Angry rant about preamps

  • Thread starter Thread starter 2ndhandband
  • Start date Start date
2

2ndhandband

New member
I recently switched to a rack rig and have been in the market for a midi programmable preamp. I've tried out a bunch of them (I know a lot of guys who have some pretty cool toys) and have come to the following conclusions:

1) Very few high-end preamps are fully programmable. The Engl E570, for instance, has the ability to store a handful of presets... but only a handlful.

2) When a manufacturer does try to sell a tubed preamp that is fully programmable, they usually get their ass handed to them. The Engl E580, H&K Access, and Soldano x99 Caswell are all off the market, and they are all rare enough to make the used prices prohibitive. My favorite it the Soldano x99 (I know someone that owns one), but the least I've seen one sell for is $3300. Even more budget-oriented models like the Rocktron Piranha (which was acually a damn good preamp) usually fail in the marketplace.

3) For some reason the only way a manufacturer can generally sell a tubed midi preamp is to include a full suite of FX... which usually means making compromises to bring it in at a price point. The Rocktron Prophecy and most Digitech pres suffer from this problem; in many of these products the tube is not much more than a light bulb and doesn't really affect the tone much.

4) Things are regressing. Many of the best-sounding preamps on the market today aren't even midi switchable. Take the Mako MAK4, for instance. It sounds amazing, but I would never buy one. It takes up an insane amount of rack space, and a guitar preamp without midi in 2012 is just plain stupid.

5) The damn dumb retro craze that started in the early '90s and killed rack gear as a major force in the music marketplace still hasn't gone away, and shows no sign of doing so. This is also why I can't walk into a even a big music store and look at a high-end guitar with 24 frets and a floyd.

6) For reasons I do NOT understand, the only people interested in the power and flexibility of a rack setup are the people who are into modeling gear. Which I'm not the slightest bit interested in.

7) What all this means is that the guitarist who wants a full-on midi programmable tubed preamp is pretty much fucked... or at least limited to a small handful of options. The Marshall JMP-1 is now off the market (and never sounded that good to my ears, anyway), and the Mesa Triaxis is, like all Mesa gear, stupidly overpriced. There really isn't anything else out there anymore.

I wound up going with a vintage piece; an ADA MP-1. I actually got two of them; one to mod and one to keep stock.
 
mesa triaxis? all tube with midi. not made anymore but can be found on ebay and i'm sure you can find one here in the classifieds.
 
Peter Diezel was talking about a rack preamp awhile back... not sure when/if that's happening or if maybe he didn't get enough interest.
 
The Access usually goes for a great price considering how solid that preamp is. It's usually around 600 or so bucks. BTW, this might be a solution to your problem:

http://www.rhodesamplification.com/prod ... rs/artemis

It's a rack head, but it should have all the features you want. Then again, if you think the Access is cost prohibitive, this probably isn't something on your radar.
 
The market was a already flooded with MIDI control type boxes to operate latching switches when mako released their preamp.

for example:
http://www.rjmmusic.com/miniampgizmo.php

Since Andrew is avid on the forums he knew most of us already had such devices and actually saved us the cost of implementing MIDI controls into the unit. for users like you this is a simple add on device.If the mako had built in MIDI i bet it would cost at least $300 more and ONLY be able to switch the functions on the Mako, no extra outpiuts for the other rack gear that may not have MIDI.

Also the Mako is no longer huge, its now two rackspaces.

I do however agree that the huge rack days seems over. Forget preamps, try looking for tube power amps there are about ten that exist and none are all that new.
 
moltenmetalburn":1f9iyjg7 said:
Also the Mako is no longer huge, its now two rackspaces.

Really? I'd love to see a pic of how it's all laid out. Going from 4u to 2u must have been quite a challenge considering how many pots that thing had in it.
 
:rock: BAM!

It wasnt the pot number but the size of the military pots andrew was adamant on using, seems he conceded and now its two spaces.
 
emot-fappery.gif
 
Code001":2r9dcyfs said:
The Access usually goes for a great price considering how solid that preamp is. It's usually around 600 or so bucks. BTW, this might be a solution to your problem:

http://www.rhodesamplification.com/prod ... rs/artemis

It's a rack head, but it should have all the features you want. Then again, if you think the Access is cost prohibitive, this probably isn't something on your radar.


I've never seen an access that cheap, myself... will look again.
 
moltenmetalburn":2hch1pwl said:
:rock: BAM!

