Do you think modelers will get there in the next 10 years?

Kemper has been around for a long time now. No way you would be able to distinguish between a properly made profile vs the real amp in person.




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Metlupass2 said:
Yeah with a blindfold and ball gag.
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Will there be a gimp provided?
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[ Donnie B. ] said:
Do I get to play the guitar and A-B the two choices in real time?
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As you probably know, yes Donnie.

Christoph said the A/B-comparison feature as part of the Profiling process (used during refining or to help make a decision as to whether to refine or not) was there also for confidence / as a means of verifying the efficacy of the endeavour.

He added that he felt it was important to provide a legit A/B ability 'cause he believed it was a critical feature absent in all previous modellers. Sans Profiling ability, all one had previously were the reassurances of the modelling companies and the option to set up A/B comparisons one's self, a real shot in the dark when one considers that most modellers borrowed / bought single, albeit exemplary examples of each amp as their bases for component modelling.
 
Metlupass2 said:
Kemper has been around for a long time now. No way you would be able to distinguish between a properly made profile vs the real amp in person.




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Ha ha ha such bullshit. This is EXACTLY what I did with my friends Kemper, and his Friedman modded Marshall. Very easy to tell which was which while playing. Kemper has no FEEL. Not like a real amp.

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Monkey Man said:
Christoph said the A/B-comparison feature as part of the Profiling process (used during refining or to help make a decision as to whether to refine or not) was there also for confidence / as a means of verifying the efficacy of the endeavor.
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I'd never read that! I used the A/B function purely for volume match but then would refine my profiles really extensively using the entire neck and lots of dynamics and staccato and/or legato licks. I only profiled two heads this way using the DI method and they both ended up scary good.
 
Racerxrated said:
Ha ha ha such bullshit. This is EXACTLY what I did with my friends Kemper, and his Friedman modded Marshall. Very easy to tell which was which while playing. Kemper has no FEEL. Not like a real amp.

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Ok and how did he profile it ? Was it a direct profile?
 
psychodave said:
I find it amazing that these people have never played through a cranked Marshall. Guess I’ve been lucky to get my first Marshall, a 1971 SL, at age 19 and a few months later a 1967 Marshall Plexi. I’d play in my fathers basement cranked through two 4x12’s. I’d slam the fron with a DOD preamp 250 and echoplex. I’d play for hours. I would also go out to a local warehouse on weekends...where they had outside outlets and bring all of my amps and play on 10 for hours. I’d have people coming over to hear me play. It was great. I played so much I was blowing 30 watt Celestions quite often.

All of that said, and backing up my comments based on that video of 16 players who never played through a cranked Plexi... that most guitar players don’t know how to play with loud volumes. Kinda sad.
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It too me a long time to learn to play a cranked amp, it’s intimidating if you’re not used to it. But once you’ve done it, it’s addictive. So inspiring.
 
[ Donnie B. ] said:
I'd never read that! I used the A/B function purely for volume match but then would refine my profiles really extensively using the entire neck and lots of dynamics and staccato and/or legato licks. I only profiled two heads this way using the DI method and they both ended up scary good.
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Well, when you were refining, that was the perfect time to hit the A/B soft keys.

Christoph also said that the feature was there to help prove the integrity of the Profiling process, that putting out a unit that was unique in its ability to do this meant nothing unless the end user could verify its accuracy in-situ.

Great that you put some effort into refining, Brother Donnie; its value should not be underestimated.

You may have seen Guido's clip from 11 days ago. If not, check out how much work he puts into refining. This might be a good clip for digital-"emulation" sceptics as well:

 
glpg80 said:
It too me a long time to learn to play a cranked amp, it’s intimidating if you’re not used to it. But once you’ve done it, it’s addictive. So inspiring.
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Yeah, once you learn and understand it’s tough to play amps quietly. 🤣 Sadly, I haven’t played loud in decades. I rarely play my Plexi these days. Should probably sell it.
 
