Becoming disillusioned with tube amps for modern metal.

[searching]

I know this sounds retarded but i'm just so burned out with the tube craze when it pertains to modern metal. It seems like every damn amp is just a copy of another and all of them sound so similar it's ridiculous. Even the high vs low wattage makes no sense for anything other than a bit more headroom or maybe a huge act or someone who plays big venues.

I have a cheap ass Jet City that with no mods sits in and doesn't give up much to all of my friends higher end triple recs etc. Sure, it can't do quite as much without a slight boost, it ain't no Mesa, but, to be honest, with only a slight bit of help it hangs right with most of them sans some thump.

And, no, i'm not a huge fan of sims or Kemper/Axe FX, either.

Another huge reason is that tube rigs just seem to have moments where the gain doesn't translate well to lead work...Almost like no matter what is used to boost etc the gain isn't linear enough or something between chording/lead and leaves some single passages feeling thin etc.

Now for the part that will make me seem even more retarded is that i feel the response from certain SS amps fit me so much better. And im not talking about a MG with an 8" driver but rather more like the ISP Theta or older Ampegs/Randalls through Governers/V30's. Have or had access to stuff like that and i always enjoy and seem to play/sound so much better to my ears. Not only super tight and wicked gain but also leads at times just seem so effortless and full of life with out feeling like i have to choke the life out of my guitar to get a decent sounding solo and/or shit is sounding different than it did a day/week/five minutes ago

Sorry, but i think i'm going with an ISP for my next rig or maybe another SS of some sort in the real near future. I have an old beater SS Marshall, too, but it's seen hell and back and is nowhere near other available offerings. Nothing about any of the Mesa's/(insert any newfangled 50/100 head) stand out enough from each other than some 6L6/El84 or some other corksniffery to even get me excited about dropping numerous thousands and everything just to play smaller venues with only heavily overdriven tones that i feel the SS can easily match in terms of tightness/sound/variety/consistency of in not only rhythm, but live leads.

As we know, sometimes it's what sounds good to our own ears and what inspires that translates to most to performance or creating stuff and....I just think the whole tube thing for most chug a lug and modern stuff is slightly overrated and over "saturated" at the moment but will eventually fade even much further than it currently is already with Axe/fx etc and technology will leave absolutely no reason for any hard edged metal head in alternate tunings to need a tube amp.

 

[Spaceboy]

Those solid state Ampegs and Randall's are great for a thrash/death metal style tone, but aren't so great at some of the more modern variants of metal. There's no reason to buy more than what you're comfortable with. There are countless metal bands using Blackstars and Jet City amps right now, and bands still trucking on those 5150s and Peavey Ultras. You don't need a Mesa, Engl, whatever. There are still some things a solid state amp can't emulate if you're used to tube amps, but that's all subjective really. Dying Fetus is one of my favorite bands ever, and that dude has been using Ampeg VH140Cs almost exclusively for over two decades. I've owned that amp four times myself.

 

[lespaul6]

When I first started playing guitar the local music store only sold peavey amps, I had a Bandit 65 for many years and I never knew there was such a thing as tube amps until much later....I was just practicing and practicing. The feel/immediacy of solid state amps appealed to me big time. Solid state amps do sound great for metal. Play what you like and who cares what other people think!

 

[godgrinder]

From your descriptions it sounds like you might have problem with your picking hand or something.

 

[Steinmetzify]

Pantera Down and Crowbar are among the many bands that agree with you. I hear you talking; I dig on tubes for blues/rock stuff but for just headcrushing metal SS amps kick ass.

Those old Randall 100s and Centuries are great, the X2 is a badass and the Ampeg stuff just slays. Play what you want and fuck anyone that says different.

 

[skoora]

The Marshall VS100 was always a little bad ass mofo for high gain. Sounds great on Cleansing

 

[crankyrayhanky]

Sorry, but...

Apology declined. Tube amps rule.

 

[sytharnia1560]

The Marshall VS100 was always a little bad ass mofo for high gain. Sounds great on Cleansing

this ... Chuck Schuldiner made them work

I am thinking about getting one and running along side my JCA22h

 

[benduncan]

People should just use what works for them. For example, I just plain can't get a usable sound out of a V30, or a 57. But give me an Alnico Gold and an e906 and it's party time

 

[mrhiwatt]

Part of your dislike of the tube amp is that your personal technique is such that you are fighting the amp instead of playing it. Some describe this as an amp being unforgiving. Notes have to be fretted perfectly to sing etc. This is neither good or bad just how you play and react with an amp. If the SS amps sound good to you and compliment you personal playing style or technique by all means use one. There is absolutely nothing wrong with using a SS amp. Just because Stevie Ray Vaughn used a strat and cables for strings does that mean it is the only guitar for playing the blues? Of. Course not everyone knows a v left handed by Albert king is the only way. LMAO. GO WITH WHAT WORKS FOR YOU.

