Guitars that seem inherently too "slinky"

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Bardagh

Bardagh

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Have you ever had one of these? I can't ever figure out what the deal is when you have a guitar that just seems to lack proper tension. You can straighten the neck out, raise the action, use heavier strings, and at some point it will of course stiffen up, but the compromises made in terms of action and playability are ridiculous.

I have had this Gibson Explorer for a long time, and it is a great sounding guitar but it is one of these where there just always seems to be too much slop in the wound strings. On an open note, the way the 6th string oscillates is ridiculous and it will buzz on the frets in the middle of the neck as a result. I'm not talking about nailing the thing with my fret hand either. I mean unless I'm just tickling the thing it's going wild. To tune the thing down a half step I have to put a 11-52 set on it for it feel somewhat close to how my Les Paul feels with 10-46. I've had the thing professionally set up, set it up myself all kinds of different ways, but it just seems to be this inherent thing with the guitar.

I have had some others over the years that had a similar thing going on and while it isn't a deal-breaker and in fact can make lead playing and vibrato actually quite nice, it drives me nuts to play heavy rhythms. But what I want to know is what causes it, because I have exhausted all the things you can easily adjust on a guitar in my attempts to change it, and it seems crazy that I would have to start approaching standard 7 string gauges to try and say, tune down to D.
 
Is it the same 24.75 scale like your LPs? What string brand/model are you using?

One of my guitars is a Carvin 25.0 scale tuned to Eb, and I use the Ultra Slinky 10-48 sets with that.
 
Dude I have absolutely noticed this, similar guitars, same scale length, and strings just don’t have the same tension. and i have other guitar buddys that notice it too. I’ve never heard an answer, so curious to see if anyone knows.
 
It’s gotta be the action. The tension will be consistent for the same scale at same pitch. I mean, maybe the neck is thicker and that affects perception?
 
I believe the string break angle over the bridge might be different on certain models.
I don't think the bridge of an Explorer sits as high above the body as the one on most Les Pauls, for instance.
That would mean the Explorer tailpiece isn't as low relative to the bridge - so, a less acute break angle.
Haven't actually measured them but that's my impression.
 
Which model Explorer is it? Can you share a pic? I don't have any recommendations but I like explorers.
 
This is a bog standard 2006 Explorer. I basically have to have a lot of relief in the neck (.10-.12) for it to seem happy and it has nothing to do with the frets or anything like that. Now, I’m not really bothered by that amount of relief on this guitar it’s just more being mystified by not being able to understand what makes the difference.

Other guitars I’ve had over the years that had a similar feel were all hardtails of one type or other. I can think of a 7 string Horizon that had a string through body and TOM bridge that I had a lot of trouble with because that low B was just intolerably loose, and a Schecter with a hipshot hardtail that was not as bad but still seemed extra slinky. Both of those were 25.5” scale.
 
The slinkier the better IMO. Sounds like you got a unicorn. I would def be hanging on to that puppy. I try to set my guitars up to be as slinky as possible so you are describing a problem for you that seems like an ideal situation to me. I have had enough tight guitars in my life. I always hunt for a guitar that can give max ease of bending.
 
VonBonfire said:
The slinkier the better IMO. Sounds like you got a unicorn. I would def be hanging on to that puppy. I try to set my guitars up to be as slinky as possible so you are describing a problem for you that seems like an ideal situation to me.
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This. I have the opposite problem with one of my guitars where the tension is too high and I haven't been able to figure out why :(
 
I’ve noticed this with F style guitars in particular. I prefer slinky and have not been able to decrease the apparent tension- I just end up selling them.

Wish I knew the root cause of this. Only thing that really makes sense is that while the scale length spec is the same, it doesn’t end up being true in actuality and the higher tension ones have an ever so slightly longer scale length?
 
Bending on the Explorer is extra nice and easy and fluid, that is true, but this is a super heavy sounding guitar tonally that I'd like to use for rhythm playing on some metal stuff but I just get too much buzz going on. Frets all seem pretty level and everything too, although I have had to have them leveled a couple times because of the heavy strings I have to use and me tending to have a pretty heavy fretting hand.

As far as different guitar types I would agree that Fender style guitars in general always seem to have more tension to me. I tend to run 9-46 sets on them if I need to do a lot of bending up high, and if need to tune down a half step I'll bump it up to 10-48. I never use a 9-42 set ever on anything.
 
For me, it's always neck angle. My fav guitars have this super easy playability; like a fav pair of jeans. They just feel right. When I have a guitar that feels stiff, or fights me I'll try to change the neck angle just a touch, and most of the time it works..the guitar becomes more 'slinky' like you say. All I do is grab a business card, loosen up the nut, then the 4 neck screws and slide the card down to the bottom of the pocket. Just that small card thickness changes the neck angle enough that I notice a difference. It just affects the first point of contact with the neck heel/pocket and not the whole length of the neck pocket. Works for me.
Obviously it won't work for set/neck through guitars though.
 
A good luthier would be able to figure it out quickly . I had a guitar that I couldn't get the neck right no matter what I tried so I brought it to a luthier to drop off and to call when he figured it out .

He looked at it as soon as I walked in and said I can see the problem already , he made a few adjustments right in front of me and handed it back and said try it now , I couldn't believe it, it was perfect .

No charge
 
ccn said:
A good luthier would be able to figure it out quickly . I had a guitar that I couldn't get the neck right no matter what I tried so I brought it to a luthier to drop off and to call when he figured it out .

He looked at it as soon as I walked in and said I can see the problem already , he made a few adjustments right in front of me and handed it back and said try it now , I couldn't believe it, it was perfect .

No charge
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What did he do?
 
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Bardagh said:
This is a bog standard 2006 Explorer. I basically have to have a lot of relief in the neck (.10-.12) for it to seem happy and it has nothing to do with the frets or anything like that. Now, I’m not really bothered by that amount of relief on this guitar it’s just more being mystified by not being able to understand what makes the difference.

Other guitars I’ve had over the years that had a similar feel were all hardtails of one type or other. I can think of a 7 string Horizon that had a string through body and TOM bridge that I had a lot of trouble with because that low B was just intolerably loose, and a Schecter with a hipshot hardtail that was not as bad but still seemed extra slinky. Both of those were 25.5” scale.
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.1mm relief? No wonder it's buzzing.

People measure things drastically differently from person to person. So there is that.
 
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