High Gain + Creambacks: G12H-75 vs G12M-65

[glip22]

The biggest thing with the Heritage H speakers is they take forever to break in but broken in they are excellent. I have a cab mixed with h75's and V-30's and no other combination I tried can touch it including the creambacks both M and H75's mixed with V 30's and on their own. Breaking in those Heritages is key. I mean they take forever. Maybe a couple hundred hours.
I found this out when I loaded another cab with the same combination and it didn't sound near as good.

 

[FourT6and2]

The biggest thing with the Heritage H speakers is they take forever to break in but broken in they are excellent. I have a cab mixed with h75's and V-30's and no other combination I tried can touch it including the creambacks both M and H75's mixed with V 30's and on their own. Breaking in those Heritages is key. I mean they take forever. Maybe a couple hundred hours.
I found this out when I loaded another cab with the same combination and it didn't sound near as good.

I think you have your speaker model names mixed up. There is no Heritage G12H-75. There is a Heritage G12H-30 (75Hz) model. Is that what you're talking about? You're saying you like that paired with a V30 more than the Creamback G12H-75, either by itself or paired with a V30 as well?

I have never been a fan of the actual G12H-30. Either Heritage or Anniversary. They are way too bright and harsh for me. They are tighter than a G12M-25, sure. But just too bright. I love the woody growl of the G12M-25. And they are great for high-gain with the right amp. My Chupacabra sounds godly with a 4x12 of Greenbacks.

I got a quad of the Creamback H75s. We shall see what all the fuss is about.

 

[Gsxrbusa]

I've had both, and I think you'd be happier with the 75s. The 75s have a bigger bottom and more sizzle in the highs. The 65s have smooth highs, tight bass, and a lot of upper-mid emphasis.

They're both great speakers, and I don't think you can go wrong with either, but for your purposes I think the 75s have an edge. Here's the best video I've come across comparing the two (I'm having trouble embedding it right now)
https://youtu.be/12lXMmU73Bo

That is a great video comparison.

I guess it wasn't in the same video and I was comparing the Neo Creamback which is suppose to sound exactly like the 65w so I've heard. This isn't scientific by any means But here they are. Not sure if this will help since it's the Neo vs 75w Cream.

Wow, great vid also... G12H-75 sounds pretty damn good to my ears... I swear after reading a few speaker threads I've suddenly developed some serious speaker GAS lol.. will it ever end?

Thanks man! I really do like both speakers but the H75 are more metal.

 

[glip22]

The biggest thing with the Heritage H speakers is they take forever to break in but broken in they are excellent. I have a cab mixed with h75's and V-30's and no other combination I tried can touch it including the creambacks both M and H75's mixed with V 30's and on their own. Breaking in those Heritages is key. I mean they take forever. Maybe a couple hundred hours.
I found this out when I loaded another cab with the same combination and it didn't sound near as good.

I think you have your speaker model names mixed up. There is no Heritage G12H-75. There is a Heritage G12H-30 (75Hz) model. Is that what you're talking about? You're saying you like that paired with a V30 more than the Creamback G12H-75, either by itself or paired with a V30 as well?

I have never been a fan of the actual G12H-30. Either Heritage or Anniversary. They are way too bright and harsh for me. They are tighter than a G12M-25, sure. But just too bright. I love the woody growl of the G12M-25. And they are great for high-gain with the right amp. My Chupacabra sounds godly with a 4x12 of Greenbacks.

I got a quad of the Creamback H75s. We shall see what all the fuss is about.

My bad, Yes the 75 hz cones.

 

[LPMojoGL]

Glad you went with the H75s. The M65 I had was warm, somewhat bland. The H75 has more going and records great. Plus, it mixes well with a V30 for a full, cutting but balanced sound. Hope you dig em!

 

[crwnedblasphemy]

I like the neo's in the clips. It has a bit more feel. The H's are tighter and chimey. Just my ear.

 

[fusedbrain]

I got a quad of the Creamback H75s. We shall see what all the fuss is about.

 

[FourT6and2]

Put the quad of G12H-75s in today and gave my new KSR Gemini a whirl through the cab.

Initial impressions are...

Fuck yes.

