Tubes not included

[ClintN667]

I honestly needed some tubes even before this happened. I used what spares I had left in the 6505+ I just bought off the used market and my dumbass ordered a 2204 from Ceriatone without tubes. So I grabbed a set of power tubes to retube each of my 4 amps. Im going to continue buying some here and there but not for gouging prices. I would love to have enough to cover me for this last half of my life and be done with it.

 

[ClintN667]

I really like the TAD preamp and power tubes in my KSR. I havent tried them in anything else but Im optimistic.

 

[9985]

Maybe it's old news that I wasn't aware of, but I was pleasantly surprised to see an offical WE statement about exploring unspecified expanded production. Had always written off people's hopes of WE getting into guitar amp tubes as preposterous due to price.

Maybe someone with more technical understanding than me could comment about the manufacturing complexity, and tolerances of 300B vs common guitar pre/power tube types. This article about WE history is interesting, particularly that they had two previous manufacturing locations in US. It's waaaay over my head about the exotic materials they are using:

https://www.stereophile.com/content...o-amplifier-western-electric-300b-tube-page-2

 

[MetalHeadMike]

Not gonna happen. New amps won't leave the factory without tubes. Prices of new amps will just increase... That is my opinion.
On the second hand market however... there always were and will be idiots.

Maybe for the majority, but there are manufacturers who have not been shipping tubes in new amps for quite some time. Peters is one off the top of my head.

 

[311boogieman]

I mean. If I had the tubes I wanted already I wouldn't mind an amp shipping to me cheaper as long as it was relative

How many times do we swap the tube out first thing anyway?

 

[Mailman1971]

I am trying to sell a car. Tires not included.

 

[Iceman8.6]

 

[MadAsAHatter]

Maybe for the majority, but there are manufacturers who have not been shipping tubes in new amps for quite some time. Peters is one off the top of my head.

Peters stopped shipping with tubes because of too many issues with carrier's rough handling and tubes breaking during transit. He also lowered his prices to compensate and offers to help you source a set and walk you through biasing if needed. this is fully understandable and completely reasonable.

 

[BeZo]

I guess I don't understand. If the amp is listed as working condition, and you get it without tubes, how can it work? If I can't fire it up right after I unbox it, it's not working. If they sell without tubes, it can't be in working condition, because it needs tubes to work. It's like, as previously stated, selling a car as driveable, but taking the wheels off of it. It's not usable.

I see claims of a amp not functioning on arrival as standard, and the cost of tubes, and bench time from a local tech to bias it coming off the bill to "repair the amp to be operational".

 

[MadAsAHatter]

I guess I don't understand. If the amp is listed as working condition, and you get it without tubes, how can it work? If I can't fire it up right after I unbox it, it's not working. If they sell without tubes, it can't be in working condition, because it needs tubes to work. It's like, as previously stated, selling a car as driveable, but taking the wheels off of it. It's not usable.

I see claims of a amp not functioning on arrival as standard, and the cost of tubes, and bench time from a local tech to bias it coming off the bill to "repair the amp to be operational".

Exactly. Even if it arrives in 100% working condition and you have spare tubes to use it still has to go to the shop for biasing. Not all amps have external test points and bias. I'm ok with those, but I'm not gonna open up a JCM and attempt to bias it. Is the seller gonna pay my funeral bills when I accidentally bump a capacitor and kill myself?

 

[Metalhex]

It's like buying a brand new car without gas in it and not being able to see if it drives first.

I'm sure tubes will not stop being produced but the price will be inflated for quite some time until everyone stops clamoring for them.

 

[MadAsAHatter]

I can hear the guitar center commercial in my head

Get a new amplifier at guitar center and be ready to ROCK!!! tubes and transformers not included

 

[MetalHeadMike]

Peters stopped shipping with tubes because of too many issues with carrier's rough handling and tubes breaking during transit. He also lowered his prices to compensate and offers to help you source a set and walk you through biasing if needed. this is fully understandable and completely reasonable.

That is true and correct. I was just the point that new amps shipping without tubes isn't necessarily a new thing.

 

[psychodave]

Peters stopped shipping with tubes because of too many issues with carrier's rough handling and tubes breaking during transit. He also lowered his prices to compensate and offers to help you source a set and walk you through biasing if needed. this is fully understandable and completely reasonable.

So how do tubes arrive? From a shipper? ?. I’m surprised he just didn’t box them up inside the amp. I do this with every amp I sell. Zero issues.

 

[MadAsAHatter]

So how do tubes arrive? From a shipper? ?. I’m surprised he just didn’t box them up inside the amp. I do this with every amp I sell. Zero issues.

This is the statement from his webpage:
"Prices for amplifiers now do not include tubes; the prices have been reduced accordingly. I now ship amps without tubes included, due to some tube breakage during transit and other tube warranty concerns. I can provide assistance with finding a reputable tube supplier for you, and it’s easy to bias Peters amps (which is something you should learn to do anyway when you buy one); see the biasing page. The procedure is simple and only takes a couple minutes. No one has had trouble biasing Peters amps, and I’m here if you need help."

It may have just been easier for him and the customers to buy tubes separately from another source than dealing with shipping and/or warranty claims if tubes arrived broken.

 

[MadAsAHatter]

That is true and correct. I was just the point that new amps shipping without tubes isn't necessarily a new thing.

Yup, I was adding that Peters was doing it because of other issues and not because he was tying to pull something over on people incase someone didn't know his good reputation.

 

[311boogieman]

Just a few points on both sides of the argument:

1. Tubes should ship wrapped up separately, as mentioned. Always. Never mounted in the amp.
2. How many times do we buy things with 'batteries not included'. We put our own batteries in. Not a big deal.
3. I didn't look at the Peters biasing tutorial but if you have never biased before and are not 100% sure what you are doing it will take more than a few minutes and can be stressful the first time out. After that, it is a piece of cake. Just don't stick both hands on the circuit board at the same time. Stick one hand in your back pocket and turn the variable resistor to desired level.

 

[LPMojoGL]

That is true and correct. I was just the point that new amps shipping without tubes isn't necessarily a new thing.

Not a big deal. Easy to install and bias.
I wish my Jeep Wrangler had an option of buying with no wheels and tires.
There's a Vox AC30 6TB for sale at a local GC. I checked it out last night.
No tubes in it! (In my best Slingblade voice)
I'm curious if that has to do with current state of things, if it has issues, or what's up with that.

 

[LPMojoGL]

Just a few points on both sides of the argument:

1. Tubes should ship wrapped up separately, as mentioned. Always. Never mounted in the amp.

Every new amp I've received came with tubes mounted. I ship with tubes mounted.
They only times I've received amps with broken tubes, is when the seller took the tubes out and bubble wrapped them separately.
It's usually safer for them to be in the amp, as long as the amp is packed well, in my experience. An exception being something like a 1x12 combo with tubes hanging down from the chassis and no tube retainers.

 

[blackba]

Every new amp I've received came with tubes mounted. I ship with tubes mounted.
They only times I've received amps with broken tubes, is when the seller took the tubes out and bubble wrapped them separately.
It's usually safer for them to be in the amp, as long as the amp is packed well, in my experience. An exception being something like a 1x12 combo with tubes hanging down from the chassis and no tube retainers.

I only remove the tubes if they are hanging down and there are no tube retainers. I have been installing those tube retainers springs on every vintage fender that comes through, just saves a lot of headaches even when transporting for gigs.