More hype than heavy hitter

[Smashedguitaris⸸]

I was racking my brain for the name of henning amplification last few days for the defunct amp thread, because i was so close to buying a bottle rocket til a few members steered me away.

We all are searching for something to fulfill the experience, sometimes after we have found
It. But that comes with a lot of flipping and a lot of new brands trying to fill that need.

I remember some of the brands that were popular 2016-2020ish that i just wonder what has happened, who still rocks those amps, and anyone that had them and sold them; what was your experience?

Off the top of my head, Dover, henning, armored amps, fortin( this could be its own thread) etc.

You could add one that i am not thinking about. The thing i wonder with fortin is did he ever really produce a good amp, or was he just amazing at modding marshalls and then just started an exclusive limited line of bland amps that were more hype than heavyweight?

And of the lesser known boutique, were they also more hype than heavy hitter?

 

[braintheory]

I think for a while many of these boutique amps were really intriguing and hyped up (often marketed as being better than those “outdated” vintage amps) and eventually many of us realized we just still preferred (often much preferred) most of the tried and true classics like good vintage Marshall’s (modded or boosted), early Revision Recto’s, IIC+‘s, Wizard’s, SLO’s, early Bogner and Diezel’s, etc

I’ve tried pretty much all the boutique amps I could and what you listed except Armored (don’t think I need to lol). There are still a few more I wanna try just to not leave stones unturned, but really the only high gain amps I’ve kept that are less known are an MLC Silenoz and MI Audio Megaltih Beta. Besides that it’s older Boogies, Marshall’s, early Bogner, SLO, Diezel, Wizard, Hermansson’s, all stuff that the market seems to agree is good stuff that sells easy and fast

Some boutique amps I’ve had: Baron, 2 DAR’s, 3 Different Peters (tried almost the whole line-up), 4 Engl’s (tried almost the whole line-up), 2 Mako’s, Massotti, Mezzabarba, Henning Cherry Bomb, Verellen, KSR, Gower, Metropoulous, Savage, Big Tone, 3 Divided By 13’s, Savage, Todd Sharp, Homestead, Top Hat’s, the list of what I tried but didn’t own would be a lot longer lol. Some of these amps had some good things about them, but I didn’t like any of them as much when compared to some of my tried and true classics listed above

 

[braintheory]

Also I have tried a Fortin Natas and Meshuggah, but not his modded Marshall’s. If they weren’t so hyped back then I probably would’ve said they sounded decent or ok, but they left me disappointed from the hype and at the time the Cameron modded Marshall’s and stock vintage Marshall’s I heard in the room really made me find the Meshuggah pale in comparison

 

[no.mids.brando]

Also I have tried a Fortin Natas and Meshuggah, but not his modded Marshall’s. If they weren’t so hyped back then I probably would’ve said they sounded decent or ok, but they left me disappointed from the hype and at the time the Cameron modded Marshall’s and stock vintage Marshall’s I heard in the room really made me find the Meshuggah pale in comparison

I’m not sure if my dream amp exists but i’m looking for a healthy balance of Marshall Keraang and extended Dual rec lows with a little bit of modern multi gain stage compression type grease but not too much. Would the Mlc Silenoz do that? What would you recommend?

 

[Techdeth]

I’m not sure if my dream amp exists but i’m looking for a healthy balance of Marshall Keraang and extended Dual rec lows with a little bit of modern multi gain stage compression type grease but not too much. Would the Mlc Silenoz do that? What would you recommend?

I think it’s great amp . Mines up for sale but honestly looking to trade to play new shit

 

[glpg80]

I owned a Henning Cherry Bomb for a while. It felt like a 3 stage design with diode clipping and just didn’t have enough gain on tap without the diodes to not need to dial it up way high. I hate diode clipping FWIW. Most people that loved them had to boost them and have an EQ in the loop. It just wasn’t the amp for me. My coliseum III++ is three times the amp the Cherry bomb was.

 

[Smashedguitaris⸸]

There are still a few more I wanna try just to not leave stones unturned, but really the only high gain amps I’ve kept that are less known are an MLC Silenoz

Is that the Vogg one?
I think that guy has awesome tone. I would try anything he plays with.

 

[braintheory]

Is that the Vogg one?
I think that guy has awesome tone. I would try anything he plays with.

