T
TrueTone500
Banned
C
chrisrocksusa
New member
I hate henry rollins. He's a self important douchebag.
supersonic
New member
He's a very intelligent man none the less! The information in this video is nothing new.chrisrocksusa":28bztkvj said:
supersonic
New member
I'd love to meet HR he seems like an interesting guy. Unique for sure.Rezamatix":ibt94jnc said:chrisrocksusa":ibt94jnc said:
Just did a job with him. He was super cool to me. and that...is all that matters.
and for the record. Rollins fuckin has been killing it for decades.
J
joepete77
New member
It's true about the record industry being dead, but with technology it would have happened eventually anyway. Genes take on rappers being the new rock stars was interesting. I read Rollins book many yrs ago, it was a good read. Saw Rollins band many yrs ago also.
stephen sawall
SEMI ERECT MEMBER
It is obvious that rap & hip hop is the new rock stars - Playing rock is like speaking latin - it is a dead langue.
G
Gorehog
Active member
i love Rollins.however,imo,"liar" is far from his best work.
talking,writing,acting,hosting shows,singing,it all is something i can relate to.
talking,writing,acting,hosting shows,singing,it all is something i can relate to.
C
C1-ocaster
New member
Unless a rap or hip hop band actually have a band playing the music, then it's NOT rock n roll to me.
R&R is not dead, it's just not the popular music it once was.
Gene Simmons has it wrong. Rap/Hip Hop is NOT the new Rock N Roll. It is the new "pop" flavor as it's the most popular form of "music" right now and for quite some time. But to say it's the new R&R is ridiculous.
There are various forms of Rap/Hip Hop and very few tend toward a R&R style.
It's it's own style of music and it's now become "pop music" and that's what it is.
There are still Rock bands our there and many who still sell records, do shows, and continue to record, even with younger cats.
So R&R is NOT dead, its' just not as popular as it once was.
It's happened many times before in the history of music and rock. Disco was once the popular music and R&R bands lived on.
In the 80's there was a resurgence in rock music and many forms of it were also the "pop" music of their day.
R&R too a popular decline in the later 90's when rap/hip hop became wildly popular after being an underground form of music for a couple decades.
BTW, no way do I support the inclusion of non Rock bands into the "Rock n Roll" hall of fame. That hall is for R&R and should remain R&R.
Too bad they've become a repository for any form of popular music and including Rap/Hip Hop. Seems they are doing it just to remain vital and active as R&R has declined in popularity. The hall made this very bad decision just to keep itself relevant and that SUCKS!
R&R is not dead, it's just not the popular music it once was.
Gene Simmons has it wrong. Rap/Hip Hop is NOT the new Rock N Roll. It is the new "pop" flavor as it's the most popular form of "music" right now and for quite some time. But to say it's the new R&R is ridiculous.
There are various forms of Rap/Hip Hop and very few tend toward a R&R style.
It's it's own style of music and it's now become "pop music" and that's what it is.
There are still Rock bands our there and many who still sell records, do shows, and continue to record, even with younger cats.
So R&R is NOT dead, its' just not as popular as it once was.
It's happened many times before in the history of music and rock. Disco was once the popular music and R&R bands lived on.
In the 80's there was a resurgence in rock music and many forms of it were also the "pop" music of their day.
R&R too a popular decline in the later 90's when rap/hip hop became wildly popular after being an underground form of music for a couple decades.
BTW, no way do I support the inclusion of non Rock bands into the "Rock n Roll" hall of fame. That hall is for R&R and should remain R&R.
Too bad they've become a repository for any form of popular music and including Rap/Hip Hop. Seems they are doing it just to remain vital and active as R&R has declined in popularity. The hall made this very bad decision just to keep itself relevant and that SUCKS!
Ventura
Well-known member
I dig and respect what Rollins has to say, generally speaking.
Just for the record.
Just for the record.
Purpleibby
Well-known member
Have to agree with Gene, blame the downloading thieves....yes you....you know who you are.....thank them for helping kill off your fav music.
