Do i really need compression in "modern" Metal-Productions?

[Simon Dorn]

More like a production thread, but since the guitars are raw...
Don't know about you, but i think it's not too shabby, considering i did not use any EQ on Guitars (recorded with very low Volume) and Bass and i only used a very basic Drum Kit.
I removed all the additional Mics from the Kit (there's 3 availabe for each Kick and 3 for the Snare f.e. and they are generally all used in the Presets, that come with the Packs) and i only used one per Drum Shell with just an EQ84 on each of it, Plate Reverb on the Snare, 2 Overheads, 2 Room Mics. Bleed from the Shell Mics is disabled.
EQ, Tape Presence and Maximizer on the Master-Bus.

I often find modern productions too overprocessed.

Went for a different Amp-EQ-Setting this time. I would have found this way too harsh before in the room, but the Ears lie all the time.
Now i like it. With a bit more guitar-amp-volume the tone's certainly much thicker on the recording as well.

 

[Soundstorm]

Yeah it sounds good to me! Remember, there are no hard and fast rules in mixing and production. If it sounds good, it IS good. That being said I almost never compress distorted guitars, just because they're already compressed. That's the nature of tube distortion. I'm sure you can use a bus comp for color, but I tend to try to get the sound I'm after from the amp. And then on the 2 bus for really fast material, I've yet to find a compressor that I love. I just use the Ozone maximizer and take 2-3 dBs off then I'm good to go. I've been looking into getting a nice mastering grade hardware limiter for better transparency, but that's about it.

 

[Simon Dorn]

Thanks, and thanks for your reply! I can do something with that. Sure, there is no right or wrong, but there may be a "better". I read that Colin Richardson is only happy with 2 of his productions after all, but it's of course an evolution/constant improvement. I tried multiband compressors on only the guitar low-end and that works quite good. I watched some production-clips where they used several plug-ins to cut, and boost, compress and limit on the same track, additional Snare-Samples, Automation and whatnot. I just wanted to take another route. I did not even use compression on the Drums, nor the Bass. For the Vocals, i don't know yet.

 

[Soundstorm]

Thanks, and thanks for your reply! I can do something with that. Sure, there is no right or wrong, but there may be a "better". I read that Colin Richardson is only happy with 2 of his productions after all, but it's of course an evolution/constant improvement. I tried multiband compressors on only the guitar low-end and that works quite good. I watched some production-clips where they used several plug-ins to cut, and boost, compress and limit on the same track, additional Snare-Samples, Automation and whatnot. I just wanted to take another route. I did not even use compression on the Drums, nor the Bass. For the Vocals, i don't know yet.

It all depends on what you like. There's soooo many tools available now that I think people feel compelled to use them all. Then of course YouTube is chock full of these "5 tHiNgS yOu MUST.." hack engineers/content creators. I personally love earlier production styles from the 70's/80's/90's. Stripped back but each component was captured well. They didn't have to brickwall everything to try to get that extra 1dB of loudness because the loudness wars weren't really a thing at that point, so mixes still had a lot of dynamic range. It had more of a "band in the room" sound to me, which is a really fun vibe to try to create when you're a one man band using virtual drums and digital plugins.

 

[Dale B]

It all depends on what you like. There's soooo many tools available now that I think people feel compelled to use them all. Then of course YouTube is chock full of these "5 tHiNgS yOu MUST.." hack engineers/content creators. I personally love earlier production styles from the 70's/80's/90's. Stripped back but each component was captured well. They didn't have to brickwall everything to try to get that extra 1dB of loudness because the loudness wars weren't really a thing at that point, so mixes still had a lot of dynamic range. It had more of a "band in the room" sound to me, which is a really fun vibe to try to create when you're a one man band using virtual drums and digital plugins.

YES, SIR!

