EVH "Live Without A Net" tone - Eventide question?

[drucifer]

Racist.

Steve

Exactly what I was thinking!

 

[Anonymous]

No need to get all riled up. My original question was about the Pitchfactor. I thought this would be a great place to have a discussion about this particular tone, and which setting on the Pitchfactor might be best to achieve it.

I'm not riled at all. Perhaps the discussion just derailed naturally. No hard feelings on my side...

Also, I still think the micro shift will be better for getting this tone. Give it a try - maybe record some comparison clips...

Steve

 

[Anonymous]

Racist.

Steve

Exactly what I was thinking!

Steve

 

[Digital Jams]

The 5150 era was pre H3000, and also pre w/d/w. He was actually NOT using a dry cab at that time. Bradshaw was trying to get him to run the dry, but he wasn't interested.

During this time, it was 949s, SDE3000s, a Rane SM26 mixer, and the HHV800 amp.

Not correct. He was running w/d/w. What Bradshaw was trying to get him to do was run the wet cabs 100% wet, but he wanted some dry sound in the wet cabs. He did have the completely dry cab. I don't care what Eventide he was running at the time. If you tried the setup I just described, you'd hear this tone. I've been experimenting with these tones for a long, long time... but you do whatever makes you happy...

Steve

Said with conviction but you should not do it with a japping type attitude.

Racist.

Steve

I am focusing myself in new directions so I am glad that you noticed.

 

[Anonymous]

The 5150 era was pre H3000, and also pre w/d/w. He was actually NOT using a dry cab at that time. Bradshaw was trying to get him to run the dry, but he wasn't interested.

During this time, it was 949s, SDE3000s, a Rane SM26 mixer, and the HHV800 amp.

Not correct. He was running w/d/w. What Bradshaw was trying to get him to do was run the wet cabs 100% wet, but he wanted some dry sound in the wet cabs. He did have the completely dry cab. I don't care what Eventide he was running at the time. If you tried the setup I just described, you'd hear this tone. I've been experimenting with these tones for a long, long time... but you do whatever makes you happy...

Steve

Said with conviction but you should not do it with a japping type attitude.

Racist.

Steve

I am focusing myself in new directions so I am glad that you noticed.

Good to see you growing and taking on new challenges!

 

[sgill72]

i don't think 5150 live era was the h3000 at all. while it can get you there...the original post was curious as to the pitchfactor and the 949 settings. i say try them.

i used a g force and a rane sm26 to feed the wet cabinets dry signal and got real real close.

it's best to experiment. i found myself not going for evh tone so much as to getting a sound i dug using the same "method."

 

[Anonymous]

i don't think 5150 live era was the h3000 at all. while it can get you there...the original post was curious as to the pitchfactor and the 949 settings. i say try them.

i used a g force and a rane sm26 to feed the wet cabinets dry signal and got real real close.

it's best to experiment. i found myself not going for evh tone so much as to getting a sound i dug using the same "method."

Obviously, you're not a golfer...

Steve

 

[drucifer]

Obviously, you're not a golfer...

Steve

Did he pee on your rug?

 

[Anonymous]

Obviously, you're not a golfer...

Steve

Did he pee on your rug?

The chinaman is not the issue here, Dude!

Steve

 

[Little B]

So theres a couple different ways to get there ( Eddies era tone)....please let us know what happens w/ the pitch factors' micro and h949 settings when youre trying this out??????

 

[Bronco]

So theres a couple different ways to get there ( Eddies era tone)....please let us know what happens w/ the pitch factors' micro and h949 settings when youre trying this out??????

Oh I can tell you the PF works great for this...W/D or W/D/W...the 910/949 or the MicroPitch will all do the trick; mostly it has to do with the mix and delay times. To me, it sounds "nailed", but then again I haven't compared it to the real deal Eventides or Axe Fx. But for someone wanting this basic effect, PF nails it in spades. FWIW, the PF has a killer stereo digital delay built in as well.

 

[Klark]

...He always had a dry cab going straight to the board,then wet cabs-leave the mixing in up to the f.o.h.guy.....Id love to hear more on this!!!!!

..250ms Delay L/ 500ms Delay R, a few volume declining repeats..

Sorry, but this is an all too common regurgitation of an internet rumor, probably started by some goon that stumbled onto something that resembled what he was hearing on his favorite tune, probably after nine beers and six bong hits. The pitchshift stuff is accurate, as I believe Bradshaw and/or Friedman have confirmed that. But in reality, the 250/500 delay was only used for maybe a couple recorded songs, and never used live, other than on a couple songs where Ed wanted that much bounce for dramatic effect. That much bounce & differential between left & right never worked with a PA that's hung 40+ feet in the air, and usually over 140' wide. Keep in mind they were playing in sheds & arenas that already had enough delay bounce to make even U2 sound terrible. Mix that with a static, nonrhythmic delay of 250/500 and it was disastrous. I have literally spoke face to face with Van Halen's FOH engineer of that time, Jon Ostrin, and their later FOH guy Jim Yakabuski about their techniques and their use of what Ed was sending them. 98% of the time, the delay was the same in the left & right, and was always programmed within 20ms or so of the tempo they rehearsed the song during pre-tour rehearsal.

