostPosted: Mon, Sep 09, 2019 8:23pm 
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thanks. that is cool. i would have to get different iron though. i have never heard positive review on their trannys.

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BUILDS: 5F1, 1978X 18 Watt.
BUILDS IN PROCESS: AA165, JTM45.
And a bunch of modded EPI VJR's.


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PostPosted: Mon, Sep 09, 2019 8:26pm 
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I've heard it both ways but yeah I think getting a kit without the Iron is the way to go. You would save a bit on shipping and you wouldnt have to take a chance on whoever they have doing theirs. You could also just get the layouts from them and source everything on your own. He always posts his layouts when he starts talking about offering the models.

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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 11:35am 
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ClintN667 wrote:
Try Nik at Ceriatone. I think he is getting ready to release an Atomica inspired build. It's called a Molecula or something like that. He also is doing a slo type build as well I think its called the FAS 100. Neither are PCB but it will have layouts etc.

Why would he release an Atomica. He has the Meshuggah copy, the Chupa, the Yeti....it's the same amp different values. :confused:

It's just a single gain knob instead of 2.

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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 11:48am 
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Curious why set on PCB? There is a growing number multichannel PCBs but it's simply not worth the effort for single channel since they're so simple. Going single channel your PCB options are going to be minimal. Tons of documentation for turret and layout for single channel. I would recommend turret. Much easier to troubleshoot, rework, modify and people will be able to assist.

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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 12:06pm 
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A good practice is to plot out a board with Visio objects. I think I have most.

Most people tweak and it becomes tough to do so on PCB

Image
Image
Image
Image

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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 12:12pm 
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I am fine with turrets or eyelet board. I just want a clear layout and not derive everything from a schematic when there is so much involved.

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Splawn: PROMOD KT88, Nitro KT88, Super Sport 6V6. Orange Rockerverb 50mki. Fryette Sig:X. Rivera K100, K-TRE. Mesa:, mkIV, Tremoverb, Nomad 100, Subway Blues, .22 cal w/GEQ Musicman 100RD.Fender: 72 SF Bassman, 70 Twin Reverb, 67 SF Bandmaster. Ampeg: Lee Jackson, AX70, Crate BV120 w/CEC mods.
BUILDS: 5F1, 1978X 18 Watt.
BUILDS IN PROCESS: AA165, JTM45.
And a bunch of modded EPI VJR's.


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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 4:50pm 
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I'm a novice when it comes to reading schematics but how hard would it be to just clip a multi channel amp down to one channel? This thread reminded me that I can use Visio for other things besides work related diagrams.

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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 6:14pm 
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ClintN667 wrote:
I'm a novice when it comes to reading schematics but how hard would it be to just clip a multi channel amp down to one channel?
easy once you can read the schematic..

Here is a 10000 foot view of the preamp....

On a 12ax7, it is split into two triodes. Pins 2 and 7 are the grids and this is where the guitar signal feeds into the tube.

Pins 1 and 6 are the plates. The plates serve two main purposes, they power the tube, but it is also where the amplified signal leaves the tube going to the next stage.
The exception to this is the tone stack on Marshall type amps or other designs that utilize a cathode follower for the tone stack actually comes off the cathode instead of the plates

Pins 3 and 8 are the cathodes and here is where you are basically biasing the preamp tubes to achieve a specific amount of gain on the signal.

Pins for 5 and 9 are the heaters.


https://robrobinette.com/How_Tubes_Work.htm

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PostPosted: Tue, Sep 10, 2019 6:47pm 
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Thanks! I've been watching Blueglow Electronics's Youtube channel on reading schematics plus going over some I downloaded. Every time I look at them I'm starting to understand more each time but I'm still a long way off of where I would like to be. At least I am enjoying it.

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PostPosted: Wed, Sep 11, 2019 5:53pm 
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scottosan wrote:
ClintN667 wrote:
Try Nik at Ceriatone. I think he is getting ready to release an Atomica inspired build. It's called a Molecula or something like that. He also is doing a slo type build as well I think its called the FAS 100. Neither are PCB but it will have layouts etc.

Why would he release an Atomica. He has the Meshuggah copy, the Chupa, the Yeti....it's the same amp different values. :confused:

It's just a single gain knob instead of 2.


