Dimarzio suing small Pickup maker!

[SpiderWars]

Hating DiMarzio is no reason to condone stealing IMO. None of this matters if they own the rights to something, and are suing someone who used their property without licensing it or without permission. Stealing is stealing. Remember that next time your music you're trying to sell is pirated, just sayin'

In some peoples minds DiMarzio is the one stealing from Gibson, regardless of some rationalization based on a trademark. Maybe not from a legal standpoint (remains to be seen) but at least from an ethical standpoint.

 

[Badronald]

I've found, over the years, that when a lay person goes on about their understanding of the law they almost always come off as extraordinarily ignorant.
Your feelings don't mean anything.
Just sayin'.

 

[shred4Him]

I called DiMarzio once...I wanted some recommendations for a passive Alnico magnet pickup. Instead I got a lecture about magnet worshippers and was blithely told my preferences are meaningless and I should just use a ceramic pickup of that persons choice. Never again.

At least I can call Seymour Duncan custom shop and get a real consultation, and get a custom pickup made (DiMarzio won't even do that).
I used to like them but since that bad experience, I don't care for them at all.

I get it, but they are correct. Bill Lawrence use to say the same thing about magnets. The magnet is just part of the pickup. It has no sound of it's own. If you use traditional pickup design, you can make certain assumptions when changing magnets, but if you use a different design, the magnet thing goes out the window. DiMarzio doesn't do a lot of traditional designs, so the magnet discussion for their pickups doesn't apply the same way it does to Duncan.

Bill Lawrence, before he passed away, used to say that he can use any magnet and design a pickup to sound any way he wants. You just have to know what a pickup makers building philosophy is.

 

[dfrattaroli]

Fairly certain Carvin/Kiesel has been offering double-creme for ever.

 

[Rdodson]

Double cream has always been a Dimarzio thing and easy identifier of their pickups, so it's a moot point.

By "always been a DiMarzo thing", you mean 20 years after Gibson did plenty of double cream PAF humbuckers in the 50's?

I'm glad you said this because I was about to do so.

 

[Doughboy]

I've found, over the years, that when a lay person goes on about their understanding of the law they almost always come off as extraordinarily ignorant.
Your feelings don't mean anything.
Just sayin'.

+1

The law is the law is the law.

Dimarzio paid for & owns a patent.

Someone is stealing their patent...which they own, which they paid for, which belongs to them.

Dimarzio has a right to protect their property.

You may not like it, but it's the law & reality in the business world.

 

[rsm]

I guess if Gibson invented it, they should have trademarked it or something. Seems if DiMarzio has the trademark or patent, they own the rights to it. Good to see them enforcing and protecting their rights.

@rezamatix my point was to say one bad experience (usually) isn't enough to stop me from doing something I like, or buying something I want or need. Even if I hated a company, doesn't mean I want to see them screwed out of their rights.

 

[Doughboy]

I guess if Gibson invented it, they should have trademarked it or something. Seems if DiMarzio has the trademark or patent, they own the rights to it. Good to see them enforcing and protecting their rights.

@rezamatix my point was to say one bad experience (usually) isn't enough to stop me from doing something I like, or buying something I want or need. Even if I hated a company, doesn't mean I want to see them screwed out of their rights.

Apparently if you're a big company & own something, it's OK for a small company to steal from you.

 

[cardinal]

So it's not a patent, it's a trademark from the '70s. And trademarks are somewhat strange creatures. Posting about it in a few sentences would end up simplifying things to the point it becomes inaccurate. For example, the fact that Gibson may have offered double cream pickups first doesn't necessarily defeat Dimarzio's registration, particularly against companies that are not Gibson. It's complicated.

 

[Chris6870]

I'm going to trademark double black humbuckers and license it to all the pickup makers in the country and sue the ones who make it without paying for the license.

 

[grooveHT]

I've found, over the years, that when a lay person goes on about their understanding of the law they almost always come off as extraordinarily ignorant.
Your feelings don't mean anything.
Just sayin'.

+1

The law is the law is the law.

Dimarzio paid for & owns a patent.

Someone is stealing their patent...which they own, which they paid for, which belongs to them.

Dimarzio has a right to protect their property.

You may not like it, but it's the law & reality in the business world.

I believe in this case, the double creme was a trademark, and they've taken Seymour Duncan to task for it when they've smuggled double creme pickups out of the custom shop under pickup covers. They've been defending that for years.

