Another cap discussion - Vitamin T

[Music&Chaos]

Hello,

As some may know, I have been doing guitar electronic work/repair/upgrades quite a bit of late on my own instruments and others.

I have found a recurring theme for me: I severely dislike the Mallory mustard caps that come in many Epiphones and also some others for sure.

I have tried several values and they all do the same thing to the EQ curve to my ear: The bass is wooly, the midrange is slightly suppressed and clouded and the top end is bright with a slight brittleness that makes my eyes whine if strummed hard.

I have noticed this in at least 4-5 guitars with these caps.

I swapped them out with some Mojo Tone Vitamin T caps that are .015 (my favorite value).

Wow did it really open up both of these guitars.

The unit with Burstbuckers sounds extra good.

How would I describe it?

The bass is still there, and full, but not as wooly or woofy.

The midrange is there, as I would hope, clear and a little juicy.

Top end is clear and full but does not have that brittleness as before, warmer.

Caps DO affect your tone, even if your knob is up to 10.

If you don't believe me, test it for yourself - no, I can't guarantee your ears will hear it but mine sure can.

This swap of the Mallorys has bumped these up several notches.

Also, with the .015 values, I can drop the tone all the way down and have a sweet singing sound almost like a wah is engaged.

I really dig that value, and honestly, really, really like the Vitamin T/Paper in oils.

I have Sprague and all of that and these are by far my favorite.

I severely dislike when a cap mutes or accentuates parts of the frequency range.

Orange drops scoop mids while boosting low and high end - more hifi. (Scoops mids for you)

Mallory seem to add a thick warmth in the low and low mid while adding high end to the upper mid and top. (Unbalances a lot of LP models IMO)

The Little ceramic ones accent high mids across the entire range if the strings, which can tighten things up, especially if you have an old LP with 300k pots. I would swap those to 500k but I digress.


I have been really happy with these caps and these specific values as well in my testing.

I even install foil side lead to ground so they are crazy quiet/no microphonics.

You could look for them, but honestly, I may have the last stash of these Vitamin T caps at this value to exist or ever be produced.

 

[BlueParfait]

I've had these, orange drops, the mojotone oil-filled ones...

I couldn't tell a difference. I really couldn't

 

[Music&Chaos]

I've had these, orange drops, the mojotone oil-filled ones...

I couldn't tell a difference. I really couldn't

See if you can hear any here. You can use alligator clips and do the testing yourself back to back pretty easily. Will show better through certain setups.

 

[vultures]

If it's my own guitar, I just use low % box film capacitors in modern wiring. If it's for a client, I use big cool looking capacitors, vintage looking parts. Different caps in the same value never seem to make a difference for me. Changing around the values and changing around from 50s to 60s/Modern wiring makes the biggest difference. Add a treble 150k/.001uf Treble Bleed in there and you'll never go back.

 

[ihave27frets]

Looks around - Sees no Caparison

 

[thegame]

OP, do you think using a 250k volume pot with NO tone control in the circuit at all is a good substitute for shaving off a little high end compared to a 500k volume in a circuit WITH a tone pot/cap? Even with the tone on 10, that will slightly attenuate highs compared to it not being there at all, unless you’re using a special no load tone pot. I’d rather keep it simple with the first scenario.

 

[Music&Chaos]

OP, do you think using a 250k volume pot with NO tone control in the circuit at all is a good substitute for shaving off a little high end compared to a 500k volume in a circuit WITH a tone pot/cap. Even with the tone on 10, that will slightly attenuate highs compared to it not being there at all, unless you’re using a special no load tone pot. I’d rather keep it simple with the first scenario.

No, only because pot values do not do tonally what I would imagine they do in reality to the sound.

A 250k pot makes the high end thinner and scratchier with Humbuckers, and when you slam them with higher value pots, the pickups actually sound fuller and fatter in every part of the spectrum, so IMO, it doesn't really reduce the high end as much as it changes the way it is presented.

I get that the values DO reduce the amount of top end coming through, but that is not all that changes. My strat with 275k pots has more high end, but it also has more mids and low end to warm/round it out to the ear as opposed to some lower value 220k pots that were in there before.

