Guitar techs - Can I intonate my guitar using my TU-2?

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Lord Toneking

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What do you guys use? My TU-2 seems to fluxuate alot and not ever seem to match my fretted note at the 12th fret when I use it. I can get it close but it's never perfect like when I'm tuning open strings

Any tips??
 
I have an old conn strobe tuner that is killer, the tu-2 is a medioric tuner at best IMO
 
You can use any tuner to intonate your guitar, but the results will vary. The better the tuner, the better the result. If the TU2 is able to pick up that the guitar isn't properly intonated, you should be able to use it for improving the intonation, even though it might not end in a perfect result. I've used all kinds of tuners for this application myself, and I typically end up with an equal result no matter how good the tuner is as I tend to get bored and give up before it's perfect anyways.
 
A strobe tuner is really the only way to go if you're really splitting hairs, but I intonate my guitars with stomp tuners, then maybe a few little tweaks by ear...no one has made any complaints. I usually get frustrated with strobe tuners because they are TOO accurate and the wheels will react differently one note. Every time you hit a string on a guitar it starts off sharp and eventually settles as the string rings and the wheel reacts to this; so if you got a guy who hits strings hard or if they have a heavy left hand, they can pull a guitar more out of tune than intonating with a regular tuner. There are a lot of variables with intonantion...
 
HeimBrent":2ccu7vdu said:
You can use any tuner to intonate your guitar, but the results will vary. The better the tuner, the better the result. If the TU2 is able to pick up that the guitar isn't properly intonated, you should be able to use it for improving the intonation, even though it might not end in a perfect result. I've used all kinds of tuners for this application myself, and I typically end up with an equal result no matter how good the tuner is as I tend to get bored and give up before it's perfect anyways.
Yeah, I check it and get it intonated to where it matches the open string in tune then re-check it and it's off a bit. Not sure what to think :confused:
 
I wouldn't recommend it. The TU2 doesn't track quickly or accurately enough, IMO for intonation. Works good enough on stage, but I'd spring for something quicker and more accurate like the Turbo Tuner or Strobostomp for setting the intonation.
 
"Intonated" is subjective, IMO, although obvious when out. I've used strobe tuners to do it, it's perfect according to the tuner but still sounds out a bit. I use the tuner to get it as close as possible, but still use my ear to tweak it. Some guys need it set differently than others due to where they spend most of their time on the fret board.

But, what do I know :doh:
 
The biggest issue when setting intonation is tuner accuracy.

The TU-2 has +/- 3 cents (not too good)
Turbo Tuner has +/- .02 cents (big difference)
Peterson's Strobo Stomp has 0.1 cents (30% more accurate than LED or needle tuners they say)


I went a little overkill and bought a Peterson rackmount strobe tuner a few years ago and it is no doubt one of the best gear purchase I've ever made.
 
Kaleiwahea":c0t3509a said:
"Intonated" is subjective, IMO, although obvious when out. I've used strobe tuners to do it, it's perfect according to the tuner but still sounds out a bit. I use the tuner to get it as close as possible, but still use my ear to tweak it. Some guys need it set differently than others due to where they spend most of their time on the fret board.

But, what do I know :doh:

Haha, yeah I know that. I used to use a Peterson stroborack but due to the fact I retired the whole rackthing I bought a Turbotuner. When I started using that my ears weren't happy so I recalibrated the TT to where it meets the Stroboracksettings and now I'm happy again.

Strange if you think about it. I assumed there was one and only one "best" tempered tuning but aparently there are more (for my specific situation).

Giga
 
A strobe tuner is the best way......other tuners just are not accurate enough.
 
From the Peterson website:

Play two pure sine wave tones together, one at 440 Hz (440 cycles per second), one at 441 Hz. The clash you will hear is the one sound beating against (alternately reinforcing and canceling) the other. The repetition of this beating occurs at the difference in frequency of the original tones (441 - 440), which is 1.0 Hz or once every second. This level of out-of-tuneness is already plenty noticeable, but we don't want to be accused of stacking the deck in our favor, so let's use these numbers.

How does this relate to cents scaling? Actually it is a little complicated because the cents difference of the tones depends not only on the difference in frequency but on the size of the frequencies themselves. For this example, at 440 Hz, the cents difference is about 3.9 cents.