It wasnt the pot number but the size of the military pots andrew was adamant on using, seems he conceded and now its two spaces.

ooo sexy :inlove:
 
Let me preface this by saying that I'm an avid rack guy(see my sig pic). I love the versatility of racks and they make more sense for me in my situation. I'm with you in that there are not enough rack guitar preamps available on the market these days and modelers just don't cut it for me either. As far as full midi rack guitar preamps go, I feel they are a compromise between flexability and tone. For example, I previously owned a Soldano X99 and really like it's versatility. I had the opportunity to try out the X88r next to it and felt the X88r sounded better, more organic and amp-like for lack of a better term. The tone difference was significant enough that it outweighed the versatility of the X99. I now own an X88r. Same thing with the Engl E570 and E580. I've owned my E570 for awhile now and a few years ago, had the opportunity to purchase the E580. When I compared the two(running through my Engl 850/100 poweramp as well) the E570 just sounded better and I ending up selling the E580. Point being, it seems that when manufacturers add in all the bells and whistles such as full midi, the tone is compromised to some extent. It's up to the individual to determine what is more important to them. To me, until manufactures can produce something that doesn't compromise the tone while adding all the functionality that we want, I would rather just pay an extra couple of hundred dollars for an Amp Gizmo or something to give me the functionality I need while preserving the tone of the preamp.
 
2ndhandband":1zic9z2k said:
6) For reasons I do NOT understand, the only people interested in the power and flexibility of a rack setup are the people who are into modeling gear. Which I'm not the slightest bit interested in.

I'm sure a forum post is not going to change anyone's mind, but FWIW, the modern modelers make INSANELY good preamps with the cab modeling turned off and the many of them have good to world class FX. Preamp modeling has been pretty much nailed by the modeling at this point. Cabs and power amp modeling continues to get asymptotically closer but preamps are there (IMHO). Yes, it is a PITA to get it setup and programmed correctly, but once it is set, you are golden. I finally gave up my beloved MP1 for one.

So, with modeling, you can basically get a 2U unit that is virtually unmatched by all but a select few rare and hyper expensive tube devices and may be able to replace almost every other device in your rack except the power amp depending on your needs.

I don't think there will ever be a major market again for programmable tube preamps, so if you insist on tubes, you are probably stuck with what is available now for the most part.

IMHO
 
I just grabbed a VHT GP3 & 2/50/2 recently, to utilize w/ my g major. Whereas I don't have a ton of different channels (only 3), the preamp has all of the additional (on/off) voicing functions in a specific mapped place. And, you can write patches with any different combination of the function switches. Pretty useful (for me). I just have yet to tackle actually getting everything programmed w/my all access foot switch... Almost too many options. This particular pre isn't made anymore, but one or two pop up every so often. I paid like 2k for the pre/pwr. Fryette will service the units if need be, too.
 
srommes":18rqvkue said:
Point being, it seems that when manufacturers add in all the bells and whistles such as full midi, the tone is compromised to some extent.

I'am telling this for years in german forums, and everyone
is laughing: "You notice any difference?" :lol: :LOL:

My theory is that programmable preamps use a lot of optocouplers
in the signal path, triaxis, jmp1 and even the X99.

It's pretty obvious that those optocouplers do affect the sound,
even when the manufacturers say they don't...
 
I agree with everything the first post says, I have a GP3 preamp which I think is awesome, but I would like to add another preamp but what is there out there, with or without midi, like the other post says Diezel might make one in the future and Rhodes on a recent post on HRI said he hasn't ruled out making a preamp in the future, and his midi options on his amps seem really impressive.

Non midi preamps Mako and Peters make preamps, I think it's great that the MAK4 is now 2 units, I may think about getting one, can't find any clips of peters preamp, there's possibly Titan preamp and Larry but I think the latter is insanely expensive.
 
moltenmetalburn":23c8m1x0 said:
:rock: BAM!

It wasnt the pot number but the size of the military pots andrew was adamant on using, seems he conceded and now its two spaces.
I just went to makoamplification and all I could find was the 4 space preamp, is this a prototype of things to come?
 
hellaboogie":1eh7ra1h said:
moltenmetalburn":1eh7ra1h said:
:rock: BAM!

It wasnt the pot number but the size of the military pots andrew was adamant on using, seems he conceded and now its two spaces.
I just went to makoamplification and all I could find was the 4 space preamp, is this a prototype of things to come?

He's having some issues with the manufacturer for the chassis. He had the option available to put a deposit down on the Mak4x but took it down until he is able to sort things out with the manufacturer.
 
srommes":2ieh83o3 said:
hellaboogie":2ieh83o3 said:
moltenmetalburn":2ieh83o3 said:
:rock: BAM!

It wasnt the pot number but the size of the military pots andrew was adamant on using, seems he conceded and now its two spaces.
I just went to makoamplification and all I could find was the 4 space preamp, is this a prototype of things to come?

He's having some issues with the manufacturer for the chassis. He had the option available to put a deposit down on the Mak4x but took it down until he is able to sort things out with the manufacturer.

Ok Thanks, might have to get one in the future.
 
Code001":2tjnfyzp said:
http://www.sevenstring.org/forum/gear-sale-trade-wanted/184905-h-k-access-preamp-vs-250-power-amp.html

Classifieds here get purged, but I've seen a few units go for around that price here throughout the years.

That one was mine... but yeah you just need to have patience and they do turn up from time to time.
 
Back
Top