Oh, and by the way, there was (and still is) four channels on the FOH console for Ed's rig alone.. Left wet, center, dry, and right wet. I believe the center or the dry was direct from the Palmer or load box, and the other of course was the mic on the dry/center cab. This gave the FOH guy a choice depending on whatever sounded best in whatever venue, and gave him the option to mix both if necessary.

I also remember one of them mentioning something about the wet cabs were originally miced, but later went to direct just because it was easier and again, what they were putting out wasn't all that critical to have that accurate in the house. It was the dry/center that mattered, the core tone.

Last but not least, the left & right wets were never used in the monitor rig onstage, only dry for the same reason I mentioned above.. Way too much wash already in the venues for anyone to ever want Ed's wet in their wedge/s. This is pretty common even nowadays, and even cooler that it was not just Ed, but Bradshaw, and the VH crew that helped pioneer it all.

 

[reverymike]

With all the latest EVH rig speculation, I remembered this thread from a month ago. This last statement is interesting, as I've always heard the left and right delay was in the neighborhood of 250/500. This post seems to claim otherwise. Interesting for discussion purposes. I also found the info on the 5150 rig being stereo only (not W/D/W) in this era.

See the scan in this link. . .it's from Guitar World around that time. The interview with Bradshaw said something to the effect of "why don't we just use a dry cab instead of burying the signal?!" It was shortly after this that Bob was able to convince Ed to start using the middle dry cab. The info in the posts regarding the palmer is incorrect though, as he kept that in the rig for awhile after (using the filtered out to mix in with his mic'd signals).

http://forum.metroamp.com/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=24983

 

[Anonymous]

Sorry, but this is an all too common regurgitation of an internet rumor, probably started by some goon that stumbled onto something that resembled what he was hearing on his favorite tune, probably after nine beers and six bong hits.

No Klark. My description is the result of my own considerable experimentation with a variety of gear to get this tone and it works just fine, thanks... My description was to help someone get the tone, not meant to say it was exactly how Eddie did this onstage in large arenas.

Steve

 

[reverymike]

I knew I had seen somewhere that the 5150 era rig didn't include the center dry cab. . .I just couldn't remember where.

 

[Klark]

Sorry, but this is an all too common regurgitation of an internet rumor, probably started by some goon that stumbled onto something that resembled what he was hearing on his favorite tune, probably after nine beers and six bong hits.

No Klark. My description is the result of my own considerable experimentation with a variety of gear to get this tone and it works just fine, thanks... My description was to help someone get the tone, not meant to say it was exactly how Eddie did this onstage in large arenas.

Steve

I understand, and I wasn't attacking you. Just trying to show that while the basic concept is correct, the devil is in the details.. Details we don't always read about when grabbing bits of info from the internet.

And yes Mike, the guys I spoke with did not come on board with VH until after OU812, so your stereo stuff for the 5150 tour are probably correct.

 

[bmf5150]

https://youtu.be/YOdXqGbphAo

Cool video on dialing in pitch factor for VH balance tone

 

[tommytom11]

The 5150 era was pre H3000, and also pre w/d/w. He was actually NOT using a dry cab at that time. Bradshaw was trying to get him to run the dry, but he wasn't interested.

During this time, it was 949s, SDE3000s, a Rane SM26 mixer, and the HHV800 amp.

Not correct. He was running w/d/w. What Bradshaw was trying to get him to do was run the wet cabs 100% wet, but he wanted some dry sound in the wet cabs. He did have the completely dry cab. I don't care what Eventide he was running at the time. If you tried the setup I just described, you'd hear this tone. I've been experimenting with these tones for a long, long time... but you do whatever makes you happy...

Steve

thats not right. the original poster you responded to is correct. Bob B is a good friend of mine and i saw that rig.

 

[tommytom11]

The 5150 era was pre H3000, and also pre w/d/w. He was actually NOT using a dry cab at that time. Bradshaw was trying to get him to run the dry, but he wasn't interested.

During this time, it was 949s, SDE3000s, a Rane SM26 mixer, and the HHV800 amp.

Not correct. He was running w/d/w. What Bradshaw was trying to get him to do was run the wet cabs 100% wet, but he wanted some dry sound in the wet cabs. He did have the completely dry cab. I don't care what Eventide he was running at the time. If you tried the setup I just described, you'd hear this tone. I've been experimenting with these tones for a long, long time... but you do whatever makes you happy...

Steve

Said with conviction but you should not do it with a japping type attitude.

Agreed. I'll reread the article I have with Bradshaw talking about the rig. I could have sworn he said that Ed wanted to just run a load on the amp, and play in stereo. I could be wrong, but I've been studying this topic for over 20 years, so I have some experience here as well.

you are right

 

[SFW]

Cool!...Im curious.....can this be achieved w/ a TC. G force or g system as well?...

Yes. I do it with my G-Major 2. Its under the Pitch tab. +9/-9 and blend to taste.