Ventura
Well-known member
Naaaaah. It's not the fans, it's technology and the record industry itself. Look, if it weren't for the record companies expecting and demanding 98% of the proceeds of sales, with a f*ck-all 2% going to the artists, I think prices would be a lot lower, therefore more accessible to the general public, and if people knew the money was going direct to the artists they want to support, then they'd be more willing to splash the cash.Purpleibby":3hl5l75c said:
My opinion.
Ventura
Well-known member
So I watched the clip.
Alright, here's my take on it:
I loved KISS, they were what got me into rock and roll as a 'yoot', LOVED 'em. But somewhere along the line, people like Gene got the opportunity to take it to a marketing stratosphere. Crossroads - lots of money - but is it rock and roll? No. Having a TV show, multiple facelifts, and sitting there on a mountain of money doesn't lead me to believe he's sincere about anything, in fact, he's a sellout. And that's fine - he's mackin' the bucks bigtime and has a bigass machine running for him and his trademarking. Yay. But his attitude in this clip isn't what got him where he is today - not a chance - those cats rocked hard, they had a schtick and it worked. But holding a VISA card with your face and band's name on it? That's not rock and roll, that's not where it all started, that's not the anti-authoritative, non-conformist, rebellious fervor that sparked a sonic revolution. Not a chance - that's just "going corporate" and doing the exact "opposite" of what made rock and roll, rock and roll.
I'll agree we need a little bit of a renaissance soon - you know - another wave of "something" - but R&R's not dead. The corporations responsible for doling this stuff out are responsible, and if big tits and throwing money on the street while rolling in a drop top benz is what sells records, that's not music, that's idolatry and idiocy. THAT is what the corporatists are selling - NOT the rebellious rocker, grunger, metaller, sludger, shoe-gazer... Not a fuckin' hope. And for those cats out there still true to their roots, I commend you - being at the crossroads ain't no easy decision. Hence the reason so many of our true iconic game-changing rockers died at such a young age - you know the names - they were TRUE to their craft and music... Once they got to the bigtime, it was no longer art, expression and passion - it was void of all artistry and just became a sterile assembly line of maximizing profit margins and selling image. Image has no sound.
Fuck Gene. He's a flake. He's plastic. And albeit he may be diggin' how far he's come, his credibility isn't what it once maybe was to me - hell from what I've heard every show KISS has put on in the last few years as been pre-recorded and lip-sync'd. If that's true - even if only fractionally - go fuck yourself. You're not a musician, you're a whore.
Have a nice night Folks
Mo
Alright, here's my take on it:
I loved KISS, they were what got me into rock and roll as a 'yoot', LOVED 'em. But somewhere along the line, people like Gene got the opportunity to take it to a marketing stratosphere. Crossroads - lots of money - but is it rock and roll? No. Having a TV show, multiple facelifts, and sitting there on a mountain of money doesn't lead me to believe he's sincere about anything, in fact, he's a sellout. And that's fine - he's mackin' the bucks bigtime and has a bigass machine running for him and his trademarking. Yay. But his attitude in this clip isn't what got him where he is today - not a chance - those cats rocked hard, they had a schtick and it worked. But holding a VISA card with your face and band's name on it? That's not rock and roll, that's not where it all started, that's not the anti-authoritative, non-conformist, rebellious fervor that sparked a sonic revolution. Not a chance - that's just "going corporate" and doing the exact "opposite" of what made rock and roll, rock and roll.
I'll agree we need a little bit of a renaissance soon - you know - another wave of "something" - but R&R's not dead. The corporations responsible for doling this stuff out are responsible, and if big tits and throwing money on the street while rolling in a drop top benz is what sells records, that's not music, that's idolatry and idiocy. THAT is what the corporatists are selling - NOT the rebellious rocker, grunger, metaller, sludger, shoe-gazer... Not a fuckin' hope. And for those cats out there still true to their roots, I commend you - being at the crossroads ain't no easy decision. Hence the reason so many of our true iconic game-changing rockers died at such a young age - you know the names - they were TRUE to their craft and music... Once they got to the bigtime, it was no longer art, expression and passion - it was void of all artistry and just became a sterile assembly line of maximizing profit margins and selling image. Image has no sound.