I'm wondering the same thing. They're all the same circuit, just a few value changes here and there for different voicings. But hey... they aren't the only ones to change the slope resistor, slap a cool name on the front panel, and call it a new amp lol

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PostPosted: Wed, Sep 11, 2019 7:17pm 
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Yeah he didnt really mention what set it apart from his other similar amps. But as you've said there are a lot of guys doing the same thing. Well at least he isnt charging $3000+ but he is beating that hodded rodded plexi section to death

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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 13, 2019 5:43am 
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FourT6and2 wrote:
scottosan wrote:
ClintN667 wrote:
Try Nik at Ceriatone. I think he is getting ready to release an Atomica inspired build. It's called a Molecula or something like that. He also is doing a slo type build as well I think its called the FAS 100. Neither are PCB but it will have layouts etc.

Why would he release an Atomica. He has the Meshuggah copy, the Chupa, the Yeti....it's the same amp different values. :confused:

It's just a single gain knob instead of 2.


I'm wondering the same thing. They're all the same circuit, just a few value changes here and there for different voicings. But hey... they aren't the only ones to change the slope resistor, slap a cool name on the front panel, and call it a new amp lol


Because 99% of guitarists don't know this and think amps are magic and the Atomica is rare and hard to come by? Case in point see all the threads about magic transformers that can't be replicated over on TGP :lol: :LOL:

For building Rob Robinette's site linked above is excellent for getting started understanding what is going on.


Last edited by technomancer on Fri, Sep 13, 2019 1:43pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 13, 2019 11:36am 
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technomancer wrote:
FourT6and2 wrote:
scottosan wrote:
ClintN667 wrote:
Try Nik at Ceriatone. I think he is getting ready to release an Atomica inspired build. It's called a Molecula or something like that. He also is doing a slo type build as well I think its called the FAS 100. Neither are PCB but it will have layouts etc.

Why would he release an Atomica. He has the Meshuggah copy, the Chupa, the Yeti....it's the same amp different values. :confused:

It's just a single gain knob instead of 2.


I'm wondering the same thing. They're all the same circuit, just a few value changes here and there for different voicings. But hey... they aren't the only ones to change the slope resistor, slap a cool name on the front panel, and call it a new amp lol


Because 99% of guitarists don't know this and think amps are magic and the Atomica is rare and hard to come by? Case in point see all the threads about magic transformers that can't be replicated over on TGP :lol: :LOL:

For building Rob Robinette's site linked about is excellent is excellent for getting started understanding what is going on.


Yeah Rob's site is a great resource.

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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 13, 2019 11:41am 
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ClintN667 wrote:
Yeah he didnt really mention what set it apart from his other similar amps. But as you've said there are a lot of guys doing the same thing. Well at least he isnt charging $3000+ but he is beating that hodded rodded plexi section to death


To be fair, the cost of parts on a one-off build can be upwards of $1800 if you use top shelf stuff. Let's say I can build an amp in 5 days, 8 hours/day. That's 40 hours. If I charge a simple bench fee of $65/hr, that's $2,600 of labor. I then only profit $800 for a weeks' worth of work. With economies of scale at work, $3K for an amp is still not a lot from the perspective of a business. Maybe parts cost drops to $900 for a small-batch production amp. So profit goes up to about $1,000 per amp. Nobody is getting rich building guitar amps. $3K seems to be about the going rate for any quality amp these days (and thinking about it, has always been the case since I can remember).

If anybody wanted to buy one of the amps I've built, it would have to be for $3K at least. Otherwise not worth it for me. Why would I SPEND and LOSE money to build someone an amp? Sure, you can argue that $65/hr is too much. But hey, it costs what it costs. I think some techs charge more than that. An auto mechanic in my state charges like $90/hr...

