5150 III Stealth Loop Question

[Kevin11]

Noticing a volume drop when I engage the loop of my 5153. I've always run a delay and a Boss EQ for a solo boost, but it seems like the Stealth's loop doesn't like the buffered Boss pedals. If I just run my TimeFactor and completely take the Boss out, everything is perfect.

I need a clean solo boost in the loop that I can engage separately from my delay without affecting tone/volume. So if I turn on the Stealth's loop, and the EQ/boost is off, no vol/tone issues. Anyone else run into this? Any ideas? I use blue and red channels for different tones, so I'd rather not have to resort to using the red channel as a dedicated solo channel like some players do. Thanks guys!

 

[DAMIAN The MAN]

I have the 50W version and it's exactly the same deal: every Boss DD3, DD5 or DD6 cause a little volume drop ... I started to get used to it. I assume that using an EQ would help, but I wasn't curious to try yet.

p.s.: probably you did not see, but I asked you in the other Stealth topic what type are your power tubes - GT 6l6 GE (clear top) or GT 6l6 CHP ?

 

[drod1985]

I used to use my 100w with a a Boss DD-20 on the line level setting in the loop with no volume drop as well. Can't remember if the instrument level setting caused the drop though.

I currently use a EBMM 25k Vol pedal, TC Electronic HOF, and Line 6 M9 in the loop with no volume drop either.

 

[Kevin11]

Thanks for the replies so far guys! The crux of the matter is I really need a way to insert a solo boost in the loop with no vol drop. Doesn't look like the Boss EQ is going to do the trick with this particular amp. So far, all of my line-level fx work perfectly. I might have to find a decent multi fx setup just for the loop and program in a solo boost with that. I have an old Lexicon MPX G2 that would be perfect if the input buffer on it wasn't such a huge tone suck.

And Damian, sorry for not getting back to you earlier. Stock tubes are silver-topped, not clear.

 

[DAMIAN The MAN]

And Damian, sorry for not getting back to you earlier. Stock tubes are silver-topped, not clear.

So I assume they are GT 6l6 CHP ( cause I don't know other Chinese 6l6 labeled Groove tubes) ...
Maybe the "CHP" is not labeled but under the GT logo it's printed "Premium"

From what I've heard the MXR EQ (6 or 10 band) works wonderful with all EVH 5150 III in the loop. But I don't have one to confirm.

 

[Kevin11]

Just checked the power tubes. GT-6L6-SV screen printed along side the GT logo. So "S" series, not CHP.

And thanks for the MXR tip, I'll definitely check that out. I don't think 6-band has volume sliders, so I'll probably have to look at the 10-band. Way overkill for what I'd use it for, but if it works, it's worth it.

I might revisit the Lexicon MPX G2. That thing on paper is the PERFECT multi-fx unit for running stuff in front and in the loop. Unfortunately, the "front" signal path neuters the lows and highs and imparts a nasally mid frequency. I used to use it all the time when I didn't care about my core tone as much. Love the fx, noisy as some of them are, and am actually comfortable programming the stupid thing.

 

[DAMIAN The MAN]

Thanks for the info Kevin, I really appreciate your help !!
When you have a little time please make a video of your new toy, its always a pleasure to watch them work

 

[steelehead]

Fx loops are interesting thing here is a note of what normally happens.

In general terms, the internal voltage levels in effects are 1V to 2V; in tube amps, they’re 100V to 200V. In order not to “smoke” the input stage of the Echoplex, the signal from the preamp stage of the tube amp needs to be attenuated by about a factor of 10 (20 dB). But now when the signal goes back in to the power amp, we have lost 20 dB of gain and can’t drive the amp to full volume.


Sometimes it is how the fx loop is put in after the preamp. If you look at some Amps they have a volume on the back and that's helping mix the preamp back into the amp to keep your gain staging.

If you are noticing a drop while playing because you are bypassing in Chanel staging, clean to distortion.

When you have your fx on or off. The same thing happens.....you can try a bypass type pedal in the loop


http://globalguitarnetwork.com/effect-loops/
https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/E ... Loops_101_


Oh by the way I'm just a guitarist.

 

[DAMIAN The MAN]

Well, I assume you were lucky enough to get one of the first limited run. The 6L6-SV indicates your tubes are the famous Svetlana Winged C! The purists say they are the best 6l6 possible, very close to Sylvanias from the late 80s
I hope to find out what Shuguangs are in the latest models ...

 

[Kevin11]

Fx loops are interesting thing here is a note of what normally happens.

In general terms, the internal voltage levels in effects are 1V to 2V; in tube amps, they’re 100V to 200V. In order not to “smoke” the input stage of the Echoplex, the signal from the preamp stage of the tube amp needs to be attenuated by about a factor of 10 (20 dB). But now when the signal goes back in to the power amp, we have lost 20 dB of gain and can’t drive the amp to full volume.


Sometimes it is how the fx loop is put in after the preamp. If you look at some Amps they have a volume on the back and that's helping mix the preamp back into the amp to keep your gain staging.

If you are noticing a drop while playing because you are bypassing in Chanel staging, clean to distortion.

When you have your fx on or off. The same thing happens.....you can try a bypass type pedal in the loop


http://globalguitarnetwork.com/effect-loops/
https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/E ... Loops_101_


Oh by the way I'm just a guitarist.

Thanks for the info man! I'm pretty good with all the ins-and-outs of loops. The voltage info you provided and the PG article had some good stuff. The EVH is the first amp I've had in 15 years or so that doesn't have a level/mix control on the loop, so I'm kinda at the mercy of it unfortunately. I just need to rethink how I'm going to work in a clean solo boost since my old way with the Boss EQ won't work anymore. Not a huge deal considering how good the amp sounds.

 

[Kevin11]

Well, I assume you were lucky enough to get one of the first limited run. The 6L6-SV indicates your tubes are the famous Svetlana Winged C! The purists say they are the best 6l6 possible, very close to Sylvanias from the late 80s
I hope to find out what Shuguangs are in the latest models ...

I've been an EL34 guy most of my gigging life. The =C= EL34s always sounded best in my XTC. Had to stop using them when they couldn't handle the high plate voltages any longer (at least that's what I was told). Nothing else I tried ever sounded quite right. Tons of players raved about JJs and I can't stand them personally. Been using the Shuguang 34s and they're OK, but not quite there you know? That whole mess actually started my search for a new rig a few years back. Landed on the EVH and I guess I'm back with Svets. Thanks for sharing all the info!