Fuck Gene. He's a flake. He's plastic. And albeit he may be diggin' how far he's come, his credibility isn't what it once maybe was to me - hell from what I've heard every show KISS has put on in the last few years as been pre-recorded and lip-sync'd. If that's true - even if only fractionally - go fuck yourself. You're not a musician, you're a whore.
Have a nice night Folks
Mo
Badronald
New member
I'm confused.
Aren't we all self important?
Aren't we all self important?
jabps
Well-known member
Uh, yeah your pretty much off the mark here...I'd say if they were going to that much trouble they'd at least dub in a version of Paul's voice that wasn't shot.Ventura":10bmomk2 said:So I watched the clip.
hell from what I've heard every show KISS has put on in the last few years as been pre-recorded and lip-sync'd.
Have a nice night Folks
Mo
t-rex22
New member
Yuup. Interesting...joepete77":15xcwv6w said:
Agreed. Technology has really changed things.Ventura":15xcwv6w said:
YES. I LOVE the idea of directly supporting the artists. Its an added bonus to go to shows and buy t-shits knowing that it more directly helps support a career of making the music I love. I'll be rocking my Ocean t-shirt from this summers Summer Slaughter tour loud and proud in dwntwn LA in about 30 minutes. Robin Stapps handed it to me personally, chatted with me for 20 minutes, and may haveVentura":15xcwv6w said:
helped me sneak a flask into HoB. What a fucking awesome guy to go with the incredible new album. I'd send money to Germany right now to help fund their next album. On their facebook page, you'll see where my buddy and I brought the whole band dinner that night (sushi...). I stand by supporting my favorite bands whole-heartedly.I personally think record companies could do more to align the interests (and money) of the fans with the artists and still get their fair cut. I'd pay a ton of money just to hang out, chat gear, drink a beer, and listen/play some music with my favorite bands. Understood that's hard to organize and moderate...but its an idea, particularly for the smaller bands. How about a kickstarter for our favorite band's next album? Or buying into demo videos, jams, interviews, deeper supporting content, etc? This is just off-the-cuff here, but I think you could come up with a ton of ideas. I listen to a lot of metal and it kills me to think it might be a dying breed. Im a clean cut guy and I work a professional job in a cubicle but when I get off work I wanna listen to and play some fucking heavy metal now until I retire. I've got the will...theres gotta be a way.
Parting words - as my fave guitarist said in an interview recently, "Look, there's no money in metal, but at least the kids haven't figured out how to download t-shirts"
Oh gawd.Badronald":15xcwv6w said:
stephen sawall
SEMI ERECT MEMBER
Entertainment is a business ..... Sure there is always going to be place for rock. But that is also true of blues & classical & various other types of music. The only place rock is actually making any amount of money is now called young country. Whatever is actually making the big money is the form of entertainment that is most valid in whatever era. Rock has been dead a long time now .... it's never coming back. Listening to rock now is like listening to WWII big band swing in the late 60's. Sure some people did it - but it was a thing of the past - not the future.