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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 13, 2019 1:47pm 
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FourT6and2 wrote:
ClintN667 wrote:
Yeah he didnt really mention what set it apart from his other similar amps. But as you've said there are a lot of guys doing the same thing. Well at least he isnt charging $3000+ but he is beating that hodded rodded plexi section to death


To be fair, the cost of parts on a one-off build can be upwards of $1800 if you use top shelf stuff. Let's say I can build an amp in 5 days, 8 hours/day. That's 40 hours. If I charge a simple bench fee of $65/hr, that's $2,600 of labor. I then only profit $800 for a weeks' worth of work. With economies of scale at work, $3K for an amp is still not a lot from the perspective of a business. Maybe parts cost drops to $900 for a small-batch production amp. So profit goes up to about $1,000 per amp. Nobody is getting rich building guitar amps. $3K seems to be about the going rate for any quality amp these days (and thinking about it, has always been the case since I can remember).

If anybody wanted to buy one of the amps I've built, it would have to be for $3K at least. Otherwise not worth it for me. Why would I SPEND and LOSE money to build someone an amp? Sure, you can argue that $65/hr is too much. But hey, it costs what it costs. I think some techs charge more than that. An auto mechanic in my state charges like $90/hr...


Yep. Said it before and I'll say it again, I would never want to do this for a living.

Nik's prices are cheaper because cost of living and wages are cheaper where he lives and his component cost is cheaper, period.


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PostPosted: Thu, Sep 19, 2019 9:05pm 
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So guys, don't mean to derail from Derek's thread but I doubt he'll mind, how does Scott Splawn get away with selling his amps in the $2,000 - $2,300 range. New.

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Dan is largely misunderstood, a great person, a good GP and has excellent gear. Other than that they are nothing alike."
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PostPosted: Thu, Sep 19, 2019 9:18pm 
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311splawndude wrote:
So guys, don't mean to derail from Derek's thread but I doubt he'll mind, how does Scott Splawn get away with selling his amps in the $2,000 - $2,300 range. New.


I almost posted the same thing. He uses nice iron and premium components on top of that.

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BUILDS: 5F1, 1978X 18 Watt.
BUILDS IN PROCESS: AA165, JTM45.
And a bunch of modded EPI VJR's.


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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 20, 2019 7:07am 
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311splawndude wrote:
So guys, don't mean to derail from Derek's thread but I doubt he'll mind, how does Scott Splawn get away with selling his amps in the $2,000 - $2,300 range. New.

By making most of his own stuff and low cost of living in his area. Most of the California guys are sourcing cabs/headshells and are paying a premium for overhead, labor, etc...

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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 20, 2019 8:02am 
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scottosan wrote:
311splawndude wrote:
So guys, don't mean to derail from Derek's thread but I doubt he'll mind, how does Scott Splawn get away with selling his amps in the $2,000 - $2,300 range. New.

By making most of his own stuff and low cost of living in his area. Most of the California guys are sourcing cabs/headshells and are paying a premium for overhead, labor, etc...

That's a good point I guess. That and I hear he is a one man show these days.

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A bunch of pedals
Clips
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"PEOPLE TRUST ME WITH THEIR LIVES,,,,, THINK ABOUT IT!" - Billy Blades

"I don't let peoples opinion of me rent space in my head, its none of my bidness."- Charveldan

"Mr. Blades is a dickwad, can't play for shit, can't make an amp to save his life and has shit gear.
Dan is largely misunderstood, a great person, a good GP and has excellent gear. Other than that they are nothing alike."
- Charveldan 03/02/16..............AKA: Chester Nimitz


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PostPosted: Fri, Sep 20, 2019 11:46am 
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Ceriatone has good layouts. I built a plexi and believe me, Im not an amp builder by any means.


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PostPosted: Sun, Sep 22, 2019 2:38pm 
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ClintN667 wrote:
Thanks! I've been watching Blueglow Electronics's Youtube channel on reading schematics plus going over some I downloaded. Every time I look at them I'm starting to understand more each time but I'm still a long way off of where I would like to be. At least I am enjoying it.


I've recommended this site before for people teaching themselves electronics:

http://www.learnabout-electronics.org/

If you look at it, let me know what you think. It's always a little hard to judge these things from this side! :)

To your original question, it isn't that hard. Many (most?) multichannel amps are closer to single channel amps with lots of options to switch, so it may be a lot easier conceptually to get comfortable with a single channel amp and look how things stack up from there. About 90% of all high gain amplifiers out there are based on the Marshall 2203/2204 preamp, so if you can learn how to read that schematic you'll be most of the way there for anything else out there.

Boogies are the only real exception I can think of there.


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