Jackson Soloist Custom Shop Polyurethane Finish

[halford]

hey guys, been meaning to ask this for a while and while you guys are talking about it you guys might be able to help with some questions. esspesh sah5150 im sure

i dont know much about "finishing" on guitars. but i want to get my charvel (one of the new series) repainted. is there any speacial finish (the clear cost) that needs to be done? i have had guitars done before (from panel and paint car garages), but this thread reminds me to ask the experts. what i have got done before is great. however just wanted to ask if there is any speacial finish that i should used?

hope that makes sense

For a home job, basically, you have to decide between an automotive urethane or Nitrocelulose Lacquer. Nitro takes longer to dry and is not as hard. Over time the finish ages, changes and checks. Some people think guitars sound better with a thin nitro finish. The automotive urethanes dry fast, are hard as hell and won't change much with age.

If you want to use nitrocellulose lacquer for the base color, ReRanch makes a great Nitro clear (as mentioned above) in addition to everything else you need for a nitro finish.

If you want to use an automotive urethane for the color, I like SprayMax 2K urethane clear. It is a two part catalyzed clear that cures fast and hard as hell.

If you are using any of this stuff, you need a respirator.

Steve

Awesome Steve, great info.

I will stick to what he (automotive guy) did last time. just seeing what the difference was, if any !

 

[neilli]

Interesting - Maybe Jackson use oil based urethanes then because whites are the only colours which state urethane in the custom select spec sheet?

Why would they do that? Oil-based polyurethane is gonna yellow. If they don't want it to yellow, Polyester or water-based Polyurethane is the way to go...

No idea at all - that's what the sheet says though, and that's what I've been told by them in the past. Lee at GMW too - if you want 'white white' you need to go for urethane..

 

[glip22]

Interesting - Maybe Jackson use oil based urethanes then because whites are the only colours which state urethane in the custom select spec sheet?

Why would they do that? Oil-based polyurethane is gonna yellow. If they don't want it to yellow, Polyester or water-based Polyurethane is the way to go...

No idea at all - that's what the sheet says though, and that's what I've been told by them in the past. Lee at GMW too - if you want 'white white' you need to go for urethane..

Me neither but the Vanilla Shake must be urethane according to Jackson. This one sounds friggin great!

 

[SpiderWars]

FWIW, I'm having a Chubtone built and getting the Nitro Vanilla Shake. Curt contacted me and warned that it would yellow over time. And if I have this right, he mentioned that in order to do the Vanilla Shake that it had to be thicker than other nitro finishes so I likely wouldn't get any benefit of a thin finish. I still went with nitro though, I actually like some yellowing (lol, French Vanilla Shake).

My reasoning was that laquer somehow still has an appearance of wood underneath where poly has an appearance of 'could be anything underneath'. Dumb reason yes but it is what it is.

 

[PWE Amplification]

Hmmm... my understanding is that you wouldn't hear any difference in tone between two guitars because of a polyurethane vs polyester finish. The polyurethane will wear somewhat more like nitrocellulose lacquer, whereas the polyester won't, but both polyurethanes and polyesters they use on guitars today cure fast and are very hard. The urethanes they use on guitars aren't like what you find at the local hardware store - they are super fast curing and can be shot like polyesters...

Are you sure it wasn't a nitrocellulose finish? They shoot them so much thinner, people say they hear a tonal difference...

I wouldn't think the differences you heard were from the paint if it was really just polyester vs. polyurethane, just better wood, or other factors...

Steve

Polyurethane cannot be shot like polyester and does not cure in the same manner. I'm talking about catalyzed polyurethane not the stuff from the hardware store. The original Jackson guitars were sprayed with a polyurethane topcoat.

 

[sytharnia1560]

you don't get tone differences from different clearcoats. I once got told by a guy in a guitarshop that a white painted guitar sounds different to black paint one No 2 pieces of wood sound exactly the same

 

[Anonymous]

Hmmm... my understanding is that you wouldn't hear any difference in tone between two guitars because of a polyurethane vs polyester finish. The polyurethane will wear somewhat more like nitrocellulose lacquer, whereas the polyester won't, but both polyurethanes and polyesters they use on guitars today cure fast and are very hard. The urethanes they use on guitars aren't like what you find at the local hardware store - they are super fast curing and can be shot like polyesters...

Are you sure it wasn't a nitrocellulose finish? They shoot them so much thinner, people say they hear a tonal difference...

I wouldn't think the differences you heard were from the paint if it was really just polyester vs. polyurethane, just better wood, or other factors...

Steve

Polyurethane cannot be shot like polyester and does not cure in the same manner. I'm talking about catalyzed polyurethane not the stuff from the hardware store. The original Jackson guitars were sprayed with a polyurethane topcoat.

How is shooting them different? I've shot catalyzed urethane clear from a rattle can (SpayMax 2K Clear) and it was the same as shooting nitro.

Steve

 

[PWE Amplification]

Hmmm... my understanding is that you wouldn't hear any difference in tone between two guitars because of a polyurethane vs polyester finish. The polyurethane will wear somewhat more like nitrocellulose lacquer, whereas the polyester won't, but both polyurethanes and polyesters they use on guitars today cure fast and are very hard. The urethanes they use on guitars aren't like what you find at the local hardware store - they are super fast curing and can be shot like polyesters...

Are you sure it wasn't a nitrocellulose finish? They shoot them so much thinner, people say they hear a tonal difference...

I wouldn't think the differences you heard were from the paint if it was really just polyester vs. polyurethane, just better wood, or other factors...

Steve

Polyurethane cannot be shot like polyester and does not cure in the same manner. I'm talking about catalyzed polyurethane not the stuff from the hardware store. The original Jackson guitars were sprayed with a polyurethane topcoat.

How is shooting them different? I've shot catalyzed urethane clear from a rattle can (SpayMax 2K Clear) and it was the same as shooting nitro.

Steve

Polyester is completely different in terms of solids content, the way it cures, build thickness and hardness. Polyester is not sprayed with overlapping bands like nitro and polyurethane are and it continues to level out until the catalyst kicks in. Polyurethane will dry by evaporation first and will become dry to the touch long before it cures and that's why it is similar to nitro when you spray it.

 

[halford]

hey guys, been meaning to ask this for a while and while you guys are talking about it you guys might be able to help with some questions. esspesh sah5150 im sure

i dont know much about "finishing" on guitars. but i want to get my charvel (one of the new series) repainted. is there any speacial finish (the clear cost) that needs to be done? i have had guitars done before (from panel and paint car garages), but this thread reminds me to ask the experts. what i have got done before is great. however just wanted to ask if there is any speacial finish that i should used?

hope that makes sense

For a home job, basically, you have to decide between an automotive urethane or Nitrocelulose Lacquer. Nitro takes longer to dry and is not as hard. Over time the finish ages, changes and checks. Some people think guitars sound better with a thin nitro finish. The automotive urethanes dry fast, are hard as hell and won't change much with age.

If you want to use nitrocellulose lacquer for the base color, ReRanch makes a great Nitro clear (as mentioned above) in addition to everything else you need for a nitro finish.

If you want to use an automotive urethane for the color, I like SprayMax 2K urethane clear. It is a two part catalyzed clear that cures fast and hard as hell.

If you are using any of this stuff, you need a respirator.

Steve

Awesome Steve, great info.

I will stick to what he (automotive guy) did last time. just seeing what the difference was, if any !

Hey one more question, do i need a primer ? im about to take the guitar in next week i found someone finally to do it. Cant rerember what another guy did with my last guitar i got painted. i will take that in for him to check it out, has some dents and chips so hopefully can see how the last one was done.