Bartlett, Yarons, etc...

[H Golf Sport]

The guys building the replica's have blue-printed actual 59's down to the most minute detail - including wood density, electronics, routing, chambering, etc. Being carved and built by hand and not a CNC machine is time consuming and the man-hours add up. You are paying for research, time, demand and as you suggest - maybe some hype.

So have these guys found differences ( shape, body thickness, build variation, etc...) compared to what Gibson c/s is putting out? I would think Gibson would have in there possession or at least access to real bursts. Not to mention original drawings, templates etc... that the originals were built from. Not that it means they would follow them to the exact detail. And I'm sure there are regular production variation due to tolerances etc...

 

[Shark Diver]

The guys building the replica's have blue-printed actual 59's down to the most minute detail - including wood density, electronics, routing, chambering, etc. Being carved and built by hand and not a CNC machine is time consuming and the man-hours add up. You are paying for research, time, demand and as you suggest - maybe some hype.

So have these guys found differences ( shape, body thickness, build variation, etc...) compared to what Gibson c/s is putting out? I would think Gibson would have in there possession or at least access to real bursts. Not to mention original drawings, templates etc... that the originals were built from. Not that it means they would follow them to the exact detail. And I'm sure there are regular production variation due to tolerances etc...

The thing that is strange to me, unless Gibson used wood that was extremely uniform, is that things like wood density wouldn't have varied from '59 to '59. So, which '59 are you copying? I've played a '59, great guitar, but I think there are a few special '59s out there (sometimes it all just comes together), but I believe a lot of it is just collector driven hype based off of one or two guitars. I would bet there are just as magical "57s, ''58s, '60s, even 2013s.

 

[rupe]

The guys building the replica's have blue-printed actual 59's down to the most minute detail - including wood density, electronics, routing, chambering, etc. Being carved and built by hand and not a CNC machine is time consuming and the man-hours add up. You are paying for research, time, demand and as you suggest - maybe some hype.

So have these guys found differences ( shape, body thickness, build variation, etc...) compared to what Gibson c/s is putting out? I would think Gibson would have in there possession or at least access to real bursts. Not to mention original drawings, templates etc... that the originals were built from. Not that it means they would follow them to the exact detail. And I'm sure there are regular production variation due to tolerances etc...

The thing that is strange to me, unless Gibson used wood that was extremely uniform, is that things like wood density wouldn't have varied from '59 to '59. So, which '59 are you copying? I've played a '59, great guitar, but I think there are a few special '59s out there (sometimes it all just comes together), but I believe a lot of it is just collector driven hype based off of one or two guitars. I would bet there are just as magical "57s, ''58s, '60s, even 2013s.

You're correct on all points. The wood did vary, there are real 59's that are dogs (as well as guitars from other eras that are stars), and a lot of the hype is collector/fanboy driven.

When builders start blueprinting these things to reproduce, they use examples known to be "good ones"...nobody is cloning the pigs.

 

[chunktone]

Simmer down there pusher of Hecho in Mexico amps and production line charvels.

Speaking of Hecho en Mexico amps, I found a guy in Istanbul that makes exact recreations of the 5150III 50 watter using the exact same build materials and techniques that the factory did way back in 2012!!!! They are only $4k. I got in line today. Only 3 years wait!!!!! What are you waiting for?

 

[yankeebulldog]

I think the maple neck on those Norlins is part of the secret sauce. I love that combination of maple neck with a hog body.

 

[steve_k]

The guys building the replica's have blue-printed actual 59's down to the most minute detail - including wood density, electronics, routing, chambering, etc. Being carved and built by hand and not a CNC machine is time consuming and the man-hours add up. You are paying for research, time, demand and as you suggest - maybe some hype.

So have these guys found differences ( shape, body thickness, build variation, etc...) compared to what Gibson c/s is putting out? I would think Gibson would have in there possession or at least access to real bursts. Not to mention original drawings, templates etc... that the originals were built from. Not that it means they would follow them to the exact detail. And I'm sure there are regular production variation due to tolerances etc...

The thing that is strange to me, unless Gibson used wood that was extremely uniform, is that things like wood density wouldn't have varied from '59 to '59. So, which '59 are you copying? I've played a '59, great guitar, but I think there are a few special '59s out there (sometimes it all just comes together), but I believe a lot of it is just collector driven hype based off of one or two guitars. I would bet there are just as magical "57s, ''58s, '60s, even 2013s.

You're correct on all points. The wood did vary, there are real 59's that are dogs (as well as guitars from other eras that are stars), and a lot of the hype is collector/fanboy driven.

When builders start blueprinting these things to reproduce, they use examples known to be "good ones"...nobody is cloning the pigs.