Yes, it shaves high end, but will sound different than a 500k that has the top end slightly sculpted.

I find that the different cap vaues introduced and types can shift where your peak resonance tends to sit to my ear as opposed to reduce all signal top end like swapping pots can do.

 

[Music&Chaos]

If it's my own guitar, I just use low % box film capacitors in modern wiring. If it's for a client, I use big cool looking capacitors, vintage looking parts. Different caps in the same value never seem to make a difference for me. Changing around the values and changing around from 50s to 60s/Modern wiring makes the biggest difference. Add a treble 150k/.001uf Treble Bleed in there and you'll never go back.

I agree that 50 -60s wiring can make a big tonal shift in how the pots interact overall with the guitar. Some people may not like it, some will. Very different.

In the included examples, both units had 50s wiring before and after. Really helps the guitar stay punchy.

I am not a big fan of treble bleeds or Greasebucket wiring mods, in that I can always hear the base tone affected by the extra caps and resistors in the circuit.

For the most part, I cut the caps out and go straight vol, vol, but still have several guitars with tone caps that I cherish all the more with 50s or 60s wiring and nice caps.

 

[vultures]

Looks around - Sees no Caparison View attachment 404684View attachment 404684

I like Caparison.

 

[thegame]

No, only because pot values do not do tonally what I would imagine they do in reality to the sound.

A 250k pot makes the high end thinner and scratchier with Humbuckers, and when you slam them with higher value pots, the pickups actually sound fuller and fatter in every part of the spectrum, so IMO, it doesn't really reduce the high end as much as it changes the way it is presented.

I get that the values DO reduce the amount of top end coming through, but that is not all that changes. My strat with 275k pots has more high end, but it also has more mids and low end to warm/round it out to the ear as opposed to some lower value 220k pots that were in there before.

Yes, it shaves high end, but will sound different than a 500k that has the top end slightly sculpted.

I find that the different cap vaues introduced and types can shift where your peak resonance tends to sit to my ear as opposed to reduce all signal top end like swapping pots can do.

Interesting. However, I’ve found that higher value volume pots give a thinner/scratchier sound, at least with humbuckers. My humbucker and single volume pot experimentation results ranging from thinner to fatter sounding are in order;

- pickup wired straight to output jack
- pickup to 1 Meg pot
- pickup to 550 k pot
- pickup to 500 k pot
- pickup to upper 400k pot
- pickup to 250 k pot

I very much disliked the first two. Technically I believe it’s more accurate and (I hate this term now, unfiltered) but passive pickups need to be loaded down a certain amount to achieve maximum musicality.

 

[Music&Chaos]

Interesting. However, I’ve found that higher value volume pots give a thinner/scratchier sound, at least with humbuckers. My humbucker and single volume pot experimentation results ranging from thinner to fatter sounding are in order;

- pickup wired straight to output jack
- pickup to 1 Meg pot
- pickup to 550 k pot
- pickup to 500 k pot
- pickup to upper 400k pot
- pickup to 250 k pot

I very much disliked the first two. Technically I believe it’s more accurate and (I hate this term now, unfiltered) but passive pickups need to be loaded down a certain amount to achieve maximum musicality.

I noticed that the top end range seems to broaden out in my recent experience. When I took the 498T and wire it straight/direct with 500k pots opposed to the 300k pots with ceramic cap and everything about the pickup was fuller and juicer.

I need to do further testing it seems, as I really dislike scratchy top end and seek to eliminate it every chance I get.

Thanks for the info! I agree 1 meg and straight to Jack can be intense but I really enjoy certain pickups wired with just a volume pot and nothing else in the circuit.

 

[BlueParfait]

See if you can hear any here. You can use alligator clips and do the testing yourself back to back pretty easily. Will show better through certain setups.

Oh you meant like that

In that case I do hear some small differences, but I never really cared too much outside of LPs because I keep my tone knob at 10 all the time otherwise lol

 

[Music&Chaos]

Oh you meant like that

In that case I do hear some small differences, but I never really cared too much outside of LPs because I keep my tone knob at 10 all the time otherwise lol

I leave tone at 10 99% of the time and still prefer specific caps or removing them entirely.

With the proper value and cap type, I find myself actually using it as opposed to never touching it.