 

[Doughboy]

I'm going to trademark double black humbuckers and license it to all the pickup makers in the country and sue the ones who make it without paying for the license.

if you could actually do this, then you'd have the right to sue anyone who infringes on your patent/trademark & licensing deals are done all the time ie: strat head stocks.

Why is this such a head scratcher for most people?

 

[Kapo_Polenton]

Pretty sad when you can patent a "colour"..... Hey! You can't have a red logo because we own that colour.... in combination with that "shape"..which is yet another fascinating thing someone can patent. Reminds me of a quote from Ronnie James Dio making fun of Gene Simmons where he said that Gene could probably make the argument that he had a copyright over the term "OJ" for orange juice and nobody else can use it. What a joke. Fuck Dimarzio.... but i will still play a few of their pups.

 

[Doughboy]

Pretty sad when you can patent a "colour"..... Hey! You can't have a red logo because we own that colour.... in combination with that "shape"..which is yet another fascinating thing someone can patent. Reminds me of a quote from Ronnie James Dio making fun of Gene Simmons where he said that Gene could probably make the argument that he had a copyright over the term "OJ" for orange juice and nobody else can use it. What a joke. Fuck Dimarzio.... but i will still play a few of their pups.

Dimarzio didn't patent a color. They patented the color 'double cream' as it relates to 'humbucking pickups'.

You can sell a cream car or a cream hammer, but you can't sell a double cream humbucking pickup. BIG difference.

 

[1meanplexi]

Fender has the trademark on frets, input jacks, and tuners. They should shut everyone down.

Yup!!!!

 

[messenger]

Pretty sad when you can patent a "colour"..... Hey! You can't have a red logo because we own that colour.... in combination with that "shape"..which is yet another fascinating thing someone can patent. Reminds me of a quote from Ronnie James Dio making fun of Gene Simmons where he said that Gene could probably make the argument that he had a copyright over the term "OJ" for orange juice and nobody else can use it. What a joke. Fuck Dimarzio.... but i will still play a few of their pups.

Dimarzio didn't patent a color. They patented the color 'double cream' as it relates to 'humbucking pickups'.

You can sell a cream car or a cream hammer, but you can't sell a double cream humbucking pickup. BIG difference.

I don't think it's a big difference. It's still a patented color regardless. And I think it's rediculous. Fender and Gibson must be kicking themselves for not patenting rediculous things like that in the 50s

 

[Doughboy]

Pretty sad when you can patent a "colour"..... Hey! You can't have a red logo because we own that colour.... in combination with that "shape"..which is yet another fascinating thing someone can patent. Reminds me of a quote from Ronnie James Dio making fun of Gene Simmons where he said that Gene could probably make the argument that he had a copyright over the term "OJ" for orange juice and nobody else can use it. What a joke. Fuck Dimarzio.... but i will still play a few of their pups.

Dimarzio didn't patent a color. They patented the color 'double cream' as it relates to 'humbucking pickups'.

You can sell a cream car or a cream hammer, but you can't sell a double cream humbucking pickup. BIG difference.

I don't think it's a big difference. It's still a patented color regardless. And I think it's rediculous. Fender and Gibson must be kicking themselves for not patenting rediculous things like that in the 50s

Unfortunately what the average man in the street thinks it 100% irrelevant.

The law is the law is the law & what anyone thinks or feels makes no difference.

 

[SpiderWars]

Carvin pickups don't infringe on the trademark because the pole pieces are so different. And I thought you could make double cream all day long as long as it is sold with a cover but I can't remember.

Also, DiMarzio HAS to aggressively protect the trademark because if they don't they risk losing it. Apparently if you don't aggressively protect your trademarks, the trademark can be made null and void.

I just think it's a total douche move to trademark something like that, something that you weren't the first to do or develop. I'm hoping DiMarzio loses. If they do lose, then all you "the law is the law" guys will have a new law you can get behind. Even though the new law is 180* from the previous law you were defending.

 

[messenger]

I don't think anyone is arguing about "the law is the law" I think people (or myself at least) is saying it's stupid. And laws do change occasionally

 

[cardinal]

Not to keep harping on it, but folks here keep mentioning "patent" which I think causes some confusion. Patents are about new inventions. The double cream thing is a trademark: at bottom, it's just something that identifies the commercial source of the pickup.

Someone using it first doesn't necessarily mean that it's not a distinctive mark of a pickup made by Dimarzio.