No, it’s the Dimmu Borgir one. It has a more specific black metal or maybe Scandinavian type sound that probably don’t for everyone, but I really like it. Imo like a jcm800 tweaked to be more modern and black metal-esque. Very clear and cool uppermid grind that I bet would cut through really well

 

[braintheory]

I’m not sure if my dream amp exists but i’m looking for a healthy balance of Marshall Keraang and extended Dual rec lows with a little bit of modern multi gain stage compression type grease but not too much. Would the Mlc Silenoz do that? What would you recommend?

No the Silenoz isn’t really that imo. It’s more like a jcm800 tweaked to be more modern and black metal-esque. Doesn’t have a huge low end or low mids like Recto’s, but not necessarily lacking either imo

Some amps closer to your criteria imo would be Cameron modded Marshall’s, early Revision Uberschall’s or a Rev C or D with a brighter, uppermiddy boost. Not cheap solutions, but I think they can fit better what you’re asking

 

[Racerxrated]

Back before I joined here, around 2009 or so Fortin was big around here, and Dan Gower for the guys in the Eu. They were kind of 'partners' in these Jose style mods. Cool amps, sounded good and real works of art with the wiring. My Ceriatone Cali modded 2204 clone was very nice. The Camerons were a step up, though, for me anyway. Then, the Fortin NATAS and Meathead, all those more metal style ground up builds were popular too. Then, he was hired by Randall and his modding stopped for a bit.
He is a nice guy, I dealt with him once and he walked my local tech through a PT replacement when the Ceriatone gave up the ghost. There was a lot going on in that circuit, so my tech needed a little guidance.

But, as it turns out, he had a previous history of collecting great OG Jose Marshalls, Larrys, and Steavens amps and lo and behold, all the special original idea features in THOSE brands were noticed to be a part of the Fortin ground up builds, like the NATAS and Meathead, other stuff on the Jose mods.
So, while he is a nice guy, and great tech he totally ripped off all the aforementioned designers. It's one thing to say "I borrowed some stuff to make this amp" and another to just go about your day not saying anything. IMO.
And, this also goes to every pedal, noise gate, EVERYTHING.
Nothing of his was HIS. He stole it.
I get that most amp designs are 'borrowed' from others, but so much of what was great about his amps were parts of others original ideas.
Not cool.

 

[JackBootedThug]

get a pod bean and call it a day....more death than a graveyard in those little things....

 

[Smashedguitaris⸸]

Back before I joined here, around 2009 or so Fortin was big around here, and Dan Gower for the guys in the Eu. They were kind of 'partners' in these Jose style mods. Cool amps, sounded good and real works of art with the wiring. My Ceriatone Cali modded 2204 clone was very nice. The Camerons were a step up, though, for me anyway. Then, the Fortin NATAS and Meathead, all those more metal style ground up builds were popular too. Then, he was hired by Randall and his modding stopped for a bit.
He is a nice guy, I dealt with him once and he walked my local tech through a PT replacement when the Ceriatone gave up the ghost. There was a lot going on in that circuit, so my tech needed a little guidance.

But, as it turns out, he had a previous history of collecting great OG Jose Marshalls, Larrys, and Steavens amps and lo and behold, all the special original idea features in THOSE brands were noticed to be a part of the Fortin ground up builds, like the NATAS and Meathead, other stuff on the Jose mods.
So, while he is a nice guy, and great tech he totally ripped off all the aforementioned designers. It's one thing to say "I borrowed some stuff to make this amp" and another to just go about your day not saying anything. IMO.
And, this also goes to every pedal, noise gate, EVERYTHING.
Nothing of his was HIS. He stole it.
I get that most amp designs are 'borrowed' from others, but so much of what was great about his amps were parts of others original ideas.
Not cool.

I played a gower, never a fortin. But i couldnt stand the thing. I later realized it wasnt gower. I cannot stand jose mods. They are dark and quiet. I want the master to take the amp to the next level. Jose amps do not get loud like a marshall.

The monomyth i had was similar in the quietness, but it was very mean. It was the first jose i had. I tried to like it, but it wasnt for me in the end. Shea was an awesome guy to work with, and i sold that amp in like 13 minutes, so no harm no foul.

 

[heavision]

I’m not sure if my dream amp exists but i’m looking for a healthy balance of Marshall Keraang and extended Dual rec lows with a little bit of modern multi gain stage compression type grease but not too much. Would the Mlc Silenoz do that? What would you recommend?