 

[Speeddemon]

If you're looking for a good 'mastering' or mix comp, look on eBay for the Radioman SSL clone.
I got one myself and it really adds that magical 'glue' that lifts a demo-ish sounding mix where you can't put your finger on what is missing, to something more radio ready.

 

[Bram576]

Sounds good! Don’t think there’s a hard and fast rule on compression. With guitars I usually only do multi band on the low end. Master bus I use an ssl type and barely get it going. I think could be more overall balance to this. Lower the cymbals a bit, that’s always a dead giveaway to programmed drums. Go in and adjust the velocities as well. Like on the machine gun kick part. Strong work as always.

 

[skoora]

There’s definitely a frequency I would want to lessen in the guitars, get some of that peaked mid out of there. I like your choice on the snare. The whole thing just needs more size in the low end. I would work on the bass and the kicks. Guitars probably don’t need anymore. Overall pretty good.

 

[Simon Dorn]

It all depends on what you like. There's soooo many tools available now that I think people feel compelled to use them all. Then of course YouTube is chock full of these "5 tHiNgS yOu MUST.." hack engineers/content creators. I personally love earlier production styles from the 70's/80's/90's. Stripped back but each component was captured well. They didn't have to brickwall everything to try to get that extra 1dB of loudness because the loudness wars weren't really a thing at that point, so mixes still had a lot of dynamic range. It had more of a "band in the room" sound to me, which is a really fun vibe to try to create when you're a one man band using virtual drums and digital plugins.

Yes, i know. I don't watch many Production clips. I stumbled across this on the Kohlekeller Channel. You are right.
Loudness War is a thing. It's hard to not fall for it. I have around 5 db's of Dynamics in the clip when all instruments are playing.

 

[Simon Dorn]

If you're looking for a good 'mastering' or mix comp, look on eBay for the Radioman SSL clone.
I got one myself and it really adds that magical 'glue' that lifts a demo-ish sounding mix where you can't put your finger on what is missing, to something more radio ready.

Thanks for the tip!

 

[Simon Dorn]

Sounds good! Don’t think there’s a hard and fast rule on compression. With guitars I usually only do multi band on the low end. Master bus I use an ssl type and barely get it going. I think could be more overall balance to this. Lower the cymbals a bit, that’s always a dead giveaway to programmed drums. Go in and adjust the velocities as well. Like on the machine gun kick part. Strong work as always.

Thanks! I didn't use any. Low-End Compression makes sense. Cymbal-Volume is set on purpose. But i realized they have artefacts after the YT-Upload. Exported it as .wav. I set it to 0db in the vid program and exported that as mp4. Audio of the video-program is AAC. Don't know what YT does to it. That's no excuse. Just an observation. You also never know how loud the different YT-Clips are, apart from the production and what they did to it in the Clip before they uploaded it to YT.
I've been watching some clips of you lately, btw. You almost made me interested in the HellRazor.

 

[Simon Dorn]

There’s definitely a frequency I would want to lessen in the guitars, get some of that peaked mid out of there. I like your choice on the snare. The whole thing just needs more size in the low end. I would work on the bass and the kicks. Guitars probably don’t need anymore. Overall pretty good.

Thanks! The Drums are plain and simple. Guitar Volume from the amp, while recording is much too low.
I have plenty of other "mixes" on my channel. It just depends. Like always. You can set it however you like.
That might be part of the "problem".

 

[Simon Dorn]

Thanks guys!
Did any of you compare it to other Productions?
I compare myself to the "Big Guys", like.:
"Randomly" (more or lesse) opened YT-Clips

I don't know if anyone of you got the nerves to click through all the clips, but it changes the perspective.
I right now stream my Laptop to the Televison and chose and compare them.

Skoksberg, Swedish Oldschool

Morrisound, Tampa.

Rutan

The King

The Master

 

[Simon Dorn]

And even something like this

 

[Simon Dorn]

I go to the "Larry-Thread" now.

I should have visited him at his home, at the time he offered that to me.
So i would know by myself what all the fuss is about.