Angry. Tight low end. Snarly upper mids. Treble is not harsh at all, but it's a cutting, searing sound. I must have torqued the speakers down just right because there's that sort of semi-hollow lower mid range that is hard to explain. But I like it. Through the original speakers, it was I was fighting the amp. Now it's like the demon's been unleashed lol. Cliche as hell. But whatever. These might just overthrow the G12M-25 as my favorite speaker... I'll have to run my Chupacabra through this cab now to see.

One thing I did differently from any other cab I've had, though, is wiring it at 8 ohms. All my other cabs and speakers are 16. I don't know why. I've just always bought 16-ohm-speakers. But thought I'd give 8 ohm a try. I don't think that's the big thing about this setup, but I'm very happy!

 

[JerEvil]

I own and use both. I think they both do a good job of being a higher powered version of the respective greenback they are representing, 12M's for the M65 & H30's for H75. They are great mixed together or an M65 mixed with a V30 is also very cool.
The only issue I've had is when I used a pair of M65's together in a Bogner 2x12, I thought the bottom end was kinda loose and not really suited to heavier styles. Mixing in an H75 or a V30 with the M65 fixed the problem. An H75 with a V30 was too much for me in the upper mids / high end.
I've voiced the opinion before on here that I thought the 65's were too loose for metal, but others have dis-agreed, and I believe it was Jer-Evil who posted a vid using the 65's that sounded pretty good. For me, 2x65's in the Bogner OS with a Twin Jet or a 5150 was a mess. Not good at all.
If I was loading a 4x12, I'd probably go with a pair of each type of Creamback, but a 4x12 with 2x65's and 2xV30's would give you a similar vibe to a Friedman cab with higher power handling. I think either one would sound fantastic, but I would definitely shy away from using 4x M65's, especially if you already have a greenback cab.

Yeah that was me. I like the 65's for heavy stuff using my Splawn cabs. I used a mix of 65/75 IR's on my Friedman Buttersalx vid and thought that sounded rad actually.

Here's the Splawn

And the Deliverance 60

 

[FourT6and2]

That sounds awesome. Heavy!

I'm uploading a vid as we speak. Man, my laptop really doesn't pick up the low end of guitar amps very well, though. But I think it'll give everybody an idea.

 

[JerEvil]

That sounds awesome. Heavy!

I'm uploading a vid as we speak. Man, my laptop really doesn't pick up the low end of guitar amps very well, though. But I think it'll give everybody an idea.

Thanks man. I sometimes forget how great the Quick Rod really is! LOL!

 

[FourT6and2]

Clip: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=188908

Speakers are literally out of the box by like 10 minutes. So really need a few weeks on them to break in.

 

[sytharnia1560]

I made the mistake of getting the M65 when I got some creambacks. They did sound great but were a bit to mid rangey for me, should have gone with the H75's in hindsight

Hmm, well I love me some mids...

Compared to regular G12M-25 Greenbacks, do they have a similar mid-range? More? Less? Just different?

I swapped some greenbacks for the cream's and yeah I think they had very similar tone. The creams were a lot more "3D" sounding (seem to have more depth to them).

The biggest thing with the Heritage H speakers is they take forever to break in but broken in they are excellent. I have a cab mixed with h75's and V-30's and no other combination I tried can touch it including the creambacks both M and H75's mixed with V 30's and on their own. Breaking in those Heritages is key. I mean they take forever. Maybe a couple hundred hours.
I found this out when I loaded another cab with the same combination and it didn't sound near as good.

I think you have your speaker model names mixed up. There is no Heritage G12H-75. There is a Heritage G12H-30 (75Hz) model. Is that what you're talking about? You're saying you like that paired with a V30 more than the Creamback G12H-75, either by itself or paired with a V30 as well?

I have never been a fan of the actual G12H-30. Either Heritage or Anniversary. They are way too bright and harsh for me. They are tighter than a G12M-25, sure. But just too bright. I love the woody growl of the G12M-25. And they are great for high-gain with the right amp. My Chupacabra sounds godly with a 4x12 of Greenbacks.

I got a quad of the Creamback H75s. We shall see what all the fuss is about.

I always thought the H meant heavy magnet and the M was medium magnet??