Metlupass2 said:
Ok and how did he profile it ? Was it a direct profile?
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He has some purchased profiles, M Britt I think and more? But, it's about how the guitar responds when you play, the nuances that the Kemper nor the AXE can replicate. While it sounds decent enough, it feels and responds like a fake modeler. Which is exactly what it is.

Like I've said, through a PA or recording they are stellar. But until they can give me the tube amp response/feel/nuance while playing, I'll pass.
 
glpg80 said:
It too me a long time to learn to play a cranked amp, it’s intimidating if you’re not used to it. But once you’ve done it, it’s addictive. So inspiring.
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It's these experiences that teach the player that they HAVE to learn to use their pickup volumes..very quickly or else you'll lose control of your rig lol.
 
Racerxrated said:
It's these experiences that teach the player that they HAVE to learn to use their pickup volumes..very quickly or else you'll lose control of your rig lol.
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It will make you become a volume level type of player if you’re not one. But in doing so it opens up so much in terms of your playing and dynamics. It puts a whole new meaning to feeling notes under your fingers...it’s just something that modeling doesn’t get right. Yeah they can get loud but it’s more stereo system loud and not a connection to directly what you’re playing.
 
Monkey Man said:
Well, when you were refining, that was the perfect time to hit the A/B soft keys.

Christoph also said that the feature was there to help prove the integrity of the Profiling process, that putting out a unit that was unique in its ability to do this meant nothing unless the end user could verify its accuracy in-situ.

Great that you put some effort into refining, Brother Donnie; its value should not be underestimated.

You may have seen Guido's clip from 11 days ago. If not, check out how much work he puts into refining. This might be a good clip for digital-"emulation" sceptics as well:

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His profiles were the only ones I ever bought that I liked but I made all my own profiles.


No friggin way you can tell the difference between the Soldano and the Kemper in the video.
 
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Agreed, mate.

I felt it might be instructive to sceptics here not only for the tone but the volume-knob and pickup behaviour.

When an experienced dude like Guido can't hear or feel any difference, you know you're doing OK. He's no shill for those who may still be sceptical; I'm honoured to be able to call him a bud and he's a cool, honest dude.
 
harddriver said:
You're not allowed to reach that conclusion!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! You sir must be doing it all wrong to have reached your very own conclusion derived from your actual real world user experience with Kemper and tube amplifiers. Absolutely not possible................................................................:ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:

Oh, I forgot... you are a tube snob with non-golden ears and can't accept that digital modeling is equal in all ways to tube amps and has surpassed and relegated tube amps to the ashheap of history.:p I apologize for using the term golden ears...:hys:
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Nobody has talked about people not being allowed to say any amp sounds crap. You can say that as much as you want. Subjectivity is whatever ice-cream you like. My point is that the elephant in the room is that there are no objective reasons concerning the units to claim profilers can't replicate tube amps. Some people tried that and failed to support their claims. Eventually admitting it is really a subjective position they have. It is not my fault that this subjectivity does not sit well with some people who still want there is to be some physical difference or something impeding profilers from accurately replicating tubes. The bottom line is don't go around claiming profiling technology isn't there yet if you don't want to be left unable to objectively explain how. You won't win that one because no one has over the past decade. If they had then we would use those claims instead of trying to invent our own.

Now about what they said about Metallica. They heard them live (outside an arena) and thought they sounded bad. Therefore we should regard whatever guitar amp they used as lacking? They are welcome to that opinion but do you really think we should reject gear because someone sounded bad playing it somewhere? Is that a good way to judge an amp?

Fordman65 said:
What a long winded rant of BS. Every single one of your reasons to still own a tube amp is garabage. I was with you for awhile on this, but your credibility is shot. A tube amp is preferred because you have load boxes? Or you have "a lot" of guitar cabs? Different tubes? WTF kind of response are those? Give me a damn break. If modelers "are there" none of that matters. Get a good power amp, like the matrix and sell all the rest of that inferior crap. Pure bullshit response.

BTW, I was the one that was quoted. Check the other thread.
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Let's address just one of your complaints. I have spent a small fortune on Two Note IRs. I have a big collection of them. I have milked them to sound great. Explain to me how I recoup the costs by selling that "inferior crap"?
 
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