 

[JimmyBlind]

I don't think tube amps will die out. Over driven guitar tone was born from, well, over-driving tube amplifiers.

Tone is subjective. If you dig the sound of a particular SS amp, then go with it brother.

Whether tube amps cannot produce decent lead sounds is false.

If I were playing metal & only metal, I would invest in a 5150/6505. I don't really think there's a better amp out there for that type of music. They're almost genre-defining.

The AxeFX is a problem-solving device more than anything. While it is amazing, it doesn't have any tone or character of its own. I can't see it taking the place of equipment that actually produces a noise of its own & responds organically to an input signal. It has its own place in the market side by side with tube & SS amplifiers.

 

[paulyc]

Fight used those Ampeg VH140Cs on War of Words and that's some heavy shit right there...

 

[Deleted member 8761]

What is the verdict on the ISP Theta?

 

[Anonymous]

solid state gear definitely has a place in my aresenal for metal. i always go back to it...or mix the two.

 

[searching]

Thanks for all of the mature and informative responses to what i knew wouldnt be taken well. Youve given me some quality critique and things for further consideration. Just to clarify im not saying tube amps arent the superior option for the majority but i think there are still other viable options out there that are auto dismissed for superficial reasons.

 

[WizardSouth-JP]

get a Diezel Herbert and call it a day

 

[mrhiwatt]

Searching,

Good luck in your tone search remember tone is in the hands and how you react with your guitar and amp. If I came over and fired up your rig it would in all likelihood sound like me. Read an article about Ted Nugent when he was touring with Van Halen and he asked Eddie if he could play his rig at sound check. Eddie said go for it and Ted said he was very disappointed when it sounded like Ted and when Eddie wailed on Teds fender rig it almost sounded as good as Eddie's rig. IT's the player you can chase tones your whole life trying to sound like someone. Pick a combo that works for you and don't worry if it's SS or tube. Many times I have tried a buddies rig that he sound heavenly on and I sound like crap on and he likewise using my setup. Let us know what you settle on. I have ISP Gstring but have never tried their amp so no advice there. Back in the day I liked the Randall Lynch used they didn't sound like crap to me.

Mrhiwatt

 

[C1-ocaster]

I agree with the collective wisdom here.

SS amps have their place, and there are players who can make them sound great.
When I started playing in the very early 80's I had a Peavey SS amp and we played hard rock and metal of the day.
It sounded great, and I kept that amp for a good decade.

I then switched to a hybrid tube pre with SS power in a MosValve combo.
Great amp, instant response.

I went to tube because I started to prefer the high gain distortion and saturation of tubes along with tube power.
It's not as responsive as SS, and that is likely what is bothering you.
The attack can be a bit slower especially if the tube amp is using a tube rectifier, which gives even more "sag".
You either like it or you don't.
It is personal, and you should play on and with what fits your playing.

What's interesting with my Vengeance amp is that it has a switch on the back where I can select a SS pre amp distortion or tube/valve-V1 distortion.
After playing around I decided I preferred the tube.
But, the SS sounds good do. In fact, the amp comes in default mode with the SS turned on, which I find odd considering it's marketed as an "all tube" amp.

I had a Bugera Tri Rec for a short while. It has tube, SS, or tube+SS rectifier options.
There IS a difference in feel between those. SS was "faster" on attack and more immediate. On tube it had more sag, great for Bluesy stuff.
I settled on SS+tube and really liked the feel.
I believe JetCity uses SS rectification as Soldano likes that and says it's the ONLY way to go.

Use what works for you. There is no shame or second class when it comes to you "feeling" the love between you and your gear and your playing.

 

[Bloodrock]

I love my tube amps but when I wanna play some metal I plug in the SS stuff. Just more brutal and tight imo. I use an old Randall, a Madison prophecy, and the good old standby Marshall 8100.

 

[apophis]

Love my fryette ul, deliverance and peavey tube stuff, but for brutal high gain/metal my ampeg ss150 gets the job done with honors