And, people who want a guitar that is an icon and unique, not a cookie cutter version that their buddy owns or 1.2 million others might own. It's about individuality and some people here just cannot get their hands wrapped around that one. 59's form Bartlett, Yaron and McKay will hold their value as replica's as will Ken Lawrence instruments and a handful of others.

 

[petethorn]

The right wood, old wood if you want it (Huge deal). Pick your own top... Discuss with the luthier the tone you want, and have them select the wood based on that. Once again, huge deal.

The right glues

The right electronics and pickups (huge deal)

The right finish- thin lacquer that will check and wear just like the old ones

Vintage correct truss rod

And lots more.

That's why, just off the top of my head.

Why get custom anything? It's all the same. Motorcycles, clothes, cars, amps, homes, jewelry, golf clubs..... It's because it gives us a certain satisfaction, knowing something is made for you by a master, exactly as you want it to be. Simple as that.

 

[Ventura]

Consistency costs coin. Simple.

One thing overlooked here is that Gibson is a massive company with massive productions. In the day, who would have known their failed singlecut guitar would end up being the Holy Grail for tone so many decades later. But back then, it wasn't a large production - quality was in the details, hand tools, good woods, attention to everything, each piece a work of art and a work of passion. Nowadays, Gibson makes most of its stuff in an automated environment, and for sure, the hand selection process of woods and finishing is dumbed down greatly.

Enter Bartlett and Yaron and several others. They make em exactly like they were made in the 50s. Exactly. And every detail is meticulously crafted and finished. This is a one man job, and that one man logs a LOT of hours making this happen. I get it. I'd rather have 1 guitar that cost $10,000 that's perfect in every sense; over 3 x $3000 guitars that were all "okay" but not banger.

 

[glip22]

I really don't get this thread. Is it because its an expensive guitar? I don't see much difference as if one went on the Corvette forum and complained about people buying $250,000 Lamborghinis. Are they nuts. Its about what one can afford or is willing to spend and what one wants. My last guitar was 3750. Should the guy buying a Squire complain about my buying this and call me nuts.

 

[rlord1974]

My last guitar was $3,750. Should the guy buying a Squire complain about my buying this and call me nuts.

No, they should not. But, they will.

 

[rlord1974]

It's about individuality and some people here just cannot get their hands wrapped around that one.

That right there is the TRUTH of the day. Too many people around here get sand in their swimshorts over people choosing to pay for nice, custom items.

 

[Schaf]

The guys building the replica's have blue-printed actual 59's down to the most minute detail - including wood density, electronics, routing, chambering, etc. Being carved and built by hand and not a CNC machine is time consuming and the man-hours add up. You are paying for research, time, demand and as you suggest - maybe some hype.

So have these guys found differences ( shape, body thickness, build variation, etc...) compared to what Gibson c/s is putting out? I would think Gibson would have in there possession or at least access to real bursts. Not to mention original drawings, templates etc... that the originals were built from. Not that it means they would follow them to the exact detail. And I'm sure there are regular production variation due to tolerances etc...

The thing that is strange to me, unless Gibson used wood that was extremely uniform, is that things like wood density wouldn't have varied from '59 to '59. So, which '59 are you copying? I've played a '59, great guitar, but I think there are a few special '59s out there (sometimes it all just comes together), but I believe a lot of it is just collector driven hype based off of one or two guitars. I would bet there are just as magical "57s, ''58s, '60s, even 2013s.

Yeah, I was going to buy a 59, but I played 20 and only found one good one.

 

[Brad737]

Was Tom even building guitars before Randy died 40 some years ago?

Randy Rhoads used a Bartlett.

John Sykes uses a Max.

John Norum uses a Yaron.

Zakk Wylde uses both Bartlett and Yaron.

What do you think? Serious players like that are going to use Norlin era Les Pauls, the ones widely considered the worst Les Pauls Gibson ever made to tour the world, and write and record landmark rock tunes played on classic rock stations around the world? You have got to be kidding me. If you are serious about this hobby, you can't be using inferior stuff like this. And it is well known, you can't make a good Les Paul in the United States, well, you can make a good one. But is a good one good enough for you? Not me! I'm Chubtone! A guy on a forum, screwing around on a forum when I should be working. I'm freaking important man!

A Les Paul is just not that important to me that I would spend that much on the best version of it available. I'm happy to look at the pictures of them though....... while listening to Randy or Sykes tear it up on their Norlin eras.

 

[pstar]

Rhodes did not use it... Incorrect

 

[Chubtone]

Was Tom even building guitars before Randy died 40 some years ago?

Rhodes did not use it... Incorrect

 

[steve_k]

It's about individuality and some people here just cannot get their hands wrapped around that one.

That right there is the TRUTH of the day. Too many people around here get sand in their swimshorts over people choosing to pay for nice, custom items.

A lot of people getting sand in their snatch lately around here.