Badronald
New member
t-rex22":v65prrfi said:Yuup. Interesting...joepete77":v65prrfi said:
Agreed. Technology has really changed things.Ventura":v65prrfi said:
YES. I LOVE the idea of directly supporting the artists. Its an added bonus to go to shows and buy t-shits knowing that it more directly helps support a career of making the music I love. I'll be rocking my Ocean t-shirt from this summers Summer Slaughter tour loud and proud in dwntwn LA in about 30 minutes. Robin Stapps handed it to me personally, chatted with me for 20 minutes, and may haveVentura":v65prrfi said:
I personally think record companies could do more to align the interests (and money) of the fans with the artists and still get their fair cut. I'd pay a ton of money just to hang out, chat gear, drink a beer, and listen/play some music with my favorite bands. Understood that's hard to organize and moderate...but its an idea, particularly for the smaller bands. How about a kickstarter for our favorite band's next album? Or buying into demo videos, jams, interviews, deeper supporting content, etc? This is just off-the-cuff here, but I think you could come up with a ton of ideas. I listen to a lot of metal and it kills me to think it might be a dying breed. Im a clean cut guy and I work a professional job in a cubicle but when I get off work I wanna listen to and play some fucking heavy metal now until I retire. I've got the will...theres gotta be a way.
Parting words - as my fave guitarist said in an interview recently, "Look, there's no money in metal, but at least the kids haven't figured out how to download t-shirts"
Oh gawd.Badronald":v65prrfi said:
Huh. Just about everybody I know is. Do I like it. No, but that's the way it is these days.
Shark Diver
New member
Badronald":18yuu58t said:
Some more than others
(not directed at you)
It's stupid to blame illegal downloading. Hip Hop and Lady Gaga have survived it. It's an argument designed for misdirection from the corporate attempt at controlling the industry ($) and spoon feeding us formulated music that has no artistic value - hence no staying power. And Gene is just a cog in that wheel. How many bands do you think he supports that don't do exactly what he says?
Badronald
New member
Shark Diver":uunrlusw said:Badronald":uunrlusw said:
Some more than others
(not directed at you)
It's stupid to blame illegal downloading. Hip Hop and Lady Gaga have survived it. It's an argument designed for misdirection from the corporate attempt at controlling the industry ($) and spoon feeding us formulated music that has no artistic value - hence no staying power. And Gene is just a cog in that wheel. How many bands do you think he supports that don't do exactly what he says?
Yup. They've pushed garbage for years. It's no surprise to me that the music industry is bleeding red. One original band comes out, labels push 20 copy bands just behind the original band and wonder why they continue to fail.
I for one couldn't be happier the record labels are going out of business. They have been raping real artists for years. It's a good thing. It's time for them to go.
S
satannica
New member
Sorry, Gene is just spot on here.
There is no way to break through the mire today. There is nothing new, save for the last few Scandinavian bands just about peeking their heads up just above the water line.
Rock and metal was always the poor relation of the industry. The "fat cats" to abuse the rather hoary term never wanted rock or metal stars. They didn't understand the market, they didn't understand the scene, they couldn't figure out the advertising. The fact is, when your lifestyle is rock and metal - and let's face it, anyone who is over 30 and has a wall full of metal CDs, it's a lifestyle - understands the scene and knows what's real and what's not. In the rather epic Phil Anselmo line any rocker "...can spot a pathetic without even asking."
The fact is, when downloading came alone, any of those poor relation who, OK made some money with clever advertising and at least one person on the management team with their heads screwed on, could actually make enough to survive long enough to album 3. None of these were driving dumper trucks of money around though yes some were (Kiss, et al). However, the fact is the recorded product is the single major lifeline any band has to bring in revenue. It's the straight truth. You can't organize a world tour, you can't buy merchandise to sell, you can't advertise yourselves or get paid reviews and you sure as fuck can't get the entire band from one end of the country to the other if you have invested in recording a record and have everyone frankly download it en masse leaving you with not a pot to piss in.
This is the very problem with music today. Sure there are tons of local acts who, lets be honest, most are pure thoroughbred shit. The one that's worth a cheaply printed "local band local audience" shirt sale are the ones who have it the toughest. If they're good enough and in demand enough, one day they will be in that situation where they have the ability to branch out and get on the better shows. But with nothing but debt lying around because everyone is stealing your product, there's only one thing that's going to happen... and does happen on a more regular basis than you can imagine!
