Getting a good base line sound in DAW

BigGuitars

BigGuitars

Active member
This question is for the guys who record with vst plugins. I’m wondering how you guys run your setup for a good baseline recorded tone? I’m using Fortin Cali Suite, which is nice, but I cannot seem to produce a very inspiring recorded sound. I know nothing about mixing/mastering. I have zero knowledge and training on this. I’m trying to write and record an album on my own. Can someone please help me with some baseline tips? Thanks.
 
There is no baseline. Watch YouTube videos on 'how to dial in an amp' and 'amp sweet spots'.

Guitars in the mix sound very different from guitars out of the mix. What sounds great on its own can sound not so great in a mix. This is a trial and error process and it takes a long time to find something satisfactory. Often guitarists have to increase their mids for a mix. A scooped (on 0) mids sounds good on its own for metal but not in a mix for example.

If you are covering a song then you should really aim for that guitarist's rig setup. You read about the guitarist's rig online and then copy it digitally to start with. Get Bias FX2 and it will offer you more options than Fortin for tones.

You can get there for now by introducing an EQ stage in your DAW and shaping whatever you record but it's far better to be near that shape at the start. Fortin products like Cali Suite are for high-gain tones and I find pretty specific depending on what one you get.

Try dialing back your gain a bit and also go through each EQ very slowly.
 
Most DAWS will have an EQ section for each track... those EQ sections often provide suggested EQ curves/settings, e.g., lead, rhythm, clean guitar, some for piano, some for drums and bass, etc. It helps to get each instrument in its own frequency range, so that the instruments sound apart from one another. I'm not sure if that helps, but I find it makes a difference in getting a good mix.
 
BigGuitars said:
This question is for the guys who record with vst plugins. I’m wondering how you guys run your setup for a good baseline recorded tone? I’m using Fortin Cali Suite, which is nice, but I cannot seem to produce a very inspiring recorded sound. I know nothing about mixing/mastering. I have zero knowledge and training on this. I’m trying to write and record an album on my own. Can someone please help me with some baseline tips? Thanks.
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Which DAW program? Most of the good ones will have excellent user tutorial guides.

Run through the Fortin Cali presets and find one closest to what you're aiming for.
That's a good shortcut starting point.

Also, what is your signal chain into the DAW?
 
Really, the biggest problem with mixing and dialing in sounds isn't usually the gear or the engineer. The biggest problem to overcome is the reference situation. The reference monitors and listening environment have to be balanced to really get an idea of what you have. Getting your room dialed in to be able to hear everything properly is difficult, and if you haven't tuned your room, dialing anything in can be hindered by anomalies in the room. Phase cancelation is a thing.
 
With VSTs most of the hard work is already done for you - it certainly isn't micing a live amp.

Plus there are a ton of tutorials on YouTube reddit etc.

What exactly is wrong with the tones you're getting?
 
I think there is indeed a baseline.

Make sure your guitar is in best shape. Foam behind the nut, electronics in good shape. In tune and intonated.

Use a DI box always and be sure the hardest you are going to play your guitar comes in at -6DB to allow for the headroom for the mixing process.

As far as a good tone. A GREAT interface and/or mic pres. The rest is in your fingers.

You really just want the cleanest and strongest signal possible. If you're going to mix and master yourself without being good at it, it may not come out as good as you wish.

Im not good at recording and dont have the proper gear needed but these are definitely a few baselines.


I've never used the Cali suite but when I did use VSTs I would always get a better sound by using TWO Cab irs instead of one. Also choosing the right IR was critical for me, YMMV.

It is possible to get amazing quality from VSTs but it will probably take a lot of work and practice. Those guys getting those sounds are pros.
 
BeZo said:
The biggest problem to overcome is the reference situation. The reference monitors and listening environment have to be balanced to really get an idea of what you have.
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100%. This is why I mentioned a Cali preset.
Another way to do it is put an MP3 or WAV file of a song with your goal guitar tones
on an adjacent track to what you're using to record yourself on.
Get your monitors/headphones whatever sounding good with that song since you're already
familiar with it.
Now you can move on to tweaking your VST track to match.

Bottom Line: Don't use your first attempts at recording to judge how your monitors/room sounds!
 
In my experience NO PLUG sounds like a well recorded amp or a nice analog preamp, designed for the job, going D.I.
A lot of people ask me how do I get my recorded tones... the answer is always the same:
-guitar thru TECH21 PSA-1 preamp running balanced D.I. thru a Mackie mixer with hardware efx in parallel.
The mixer dives into an Eventide H8000FW as FireWire audio interface to my PC or Mac...
The PSA-1 is an amazing piece of great sounding analog tones! And cheap!
 