Ground Zero might be something to consider. I’ve never played one, but they seem like modded Marshalls with a heavy, tight, low mid emphasis. Lots of tone-shaping features. I think their flagship is the Helion, maybe?

Clips sound great, though on the modern side.

 

[TotallyRadGuitars]

One of my current hobbies is to hunt down and buy "yesterday's news" boutique amps for bargain prices. There are tons of amazing amps made 10-15 years ago that are basically forgotten about these days in regular discussion. They might be hard to find, but they sound just as awesome now as they did back then... one thing about amps, a great tone in 2005 is still a great tone in 2024. It's not like the newest amps are *that* much better than old designs, maybe a slightly different voicing or lower noise floor, or some new cabclone/xlr/digital-something features I don't care about anyway.

I'll name a few that I have gotten for basically 1/3 or 1/4 of their original selling price:

Stephenson Lead 30R - He is still making custom order amps, this model is long gone though. Very unique design, switchable power tubes, power scaling and other unique features like the transformers and ultra-linear power mode. Mine has 4 power tubes (2x EL84 and 2x octal sockets), 6SN7 phase inverter, and a 6SN7 tube driven spring reverb. It's certainly one of the strangest amp designs I've seen. It sounds like a plexi but warmer, gainier, and between the 3-way switchable bright and power tube stuff it can do a lot of interesting sounds. That said it isn't for everyone,

Steavens Poundcake 25th Anniversary- these are apparently getting noticed again so prices are way up, but when I bought it I could barely find a mention of it via google at all, besides the original press material pictures. This one has 4 channels and midi switching, and a bunch of different modes that can be part of the switching (ex. "heat" channel can have a mid shift, bright switch, green/yellow/red mode). The biggest drawback to this amp though is that all 3 gain channels share the same EQ. You can get them to sound pretty different with the mid/bright/modes but it's just a shame they don't have separate EQ's.

3rd Power HLH100 - I know they are still around, but this is the original one with the triangular cabs that was like $6000 or something at release. It's an awesome sounding amp for sure, PTP wired and all that fancy stuff, but it came out during that time when there weren't so many options for handwired amps and people were willing to pay an absurd premium for what is basically a slightly modified 2203.

Hook Captain 34 - I don't think I've ever seen these talked about at all basically, but they were $4000+ back in 2007. I have one, cool amp, great tones. Mine is PCB but apparently the very early ones were PTP as well.

Kasha Rockmod 50 - I occasionally see threads about the preamps, but never the actual head. These were also $3500 when new. Interestingly the PCB inside is even labeled "Rockmod Preamp Copyright 2006" and then it has a power amp added on via a separate board. The really cool thing about this particular amp, and a feature I've never seen on any other amp, is that you can switch the power amp from "A" to "B" sets of tubes. So you can put a set of 2x EL34's in "A" and a set of 2x 6L6's in "B" and switch between them in real time. It's the ultimate amp for actually figuring out what different power tubes do through the same preamp... I think a lot of people describe 6L6 and EL34 sounds but using different preamps and it's not really a good comparison. You can really hear the difference between a certain set or type of tube with this thing. Right now I have 2x EL34 and 2x 6550's in it, amazing how the 6550's just come out and punch you in the chest in comparison.

PWE Event Horizon - I mentioned this in that other thread, but I have an original EH and an EH3. The original EH is fantastic sounding, it gets nice and gainy, but keeps it together really well. Can easily do hair metal and the like unboosted, but it really excels as the smooth, slinky feeling mid-gain stuff. It's really a wonderful amp to play because it just feels really great. The EH3 keeps the same feeling but has a lot less gain, and the low end is so mushy that if you have the gain up over about 3/4, you may as well not bother hitting a palm mute because it flubs out so hard that it actually blocks some of the treble from coming through for a moment. Maybe there is something wrong with mine, I did get it used after all, but it's the weirdest behavior. That said, if you can be disciplined with the gain, it's wonderful in that darker mid-gain territory. It just doesn't do the high gain that the original EH does so well, and it also has two less preamp tubes so I'm not sure exactly how it is designed but I suspect that it is intentionally a lower-gain design than the original EH.


I've been looking for a Henning Cherry Bomb forever, can't seem to find one though. There was a Bottle Rocket at guitar center for a while but I just couldn't justify the price.