What's the flipside? Well, do you honestly think the "fat cats" are in any way crying about any of this? Do you think the top guys at Universal have a single complaint? Not really, all downloading has done is demolish all those subgenres that were too messy to bother worrying about in the first place; all those confusing lifestyle type genres that they really had no idea how to market but the few dollars they did bring back into the machine couldn't be completely ignored so you get some scenesters on the payroll to "develop" those markets I guess...
Now those pesky low-end subgenres are struggling to stay up for air, they can now market their brand-based product placement musical acts all over the place, completely glossing over the historical crusades of the subgenre forefathers. Now these are as sure as dead, in some cases quite literally, there's nobody with any hope of replacing them - none that would gain any particular market hold anyway and even if they did, they could be bought for a peanuts and dissolved - they can continue manufacturing marketable music and branding it like so many Miley Cyrus brand hot pants.
What about the record revenue? Who cares. You think the industry hasn't already evolved? It has! By manufacturing starlets and selling their bullshit fantasy lives to young people through tasty beverages and other snacks loaded with chemicals to give you weird shaped man-tits, they can sell their carcasses to any news-media highlight. Fuck, the money's just pouring in. Who cares about selling records, especially when you consider the still small sums that come in from iTunes and other legitimate sources.
It's all a con. If you're a rocker, metaller and you're wondering why there's no new decent music, why anything new is just so fucking fake and formulaic and are now wondering why all these old farts are putting tours back together to make retirement money (looking at you Motorhead, Iron Maiden, Ugly Kid Joe), then blame yourselves. Hell, I can't fault the reasonings for old bands to get their retirement pensions in order through regurgitating their 80s/90s hits or classic choonz, but let's just be honest about it. Fuck it, I'll still go see Iron Maiden when they come round, but I'm under no illusions what a 60 year old hammering out Number of the Beast is after - and I have nothing against it. But, there are so many bands out there that are getting trodden on without even being given a chance to survive. A direct result of downloading is the falsification of a scene which, if your life has revolved around it like so many before you, surely you must have at least noticed?
And don't buy the recantations from these tired, hackneyed old cunts - looking at you Dave Grohl! All this bollocks defending downloaders and saying how it's not a problem. You know what? Fuck you and your fat wife! You made your money in the 90s from the very mechanism that you talk shit about. People bought your CDs in droves, this enabled you to engage in the chain reaction of popularization - magazine write-ups, merchandise, touring, ooh look more budget to record again, etc. Your pull-the-ladder-up mentality is disgusting and given their roots are just the same as ours, it's almost like betraying the very scenes that made you what you are.
The fact is, the music industry is pushing garbage right now. Why? There is no scene, we've laid all the would-be artists who would create incredible works to waste. All these guys who had something genuine, something brutal, something only those like them, those whose lives revolved around metal would even slightly understand - all those guys couldn't make it an inch out the door due to digital theft! Simple as that. So these guys hung it up, got married, had kids and left that game to the manufactured assholes who now churn out any old shit conceived by an industry who don't know the market, don't know how to tick that box and don't get it!
Enjoy the new world of rock and metal. It's fucked. And to agree with Gene Simmons, the fans fucked it up for themselves!
There is no way to break through the mire today. There is nothing new, save for the last few Scandinavian bands just about peeking their heads up just above the water line.
Rock and metal was always the poor relation of the industry. The "fat cats" to abuse the rather hoary term never wanted rock or metal stars. They didn't understand the market, they didn't understand the scene, they couldn't figure out the advertising. The fact is, when your lifestyle is rock and metal - and let's face it, anyone who is over 30 and has a wall full of metal CDs, it's a lifestyle - understands the scene and knows what's real and what's not. In the rather epic Phil Anselmo line any rocker "...can spot a pathetic without even asking."
