guitarslinger
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VHT P-50E Explanation from Steve Fryette
Here is a little writeup Steve Fryette did about comparing the V30 to his P50E speaker...
Hope it helps....
The P50E speaker is custom built to VHT specifications by Eminence, and is only available from
VHT. The P50E is not an OEM version of the Eminence Redcoat or Patriot series speaker line.
It is difficult to discuss the sonic characteristics of the P50E or any speaker for that matter, in
isolation because so much of speaker behavior depends on the environment in which it is
operating - that is to say, 2X12 cab, 4X12 cab, front-mount, rear-mount, wood type, construction, style, playing volume, etc, etc. Having said all that lets talk about the P50E versus the popular Celestion Vintage 30 in a VHT 4X12 FatBottom straight cab.
The P50E is actually a 50-watt speaker. The V30, although officially rated at 60 watts is in reality
closer to 75 watts. The P50E has a smaller magnet than the V30, which insures that the speaker
will break up at lower amplifier power than a V30. However, the V30 has a more compliant
suspension, which together with the larger magnet causes the speaker to move more-low end.
This also causes more distortion in the higher frequencies contributing to a harsh top end. The
highly compliant suspension makes it difficult for the speaker to track low frequencies especially at high volume levels and this causes a “woofy” sound when playing staccato chording (‘palm muting”). It is also partly why the P50E, although lower in power handling capacity, seems to produce about as much low end as a V30, yet with better control of the low end. The smaller magnet on the P50E also contributes to a softer, more natural sounding high-end response,
which is not smeared out by the sloppy suspension, as is the case with the V30. Finally, the VHT
cabinet is a front loaded type, producing a more open, well-dispersed sound. Front mounting a
V30 is less desirable as the harshness on the top end, which is normally masked in a rearmounted enclosure, is now more audible.
The result is that the P50E, while not a particularly scooped speaker, can sound a bit that way in
a VHT cab, or more like a tighter, smoother V30 with a more focused low midrange. Now take
those speakers out of the VHT FatBottom cab which does a good job of controlling the speakers
bottom end response and put them in a traditional style 4X12 enclosure, which does everything
but control bottom end behavior. Now the rear-mounted P50E will lose some top end clarity and the bottom end control will be diminished, causing it to sound much more like a Greenback but with a little bit more spank. The V30 by comparison will sound smoother on top, but the low-end difficulties will be highly exaggerated.
Another very important consideration in the comparison has to do with the age and condition of the speakers under test. The P50E is not factory “preconditioned” as many OEM speakers might be or might claim to be. This means that depending on usage, it may take as little as a month or as long as 6 months for the speaker to “break in”. A V30 will be looser and warmer out of the box, but also is brighter and tighter than it will be 4 months from now (with regular use). The V30 will mellow out a bit over time, but the low-end control issues will be exaggerated. By the same token, the P50E, while retaining good bottom end control will sweeten up and smooth out over time. Comparing the FatBottom to the Deliverance cabs, the Deliverance cab will sound warmer, looser and sweeter than the FatBottom cab even though they use the same speaker. In this case, the Deliverance cab is designed to make the speaker fatter and warmer sounding, as might happen in a traditional 4X12 cab design, but without the traditional boomy, sloppy rattling low end. The ability to identify and manipulate key elements of cabinet construction gives us control over those speaker parameters we wish to suppress or enhance. Finally, all of the above depends on the amp in response to which the speakers’ mids, top and bottom will all shift around in concert with the difference in behavior between 100 watts or 50 for example. Keep in mind that this discussion assumes all speakers in the comparison are 16 ohms, as the P50E is only available in 16 ohms. This is important since the impedance of the amplifier load will dramatically affect the behavior of the amplifier due to damping factor and frequency response.
Here is a little writeup Steve Fryette did about comparing the V30 to his P50E speaker...
Hope it helps....
The P50E speaker is custom built to VHT specifications by Eminence, and is only available from
VHT. The P50E is not an OEM version of the Eminence Redcoat or Patriot series speaker line.
It is difficult to discuss the sonic characteristics of the P50E or any speaker for that matter, in
isolation because so much of speaker behavior depends on the environment in which it is
operating - that is to say, 2X12 cab, 4X12 cab, front-mount, rear-mount, wood type, construction, style, playing volume, etc, etc. Having said all that lets talk about the P50E versus the popular Celestion Vintage 30 in a VHT 4X12 FatBottom straight cab.
The P50E is actually a 50-watt speaker. The V30, although officially rated at 60 watts is in reality
closer to 75 watts. The P50E has a smaller magnet than the V30, which insures that the speaker
will break up at lower amplifier power than a V30. However, the V30 has a more compliant
suspension, which together with the larger magnet causes the speaker to move more-low end.
This also causes more distortion in the higher frequencies contributing to a harsh top end. The
highly compliant suspension makes it difficult for the speaker to track low frequencies especially at high volume levels and this causes a “woofy” sound when playing staccato chording (‘palm muting”). It is also partly why the P50E, although lower in power handling capacity, seems to produce about as much low end as a V30, yet with better control of the low end. The smaller magnet on the P50E also contributes to a softer, more natural sounding high-end response,
which is not smeared out by the sloppy suspension, as is the case with the V30. Finally, the VHT
cabinet is a front loaded type, producing a more open, well-dispersed sound. Front mounting a
V30 is less desirable as the harshness on the top end, which is normally masked in a rearmounted enclosure, is now more audible.
The result is that the P50E, while not a particularly scooped speaker, can sound a bit that way in
a VHT cab, or more like a tighter, smoother V30 with a more focused low midrange. Now take
those speakers out of the VHT FatBottom cab which does a good job of controlling the speakers
bottom end response and put them in a traditional style 4X12 enclosure, which does everything
but control bottom end behavior. Now the rear-mounted P50E will lose some top end clarity and the bottom end control will be diminished, causing it to sound much more like a Greenback but with a little bit more spank. The V30 by comparison will sound smoother on top, but the low-end difficulties will be highly exaggerated.
Another very important consideration in the comparison has to do with the age and condition of the speakers under test. The P50E is not factory “preconditioned” as many OEM speakers might be or might claim to be. This means that depending on usage, it may take as little as a month or as long as 6 months for the speaker to “break in”. A V30 will be looser and warmer out of the box, but also is brighter and tighter than it will be 4 months from now (with regular use). The V30 will mellow out a bit over time, but the low-end control issues will be exaggerated. By the same token, the P50E, while retaining good bottom end control will sweeten up and smooth out over time. Comparing the FatBottom to the Deliverance cabs, the Deliverance cab will sound warmer, looser and sweeter than the FatBottom cab even though they use the same speaker. In this case, the Deliverance cab is designed to make the speaker fatter and warmer sounding, as might happen in a traditional 4X12 cab design, but without the traditional boomy, sloppy rattling low end. The ability to identify and manipulate key elements of cabinet construction gives us control over those speaker parameters we wish to suppress or enhance. Finally, all of the above depends on the amp in response to which the speakers’ mids, top and bottom will all shift around in concert with the difference in behavior between 100 watts or 50 for example. Keep in mind that this discussion assumes all speakers in the comparison are 16 ohms, as the P50E is only available in 16 ohms. This is important since the impedance of the amplifier load will dramatically affect the behavior of the amplifier due to damping factor and frequency response.