 

[sytharnia1560]

Put the quad of G12H-75s in today and gave my new KSR Gemini a whirl through the cab.

Initial impressions are...

Fuck yes.

Angry. Tight low end. Snarly upper mids. Treble is not harsh at all, but it's a cutting, searing sound. I must have torqued the speakers down just right because there's that sort of semi-hollow lower mid range that is hard to explain. But I like it. Through the original speakers, it was I was fighting the amp. Now it's like the demon's been unleashed lol. Cliche as hell. But whatever. These might just overthrow the G12M-25 as my favorite speaker... I'll have to run my Chupacabra through this cab now to see.

One thing I did differently from any other cab I've had, though, is wiring it at 8 ohms. All my other cabs and speakers are 16. I don't know why. I've just always bought 16-ohm-speakers. But thought I'd give 8 ohm a try. I don't think that's the big thing about this setup, but I'm very happy!

you just confirmed the mistake I made ... oh well I love my G85's so will stick with those

the ohms thing makes no difference unless you are doing the mismatch thing (like running and 8ohm cab at 4 ohms at the head) then you can really hear differences, usually none sound as good as using the right ohms

 

[FourT6and2]

the ohms thing makes no difference unless you are doing the mismatch thing (like running and 8ohm cab at 4 ohms at the head) then you can really hear differences, usually none sound as good as using the right ohms

That's not entirely accurate. 16 ohm load from 16 ohm amp output = full winding of the output transformer. 8 ohm load from 8 ohm tap = half of the out put transformer's winding. So that will yield a sonic difference. 16 ohm = more dynamic range in terms of lows and highs. 8 ohm = less dynamic range, but thicker and slightly tighter tracking (in my experience and others).

 

[sytharnia1560]

the ohms thing makes no difference unless you are doing the mismatch thing (like running and 8ohm cab at 4 ohms at the head) then you can really hear differences, usually none sound as good as using the right ohms

That's not entirely accurate. 16 ohm load from 16 ohm amp output = full winding of the output transformer. 8 ohm load from 8 ohm tap = half of the out put transformer's winding. So that will yield a sonic difference. 16 ohm = more dynamic range in terms of lows and highs. 8 ohm = less dynamic range, but thicker and slightly tighter tracking (in my experience and others).

yeah ok you are right but the amp really needs to be cranking to notice much difference really and even then a lot of people can't really tell.....well in my experience anyway

 

[Nuclear Shredder]

Oh man, this is what I am struggling with now.
I just ordered a Suhr SE-100, and I am looking for a cab.
I am thinking a Friedman with a G12m and V30 mix.
Or, a EVH with greenbacks.
Or, trying to get something from Suhr;
Or a Diezel 4x12 with either V30s or H 65s.

Right now, the easiest for me to get is the Diezels. (I am in contact with the local distributor.)
I can use a fowarder for the other brands.

I am a pretty dynamic player. I avoid too much front-end compression.

 

[Rdodson]

Moreso than the difference the transformer setting makes is the remarkable difference in sound some speakers have (same model) in 8ohm and 16ohm versions.

the ohms thing makes no difference unless you are doing the mismatch thing (like running and 8ohm cab at 4 ohms at the head) then you can really hear differences, usually none sound as good as using the right ohms

That's not entirely accurate. 16 ohm load from 16 ohm amp output = full winding of the output transformer. 8 ohm load from 8 ohm tap = half of the out put transformer's winding. So that will yield a sonic difference. 16 ohm = more dynamic range in terms of lows and highs. 8 ohm = less dynamic range, but thicker and slightly tighter tracking (in my experience and others).

 

[Ventura]

Loaded my Friedman cab with the H75's. So good. The perfect speaker for me. It's like someone took the low end from a T75 and the mids from a Greenback and added a touch of sparkle on top.

That's about the best description out there on the H75s.

 

[jeff5]

I tried both in my Fryette 2X12 and I though the 75 was better for heavier stuff as well. The 65 didn't seem to have the umph. That being said, I really missed something about V30s so went back to them. I may try or mix in the creambacks again some day, but my Friedman 4X12 with greenbacks/V30s is just so darn good sounding to me right now.