So, any tuner that can get you 4 cent (actually ±2 cent) accuracy should be fine, right? Well there's more to it. First, even though almost any tuner these days can have an internal accuracy at this level or greater, what is important to you is the accuracy you can reliably and quickly see on the display. Other tuning display systems generally do not give good results-or usually any results-within about ±3 cents.

But there is still more! Remember, cents scaling changes with the size of the frequencies themselves. If you are so picky that you need your High A (at 880 Hz) to be in tune with everything else (good musicians are funny that way!), any beat frequencies produced must still be below the 1 Hz-once a second-level. This already requires twice the cent accuracy as before or ±1 cents!!
Will it ever end? Not just yet!! We don't generally spend our time listening to laboratory-perfect sine waves (well, we have to sometimes, but we don't recommend it). Real musical tones include a unique and often extended series of overtones (additional sine waves at multiples of the pitch frequency) that gives each sound its timbre or character. Even a flute, which is considered to be relatively pure, has five or more overtones which are significant enough that, if any were to be artificially removed, would leave the tone noticeably wanting. In instruments ranging from guitar-especially with even a touch of over-drive distortion-to woodwinds and brass, overtones at 10 or 15 times the pitch frequency can be significant. This has a huge impact on the human ability to detect tuning.

To take an easy example, an electric guitar string usually has plenty of power in its fourth overtone (and beyond). In our previous example, tuning two strings-one at 440 Hz, one at 441 Hz would sound much worse than the sine wave case. This is because the audible overtones also beat and the frequency of these beats increase along with the frequencies of the overtones. To take a conservative example, the 4th overtone of the 440 Hz tone would be at approximately 2200 Hz and that of the 441 Hz tone would be at 2205 Hz. This makes a beat frequency of 5 Hz or 5 times a second: HORRID! To make these tones sound even reasonably good together, we should make sure that these overtones beat at less than the original "once every second". This will require the fundamental pitches to be tuned to 440 and 440.2 Hz. What's the cents accuracy required now? It's 0.78 cents or ±0.39 cents!
And what about the fact that the 1 Hz beat level that we used in the calculations is really much worse than what anyone with fleshy ears (as opposed to the tin type) would consider to be "in tune"?
And what about accounting for even higher overtones?
And playing higher notes?

And the fact that your tuning will drift with the pressure changes of your thumb in different guitar chord positions or the warmth of your breath into your horn as you play?

At least if you start at "real" 0.1 cent accuracy, you will be able to maintain satisfactory tuning through a few songs!
_______________

When you account for the more accurate starting pitch; to which you then adjust intonation--, it can become VERY apparent when playing with other instruments which are actually playing in tune, like strings, horns, or keyboards, that although you may have intonated the guitar to itself-- it's still out, because the starting pitch wasn't accurate to begin with...
 
NO! Peterson or turbo tuner. Strobe is a must with the hundreth of a cent accuracy.
 
kurtsstuff":22w2yqtl said:
Intonation is for pussy's.... :D

I like pussies... :lol: :LOL:

Intonation as important, if not even more important, then being in tune I'd say. Especially if you are the only guitarist in the band. Nothing sounds worse then striking a chord and hearing it be out of tune with itself.
 
I use an old beat to shit tuner... Some semi-digital-LED thing. If it doesn't track the harmonic on the 12th fret, I place my finger on the string at the 12th fret with 'typical playing pressure' (this is key, in that most of the time I AM playing the guitar and pressure IS applied to the strings, which DOES change the tuning ever-so-yet-substantially-slightly!!).

If y'all wants to split hairs over the topic, sure, go for this:
http://www.truetemperament.com/site/index.php

But for me, it's a matter of just getting the job done and not fussing too much about it...

V. :dunno:
 
Buy a strobe tuner and intonate your guitar. The TU2 sucks for tuning your guitar on stage compared to some of the other tuners on the market. Setting your intonation with a TU2 is like trying to knock down a brick building with a baseball tied to a sting. It doesn't matter how hard you try.
 
the tu-2 is old tech. intonation with it is pointless, strobe or nothing
 
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