 

[Smashedguitaris⸸]

One of my current hobbies is to hunt down and buy "yesterday's news" boutique amps for bargain prices. There are tons of amazing amps made 10-15 years ago that are basically forgotten about these days in regular discussion. They might be hard to find, but they sound just as awesome now as they did back then... one thing about amps, a great tone in 2005 is still a great tone in 2024. It's not like the newest amps are *that* much better than old designs, maybe a slightly different voicing or lower noise floor, or some new cabclone/xlr/digital-something features I don't care about anyway.

I'll name a few that I have gotten for basically 1/3 or 1/4 of their original selling price:

Stephenson Lead 30R - He is still making custom order amps, this model is long gone though. Very unique design, switchable power tubes, power scaling and other unique features like the transformers and ultra-linear power mode. Mine has 4 power tubes (2x EL84 and 2x octal sockets), 6SN7 phase inverter, and a 6SN7 tube driven spring reverb. It's certainly one of the strangest amp designs I've seen. It sounds like a plexi but warmer, gainier, and between the 3-way switchable bright and power tube stuff it can do a lot of interesting sounds. That said it isn't for everyone,

Steavens Poundcake 25th Anniversary- these are apparently getting noticed again so prices are way up, but when I bought it I could barely find a mention of it via google at all, besides the original press material pictures. This one has 4 channels and midi switching, and a bunch of different modes that can be part of the switching (ex. "heat" channel can have a mid shift, bright switch, green/yellow/red mode). The biggest drawback to this amp though is that all 3 gain channels share the same EQ. You can get them to sound pretty different with the mid/bright/modes but it's just a shame they don't have separate EQ's.

3rd Power HLH100 - I know they are still around, but this is the original one with the triangular cabs that was like $6000 or something at release. It's an awesome sounding amp for sure, PTP wired and all that fancy stuff, but it came out during that time when there weren't so many options for handwired amps and people were willing to pay an absurd premium for what is basically a slightly modified 2203.

Hook Captain 34 - I don't think I've ever seen these talked about at all basically, but they were $4000+ back in 2007. I have one, cool amp, great tones. Mine is PCB but apparently the very early ones were PTP as well.

Kasha Rockmod 50 - I occasionally see threads about the preamps, but never the actual head. These were also $3500 when new. Interestingly the PCB inside is even labeled "Rockmod Preamp Copyright 2006" and then it has a power amp added on via a separate board. The really cool thing about this particular amp, and a feature I've never seen on any other amp, is that you can switch the power amp from "A" to "B" sets of tubes. So you can put a set of 2x EL34's in "A" and a set of 2x 6L6's in "B" and switch between them in real time. It's the ultimate amp for actually figuring out what different power tubes do through the same preamp... I think a lot of people describe 6L6 and EL34 sounds but using different preamps and it's not really a good comparison. You can really hear the difference between a certain set or type of tube with this thing. Right now I have 2x EL34 and 2x 6550's in it, amazing how the 6550's just come out and punch you in the chest in comparison.

PWE Event Horizon - I mentioned this in that other thread, but I have an original EH and an EH3. The original EH is fantastic sounding, it gets nice and gainy, but keeps it together really well. Can easily do hair metal and the like unboosted, but it really excels as the smooth, slinky feeling mid-gain stuff. It's really a wonderful amp to play because it just feels really great. The EH3 keeps the same feeling but has a lot less gain, and the low end is so mushy that if you have the gain up over about 3/4, you may as well not bother hitting a palm mute because it flubs out so hard that it actually blocks some of the treble from coming through for a moment. Maybe there is something wrong with mine, I did get it used after all, but it's the weirdest behavior. That said, if you can be disciplined with the gain, it's wonderful in that darker mid-gain territory. It just doesn't do the high gain that the original EH does so well, and it also has two less preamp tubes so I'm not sure exactly how it is designed but I suspect that it is intentionally a lower-gain design than the original EH.


I've been looking for a Henning Cherry Bomb forever, can't seem to find one though. There was a Bottle Rocket at guitar center for a while but I just couldn't justify the price.

I am a single channel amp kinda guy, so it was hard for me to find the right amp. Most builders want to build a single channel, but everyone wants a clean for some fucking reason. That is what the volume knob is for, but whatever. I have played some good ones. And a few good channel switchers, though i just found the channel that amp was built for and stayed on it like most people do.