The fact is, when downloading came alone, any of those poor relation who, OK made some money with clever advertising and at least one person on the management team with their heads screwed on, could actually make enough to survive long enough to album 3. None of these were driving dumper trucks of money around though yes some were (Kiss, et al). However, the fact is the recorded product is the single major lifeline any band has to bring in revenue. It's the straight truth. You can't organize a world tour, you can't buy merchandise to sell, you can't advertise yourselves or get paid reviews and you sure as fuck can't get the entire band from one end of the country to the other if you have invested in recording a record and have everyone frankly download it en masse leaving you with not a pot to piss in.
This is the very problem with music today. Sure there are tons of local acts who, lets be honest, most are pure thoroughbred shit. The one that's worth a cheaply printed "local band local audience" shirt sale are the ones who have it the toughest. If they're good enough and in demand enough, one day they will be in that situation where they have the ability to branch out and get on the better shows. But with nothing but debt lying around because everyone is stealing your product, there's only one thing that's going to happen... and does happen on a more regular basis than you can imagine!
What's the flipside? Well, do you honestly think the "fat cats" are in any way crying about any of this? Do you think the top guys at Universal have a single complaint? Not really, all downloading has done is demolish all those subgenres that were too messy to bother worrying about in the first place; all those confusing lifestyle type genres that they really had no idea how to market but the few dollars they did bring back into the machine couldn't be completely ignored so you get some scenesters on the payroll to "develop" those markets I guess...
Now those pesky low-end subgenres are struggling to stay up for air, they can now market their brand-based product placement musical acts all over the place, completely glossing over the historical crusades of the subgenre forefathers. Now these are as sure as dead, in some cases quite literally, there's nobody with any hope of replacing them - none that would gain any particular market hold anyway and even if they did, they could be bought for a peanuts and dissolved - they can continue manufacturing marketable music and branding it like so many Miley Cyrus brand hot pants.
What about the record revenue? Who cares. You think the industry hasn't already evolved? It has! By manufacturing starlets and selling their bullshit fantasy lives to young people through tasty beverages and other snacks loaded with chemicals to give you weird shaped man-tits, they can sell their carcasses to any news-media highlight. Fuck, the money's just pouring in. Who cares about selling records, especially when you consider the still small sums that come in from iTunes and other legitimate sources.
It's all a con. If you're a rocker, metaller and you're wondering why there's no new decent music, why anything new is just so fucking fake and formulaic and are now wondering why all these old farts are putting tours back together to make retirement money (looking at you Motorhead, Iron Maiden, Ugly Kid Joe), then blame yourselves. Hell, I can't fault the reasonings for old bands to get their retirement pensions in order through regurgitating their 80s/90s hits or classic choonz, but let's just be honest about it. Fuck it, I'll still go see Iron Maiden when they come round, but I'm under no illusions what a 60 year old hammering out Number of the Beast is after - and I have nothing against it. But, there are so many bands out there that are getting trodden on without even being given a chance to survive. A direct result of downloading is the falsification of a scene which, if your life has revolved around it like so many before you, surely you must have at least noticed?
And don't buy the recantations from these tired, hackneyed old cunts - looking at you Dave Grohl! All this bollocks defending downloaders and saying how it's not a problem. You know what? Fuck you and your fat wife! You made your money in the 90s from the very mechanism that you talk shit about. People bought your CDs in droves, this enabled you to engage in the chain reaction of popularization - magazine write-ups, merchandise, touring, ooh look more budget to record again, etc. Your pull-the-ladder-up mentality is disgusting and given their roots are just the same as ours, it's almost like betraying the very scenes that made you what you are.
The fact is, the music industry is pushing garbage right now. Why? There is no scene, we've laid all the would-be artists who would create incredible works to waste. All these guys who had something genuine, something brutal, something only those like them, those whose lives revolved around metal would even slightly understand - all those guys couldn't make it an inch out the door due to digital theft! Simple as that. So these guys hung it up, got married, had kids and left that game to the manufactured assholes who now churn out any old shit conceived by an industry who don't know the market, don't know how to tick that box and don't get it!
Enjoy the new world of rock and metal. It's fucked. And to agree with Gene Simmons, the fans fucked it up for themselves!