Floyd Rose issues again

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billsbigego

billsbigego

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I don't want to bash the system. I know others use them with success, just not me. I mounted a tremelno system in it but took out the spring. Well maybe it's not a tremelno system, but it's designed to stiffen the pull ups on the bar so you can bend strings without other strings going out of tune. As well you can downtune the 6th string without the other strings going out of tune. Anyhow, the locking nut is secure to the neck, everything is tight. The studs are not rocking. The only thing I can think of is that I have some speaker wire inside the springs to cut the noise of the springs down. Maybe it's catching on a spring? Any other suggestions or whether you think this is the issue?

So it's in tune, then I do a dive bomb and it goes out of tune, sometimes, sharp, sometimes flat. Drives me nuts. The strings are a day old, but I stretched the shit out of them, tuned up, stretched again and tuned up, about 10x then tightened the nut, fine tuned. Still the same issue. I did lube the knife edge just now with some 3 in 1. Some say it's not necessary to do that. I milled down the sides of the tremel lock device so there is no contact with the strings as well.

Any help appreciated.

10955693_853364981373717_3226428215434389077_n.jpg
 
Some additional things I´ve seen during the years are strings slipping in the lock nut due to grooving and the saddles sliding a bit on the baseplate due to the intonation screws coming undone or stripping their threads. And of course, if your knife edges are worn you´ll get the same issues with or without oil.

Is it on all strings or just one or a few?
 
Lock the nut and push/pull hard on the strings behind the nut. Does the tuning change? If so, something's going wrong with the nut.

Watch the nut and dive to the bar completely to see if something around the nut shifts. Same with a pull up.

That trem stabilizer looks unusual. I don't see a spring to load it? I'd recommend just taking it out of the equation for now. A Floyd should be stable without it, it'll be easier to diagnose the issue if we take that out of the equation. You can add it back in later to keep double stops in tune and let you switch to drop D.

How do the knife edges look? If you want to lube them, use chap stick.
 
This is a new guitar. Floyd Rose 1000. The mechanism in there is a Goeldo (Goldo) Backbox Tremolo Stabilizer. I just reversed it so it's used as a stop for the pull up position. That way I can downtune the 6th string without all the other strings going out of whack. With the Blackbox spring still in it like the picture below, you're supposed to be able to downtune the 6th string without the others going out of whack, but I find that it doesn't work that great even with the spring set tight. So it's essentially a block for the up position. Being the nut is new as well, I'm at a loss to see what the issue is.

It also doesn't help that I have perfect pitch. I can hear a note out of tune 2 miles away.

goldo-backbox-3.jpg
 
If it's a new guitar there's no reason for it to go out of tune. Tuning on a healthy Floyd is rock solid stable. Much more so than any trem I've used and really stays in tune better than many fixed bridge guitars (with less than perfectly-cut nuts).

All I can suggest is to read up on how to set them (not hard, Ibanez Rules has a great setup guide), and make sure you're stretching the strings well and locking it down properly.
 
One thing I figured out is to stretch them again after you lock them down. Man, I wish I was having the same experience as everyone else. I mean I know these things must be good if people use them. I haven't had a guitar with a FR in years. Forgot how much fun it was. I didn't know what I was doing back then either :rock:
 
How is the saddle mounted? Are the screws mounted from the back of the neck or directly from the saddle?

If it's from behind check the length of the screws. I had the issue with one of my guitars. I put a distance to the screws so they get shorter. The screws didn't allow the locking screws to do their job.
 
I also usually wait a day or 2 before locking down. Let the stretching stabilize overnight.
 
My solution for FLoyd issues...........Get rid of any guitar that has one.
 
The locking nut attaches to the neck with screws on the top of the neck, which are tight.
 
Lock nut
check posts to see if there is any play or worn knife edges
 
It really doesn't make sense. If the locking nut is stable, the strings are stretched ocked properly at the nut and bridge, the knife edges are new, and the posts are stable: it's hard to see how it could not only go out of tune but sometimes go sharp and sometimes flat.

Have you set it up so that the baseplate is level at the neural position?
 
Here's what I did initially. The neck is angled to the body. So I had the Floyd setup to follow the angle of the strings. It was not parallel with the body initially. So, through research I learned that the Floyd has to be flush with the body and fixed that last night. Got to do a little more experimentation today with it.

Thanks for the help gentlemen.
 
Yeah it's best to have the knife edges perpendicular to the posts. That should be the most stable zero point for the bridge to rest.
 
You could temporarily set it up to float and see if the problem persists. If it holds tune properly floating you can turn your attention to the stabilizer, which I think is a factor in it not returning to zero. Try removing those speaker cables from the springs as well.
 
mikey":28l20tyq said:
You could temporarily set it up to float and see if the problem persists. If it holds tune properly floating you can turn your attention to the stabilizer, which I think is a factor in it not returning to zero. Try removing those speaker cables from the springs as well.
Click to expand...

this ..... I have a goldo stabilizer and found if you don't get it set right you have all sorts of problems, but when you get it right they are great. i have it so I can use a Dtuna and still float the trem...guitar stays in tune perfectly
 
I tried the goldbox thing...was not a great piece at all. I use the ESP arming adjusters for the last several years and they have been perfect without issue as far as stability and returning to pitch. Cardinal's advice on keeping the knife edges parallel is also very important as the other tips with the lock nut, etc. I've been using Floyd Rose systems since the early 80s and the only double locking system I had issues with is was the edge pro setup from the mid-90s as there was something wrong with the unit. Other than that, I have set them all up the same and they work great.

I am wondering if using the 4 springs on the unit has something to do with it as well. What guage string are you using?
 
If you have Allen screws holding the nut on they may be loose. My nut on my axis has two on the underside of the neck that sometimes loosen over time. It whacks my guitar outta tune even without using the bar. Once tightened I'm back in business
 
sytharnia1560":34mlsxq1 said:
mikey":34mlsxq1 said:
You could temporarily set it up to float and see if the problem persists. If it holds tune properly floating you can turn your attention to the stabilizer, which I think is a factor in it not returning to zero. Try removing those speaker cables from the springs as well.
Click to expand...

this ..... I have a goldo stabilizer and found if you don't get it set right you have all sorts of problems, but when you get it right they are great. i have it so I can use a Dtuna and still float the trem...guitar stays in tune perfectly
Click to expand...

Once everything else is verified working and set up correctly the only thing left is the springs. Pull those speaker cables out and just see if the problem goes away. If it does go away I would suggest using a piece of foam (like the stuff you find in a emg package) instead of the cable to help kill the spring ringing sound. Cut a strip that's a little too big to slide into the spring then use the tremolo arm to push one end into the middle of the spring. Push it in from both sides so that you end up with a ball in more or less the middle of the spring. This will keep most of the ringing down but wont bind against the length of the spring keeping it from returning your strings to pitch.

Hope that helps.
 
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