 

[Racerxrated]

I played a gower, never a fortin. But i couldnt stand the thing. I later realized it wasnt gower. I cannot stand jose mods. They are dark and quiet. I want the master to take the amp to the next level. Jose amps do not get loud like a marshall.

The monomyth i had was similar in the quietness, but it was very mean. It was the first jose i had. I tried to like it, but it wasnt for me in the end. Shea was an awesome guy to work with, and i sold that amp in like 13 minutes, so no harm no foul.

I think it really depends on WHO does the Jose. I'm into BIG sounding amps, and part of that equation is giant plate voltage. Old Marshall super leads, Wizards etc etc all deliver the goods. I had a rare 3 ch Cameron, Jose/Aldrich/Plexi, and that Jose was an absolute MONSTER. Crushing actually. Yes, when you have a push/pull Jose Master Vol when you engage the Jose master it drops the vol a bit, but this amp made up for it very quickly on the MV.
It was a crushing amp.
I do remember the Fortin Cali mod (the Cali is essentially a Jose) being a little quiet for a 2204.

 

[braintheory]

I am a single channel amp kinda guy, so it was hard for me to find the right amp. Most builders want to build a single channel, but everyone wants a clean for some fucking reason. That is what the volume knob is for, but whatever. I have played some good ones. And a few good channel switchers, though i just found the channel that amp was built for and stayed on it like most people do.

I would also prefer ideally more single channel amps, but all my keeper high gain amps have more channels except for just the Silenoz and Bogner modded JCM800 are one channel. My solution is just don't use the afterthought channel lol

 

[braintheory]

I played a gower, never a fortin. But i couldnt stand the thing. I later realized it wasnt gower. I cannot stand jose mods. They are dark and quiet. I want the master to take the amp to the next level. Jose amps do not get loud like a marshall.

The monomyth i had was similar in the quietness, but it was very mean. It was the first jose i had. I tried to like it, but it wasnt for me in the end. Shea was an awesome guy to work with, and i sold that amp in like 13 minutes, so no harm no foul.

A lot of them can be that way, but it really depends on the mod and I heard real Jose mods themselves varied quite a bit. If you don't engage the diode clipping they tend IME to actually be quite loud and not all Jose mods used diode clipping. A lot of them, like you said, get way quieter and more compressed when you engage the diode clipping, but some Jose type amps I've had only get a little quieter. It can vary a lot IME

The one real Jose modded late '70's Marshall JMP2203 I tried really didn't sound that much different than a stock version of the same model amp I got to AB with. It just had a bit more gain, tightness and a bit smoother sounding. I actually liked a little more the stock amp, but I'm guessing I probably didn't try a great example Jose mod. I don't have any Jose type amps anymore, so maybe they're not ideal for me either, but I might end up with some others later on, never know

 

[braintheory]

I think it really depends on WHO does the Jose. I'm into BIG sounding amps, and part of that equation is giant plate voltage. Old Marshall super leads, Wizards etc etc all deliver the goods. I had a rare 3 ch Cameron, Jose/Aldrich/Plexi, and that Jose was an absolute MONSTER. Crushing actually. Yes, when you have a push/pull Jose Master Vol when you engage the Jose master it drops the vol a bit, but this amp made up for it very quickly on the MV.
It was a crushing amp.
I do remember the Fortin Cali mod (the Cali is essentially a Jose) being a little quiet for a 2204.

Yes, that was really different than other Jose type amps I've tried. It probably was the biggest/most room filling Marshall I tried (stock or modded). I remember it not being that far behind the Hiwatt and Blueface in the bigness department. Some things about the voicing itself weren't imo quite on point and the growl didn't quite complete itself for me on powerchords, but it was still one of the more memorable Cam mods I tried

My friend's Fortin Meshuggah I tried (also 50w) sounded smallish to me and that loud for what it was and maybe also Jose based iirc

 

[Smashedguitaris⸸]

I would also prefer ideally more single channel amps, but all my keeper high gain amps have more channels except for just the Silenoz and Bogner modded JCM800 are one channel. My solution is just don't use the afterthought channel lol

The only amp I played that wasn't a single channel that I would have is the VH-2. It was a solid sounding amp, and I would like to revisit it and try the Bigmax.
Diezels are kind of ugly with all the d's cut out of the faceplate. But they sound good.