It is a long route and a lot of exploring. I have started 6 months ago looking into my own production and it's slow progress, huge effort. Watching videos does not work. Your play style, production, guitar, pickups - it all matters. Therefore following videos step by step hoping you would achieve the same result at least for me that never works. Say I would use Neural DSP Gojira for my guitar tone. Since I'm using a prs custom in drop B I am getting an absolutely different result in raw tone recorded. This means my tone capture is different and everything else down the line is different.

Also as mentioned by others - mix ready tones are different from those you are generally used to. You'll have to start with basics of drum programming, decide how you want to approach bass (eurobass or record->process via plugins), how to get your base guitar tone sit right at the beginning. and then days of understanding how to EQ, compress, work in the box and treat the project as whole.

Also a big big big thing - editing. You have to be a super tight player if you are double/quad tracking. Or else learn how to edit. You need to spend a lot of time to make sure your both L and R tracks match well enough that your tone is working in synergy. If your L track is early and R is late, if your rhythm is off all of this will create a phase issue which will suck the tone out of your total guitar mix. I had been hunting for the best of tones in DAW only to realize I have to clean things up before I move to processing. My tone improved just by cleaning things up. Also in relationship to other instruments. Bass is particularly difficult to get right. Super important. Your relationship between bass and kick drum. Not just in terms of tone but ensuring that they are aligned with rhythm and spot on.

In regards to reference - yes and no. I've been getting some great results using my headphones Beyerdynamic DT990 pro. You do not need expensive monitors. I have a pair of kali lp6 at home but I would have to get a dedicated room to get the most out of them (positioning in room etc.)

Also listen with your ears and not with your eyes. If it sounds good it sounds good.
 
italoop said:
In my experience NO PLUG sounds like a well recorded amp or a nice analog preamp, designed for the job, going D.I.
A lot of people ask me how do I get my recorded tones... the answer is always the same:
-guitar thru TECH21 PSA-1 preamp running balanced D.I. thru a Mackie mixer with hardware efx in parallel.
The mixer dives into an Eventide H8000FW as FireWire audio interface to my PC or Mac...
The PSA-1 is an amazing piece of great sounding analog tones! And cheap!
Click to expand...
I love Tech 21 amps and pedals, always have!
 
This is good stuff fellas! Im really intrested in getting into plugins/Amp-sims to use at home for just noodling around. I am really digging what I am hearing on the Nueral and JST plugins for high gain metal tones. I am looking at a UA lightening audio interface and a set of new Kali IN-8 V2's. Will 8 inch monitors be overkill in a 10x14 ft room (8ft ceiling)? Would a powered subwoofer improve the tone of 8 inch monitors by relieving them of sub lows? Thanks! Shred On.
 
I have the IN-8s in a similar sized room. I don't think it's overkill, as sometimes I like it fairly loud, other times not. However, I'm not an audiophile to provide a better answer. Maybe there's something about pushing the speakers and smaller being better for a smaller room. I've seen studios with very small speakers, and others with larger, so it may have to do with preferences.
 
Shredsmcgee said:
This is good stuff fellas! Im really intrested in getting into plugins/Amp-sims to use at home for just noodling around. I am really digging what I am hearing on the Nueral and JST plugins for high gain metal tones. I am looking at a UA lightening audio interface and a set of new Kali IN-8 V2's. Will 8 inch monitors be overkill in a 10x14 ft room (8ft ceiling)? Would a powered subwoofer improve the tone of 8 inch monitors by relieving them of sub lows? Thanks! Shred On.
Click to expand...
See post above.
 
BigGuitars said:
This question is for the guys who record with vst plugins. I’m wondering how you guys run your setup for a good baseline recorded tone? I’m using Fortin Cali Suite, which is nice, but I cannot seem to produce a very inspiring recorded sound. I know nothing about mixing/mastering. I have zero knowledge and training on this. I’m trying to write and record an album on my own. Can someone please help me with some baseline tips? Thanks.
Click to expand...
Start with NO reverb, space, room, or delay of any sort or type. That was a big eye-opener for me with DI recording - gave my tone the immediacy I'd heard on so many polished and produced CDs of all my fave guitarists and bands. Not sure if that helps.

Next up - lower the gain. WAY low.

It's all I got.
 
Ventura said:
Start with NO reverb, space, room, or delay of any sort or type. That was a big eye-opener for me with DI recording - gave my tone the immediacy I'd heard on so many polished and produced CDs of all my fave guitarists and bands. Not sure if that helps.

Next up - lower the gain. WAY low.

It's all I got.
Click to expand...
Coming from a guy who just sent this from a tropical island he's stuck on.... LOL
 
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