Mesa Vintage 30, 8 vs 16 ohm?
- Thread starter peterc52
- Start date
@blackie13 description is spot on. I only have experience with the newer Chinese v30 but the same 8 ohm vs 16ohm differences apply.
the4thlast1
Well-known member
Sooo many variables. Ive done this experiment a few times. Once with greenbacks and a couple times with v30s. The 8ohm speakers always sound better to me than 16. The 8s sound smoother with better mids. 16s sound a little scooped with a more aggressive high.
cardinal
Well-known member
Mesa cabs/speakers IME are too inconsistent to really say.
I have two OS412s from 2010s with speakers that date two months apart. One of them sounds great and the other sounds terrible. Bright and thin with no mid range at all. The terrible sounding is well broken in as it did the local band circuit for a while.
I pulled the speakers out of that one, and put in a quad of 16 ohm 4416s from the early 90s. Now I can't tell the two cabs apart.
[Ive probably had six OS412 cabs. The first one I bough was late '90s/early 2000 and sounded amazing. Smooth and warm. Sold it to make space assuming I could get another. Had three or four since that I hated until hitting on these two]
I have two OS412s from 2010s with speakers that date two months apart. One of them sounds great and the other sounds terrible. Bright and thin with no mid range at all. The terrible sounding is well broken in as it did the local band circuit for a while.
I pulled the speakers out of that one, and put in a quad of 16 ohm 4416s from the early 90s. Now I can't tell the two cabs apart.
[Ive probably had six OS412 cabs. The first one I bough was late '90s/early 2000 and sounded amazing. Smooth and warm. Sold it to make space assuming I could get another. Had three or four since that I hated until hitting on these two]
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Nigel
Guest
Thanks for this. I bought an ‘03 OS that I’ve considered selling, and now I will hold like a diamond handed ape. It has THE sound. Im sure a 90’s cab may be the tits deluxe, but this one has T4335’s that don’t have the “B” and I recall a brother saying 2003 and prior were the great ones.
cardinal
Well-known member
One of the worst sounding cabs I ever had was a '93 Recto cab. I was expecting it to sound godly but it was all piercing treble and no midrange. Was so disappointed.
If you have one that sounds good; do no sell it.
The guy who does York Audio has mentioned this same thing. He said he has two OS412s built a few months apart but they sound very different and he only uses one of them for the IR captures.
I've not run into this level of inconsistency with other Celestions or cabinets. Not sure what it is. I absolutely hate the idea that some gear has magic fairy dust, but I don't know what else is going on with these.
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Nigel
Guest
The '93 was probably before Mesa got their own T-number line developed and had the post-change-for-the-worse T3904 or T3903 speakers prior to the T4335/T4416. Talked with Steve Fryette about that very thing last night on his YouTube show, "The Malcontents" (link is to the proper time!
Also, an IR developer chimed in about the differences in V30's over on the Fractal forum, and shed light on different Mesa cabs:
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/british-vs-chinese-celestion-speakers.146589/
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Nigel
Guest
I spoke with a good brother over at Mesa a while back and asked why the 4x12’s and combos had 8 ohm speakers, and he said when they were testing them it was agreed that the 8 ohm just have better tone.
cardinal
Well-known member
The '93 was probably before Mesa got their own T-number line developed and had the post-change-for-the-worse T3904 or T3903 speakers prior to the T4335/T4416. Talked with Steve Fryette about that very thing last night on his YouTube show, "The Malcontents" (link is to the proper time!
Also, an IR developer chimed in about the differences in V30's over on the Fractal forum, and shed light on different Mesa cabs:
https://forum.fractalaudio.com/threads/british-vs-chinese-celestion-speakers.146589/
No it was the 4335 speakers. I have quads of '89 and '91 V30s and both oddly sound different from each other and from the Mesa spec too.
My suspicion is that the Mesa spec is NOT some original V30 formula. It just doesn't sound like that older speakers I have. The Mesa spec is just an OEM thing like the Marshall spec.
Different from the typical 3903/04, which does seem to have changed in the very early '90s from something very aggressive and bright to something more high-mid focused (based on the difference between my quads of '89 and '91 V30s).
The Mesa spec is even warmer and I don't hear as much of that nasal upper mid peak (I actually kinda like that upper mid peak).
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panhead
Well-known member
I honestly think its because Mesa`s only have 8 and 4 ohm taps you know like a fender
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Nigel
Guest
No I raised that point with him, the obvious "well perhaps old man Randall, that rascal, just didn't want people buying the cheaper 16 ohm Marshall 4x12's to use with his amps and thus only 8 ohm taps and cabs!" to which he retorted it was for tone reasons. Of course, this is political and economic, so what the objective truth is cannot be known for certain, though these points definitely have their merit.I honestly think its because Mesa`s only have 8 and 4 ohm taps you know like a fender
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Nigel
Guest
VERY interesting. What are the T-numbers of your '89 and '91 quads? I would suspect and endorse the notion that different runs of the same T number will have different sounding speakers just because, well, these are guitar speakers and tolerances aren't NASA spec like Soldano so there WILL be differences. My September '93 T3904 16 ohms (which are in the classified section, BTW!) are fantastic speakers but I'm broke so they have to go!
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Nigel
Guest
Perhaps the ultimate quote regarding V30's:
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Nigel
Guest
So is the one loaded with 8 ohm T4335's and the other 16 ohm T4416s and you can't tell the difference?
Clips would be fantastic!
cardinal
Well-known member
They all are T3904.
I've read that pre '91, all V30s were the Marshall spec, even those stamped 3903 or 3904. In '91 they changed the T3904 to generally what it is today, and the Mesa 4335 and 4416 came out around there as well as its own thing.
But I don't know if that's true. According to the Internet the Mesa spec is the "original" V30 which sure doesn't seem right to me.
cardinal
Well-known member
Yeah they sound the same to me now. I don't have any recording equipment. Should by a SM57. Just have an iPhone.
cardinal
Well-known member
Well they sound different. They sound right in the Mesa cabs but IMHO I prefer the Celestion or Marshall spec in a Marshall cab. Mesa spec doesn't have enough bite.